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California now leads the nation in job creation, projected $1 billion surplus

Dittohead not! said:
Really? They've proposed a system like they have in Spain, where the health care providers are employees of the government?
Or, have they just proposed to make the government the ultimate single and bypass the bloated insurance industry?
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the govt. being the single payer gives them the control over the dollars and you don't have a problem with that especially after they have done so well controlling our debt? Why on earth would you ever give a bureaucrat that helped create the current 20 trillion dollar debt more money to waste, I mean spend?
 
Conservative said:
the govt. being the single payer gives them the control over the dollars and you don't have a problem with that especially after they have done so well controlling our debt? Why on earth would you ever give a bureaucrat that helped create the current 20 trillion dollar debt more money to waste, I mean spend?
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If our government is so incompetent it can't do what every other government in the world has done, then it's time for some serious reform, and not just of the health care system.
 
jet57 said:
That's why we keep electing Jerry Brown; he knows his stuff, he doesn't put up with right-wing crap and he knows what people want.

The right-wing states take more federal money have higher poverty rates than any others, but of course the right-wing knows how to run things.
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Interesting fact I am gonna throw at you.

The "National Poverty Rate" is largely a sham. Because it looks only at average incomes, and not standard of living.

People in California often laugh at the "poverty of Alabama", and do not understand that they are actually the ones living in poverty. And yea, I have lived in both states.

I left LA in 2003, where I made $20 an hour and barely kept my head above water. $5 a gallon gas, $120 a month car insurance, $800 a month rent (that was for a room). I finally got tired of it all, and when a chance came to move to Alabama I jumped at it.

Where I then made a whopping $12, making me actually very well off in the area. However, my rent was only $250 a month (I rented the South half of a duplex), and my normal expenses (gas, insurance, utilities, state income taxes, etc) were less than half what I was paying in California. In short I made half as much and lived off of that twice as well.

And if Moonbeam is such an awesome Governor, explain the fiasco with Oroville Dam then please.
 
Dittohead not! said:
If our government is so incompetent it can't do what every other government in the world has done, then it's time for some serious reform, and not just of the health care system.
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Look, stop trying to compare our country with others, 323 million people and 50 independent states compares to what worldwide
 
Conservative said:
Look, stop trying to compare our country with others, 323 million people and 50 independent states compares to what worldwide
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Yeah!

I mean no other countries know the true freedom you experience as America.

If the healthcare system is too expensive, too inefficient and bankrupts families by the boatload to make a fat cat at an HMO filthy rich, well that's just called F.R.E.E.D.O.M!

Glory Glory Hallelujah!
 
Jetboogieman said:
Yeah!

I mean no other countries know the true freedom you experience as America.

If the healthcare system is too expensive, too inefficient and bankrupts families by the boatload to make a fat cat at an HMO filthy rich, well that's just called F.R.E.E.D.O.M!

Glory Glory Hallelujah!
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Oh, my, another foreigner who doesn't get it, we have 50 states with different cost of living and different tax structures so tell me how you implement a one size fits all program in that economic environment? There is a reason that healthcare costs are expensive, why don't you figure it out and then address those reasons, not what you and the rest of the left did with things like ACA? Like far too many, stop thinking only with your heart and realize healthcare is a personal responsibility and state expense not a Federal expense. The states have handled the problem and those that haven't need pressure from their citizens, not the Federal Govt. We have a shortfall in Medicare for the exact reason I don't support a single payer for everyone, the universal budget. Figure out what that is and get back to me
 
Oozlefinch said:
Much of that is because of the state itself.

Trust me, Yesterday I finally opened my computer store (3 days late). Just a small operation, my wife and myself. Yet still I had to spend around $1k just in permits and the like before I could open. And it will be quite a while before I can even hope to break even.

And if I did decide to hire somebody, it would cost me $10.50 an hour (plus). In an area where you can rent an apartment for less than $700 a month.

The biggest problem in smaller rural areas is that the wages are driven by cities like SF-LA-Sac. What is starvation wages there is barely affordable for a business up here. The grocery store across the street is run by the owner and her husband. Each takes turns running it, because they could not afford employees any more. I can not even afford employees, but have one on standby in the event I am deployed.

Myself, I have long been a supporter of local wage limits, not nation-state wide limits. What is good for New York is not good for Alabama. What is good for San Francisco is not good for Weeds. And with the state wage eventually going up to $15 an hour expect things to get worse. Because few businesses up here can afford that kind of wage and stay competitive.

I bet if they exempted "Jefferson" from the state minimum wages, a lot of businesses would move up here, especially for manufacturing. But when you are forced to pay higher wages state wide, why move? Especially since you may be grandfathered in for a great many things now, but a move might require you to conform to things like putting aside a huge fund to save the purple headed buck rat, which was last seen in the area in 1940.
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Liberals don't understand business. All they understand is liberal talking points which they believe apply to everyone everywhere equally. It is their opinion that you and that grocery store across the street don't know how to run a business and as such you should go out of business so that the Walmarts and Best Buys can take over and liberals can force them to pay a living wage. You are nothing but collateral damage.
 
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jonny5 said:
Largest wealth creators in Cali are oil, banks, pharma, and then IT. Hardly the bastion of liberal economic success. You basically have a bunch of capitalist pigs trying to outrun the liberal takers. Success for now but how long can it last?
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It's amazing what total hypocrites they are. There is also probably more income inequality in California than any other state and more homelessness and more people needing government help in order to survive.
 
Conservative said:
Can you explain why the only true liberal part of the state is the coastal areas where the big population centers are and the agricultural part of the state is mostly red?
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Ouch. The truth hurts.
 
Conservative said:
Ignoring the 400 PLUS billion in debt, the highest number of people in poverty in the country, among the highest cost of living in the nation and touting a 1 billion dollar budget surplus doesn't meet with reality
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California's success is off the backs of the oppressed poor who are trodden on more than in any other state. Income inequality is rampant. This is the liberal way.
 
Dittohead not! said:
If our government is so incompetent it can't do what every other government in the world has done, then it's time for some serious reform, and not just of the health care system.
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We need the reform of making government smaller.
 
Dittohead not! said:
So, why don't we elect small government conservatives ever?
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Because there aren't any running. Not enough to make a difference anyway. We already know that Democrats are not for smaller government.
 
Moderate Right said:
Because there aren't any running. Not enough to make a difference anyway. We already know that Democrats are not for smaller government.
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and neither are Republicans. The difference is that Republicans pay lip service to smaller government, and Democrats don't.
 
That is good to see CA start to get its spending in order.
" California has come a long way to dig itself out of budget deficits, but the state remains on shaky ground due to nearly $400 billion in unfunded liabilities and debt from public pensions, retiree health care and bonds, financial analysts say.
“Yes, the state’s budget is balanced if you are looking at what they are required to spend cash on this year, but not when you look at their expenses,” said Gabe Petek, a credit analyst with Standard & Poor’s."
California?s $400 billion debt worries analysts - San Francisco Chronicle

Yet, they remain 400 billion in debt.
 
Dittohead not! said:
and neither are Republicans. The difference is that Republicans pay lip service to smaller government, and Democrats don't.
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I agree with that, except for the fact that when one side is obviously for bigger government then voting for lip service is better than voting for a 100% sure thing of what I don't want. This is why Trump won. He went to three blue states who were losing jobs and gave them lip service while all Hillary did was tell them that she would be an Obama third term. And you guys think it was actually Comey or the Russians.
 
Moderate Right said:
I agree with that, except for the fact that when one side is obviously for bigger government then voting for lip service is better than voting for a 100% sure thing of what I don't want. This is why Trump won. He went to three blue states who were losing jobs and gave them lip service while all Hillary did was tell them that she would be an Obama third term. And you guys think it was actually Comey or the Russians.
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I'm not sure how many guys you think I am.

Lip service is better than stating your real position on an issue? Really? I suppose in the upside down world of 21st. century politics, you're right. People do tend to vote for the positions that candidates say that they have, regardless of reality.
 
Dittohead not! said:
I'm not sure how many guys you think I am.

Lip service is better than stating your real position on an issue? Really? I suppose in the upside down world of 21st. century politics, you're right. People do tend to vote for the positions that candidates say that they have, regardless of reality.
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All I'm saying is that when voters are presented with someone who definitely does not share their values then you vote against that person. There is certainly no reason to vote for anyone who you obviously disagree with. In the case of Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania where voters were worried about losing jobs and all Hillary can say is that she will be an Obama third term, then you vote for the other candidate, which is exactly what happened.
 
Moderate Right said:
All I'm saying is that when voters are presented with someone who definitely does not share their values then you vote against that person. There is certainly no reason to vote for anyone who you obviously disagree with. In the case of Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania where voters were worried about losing jobs and all Hillary can say is that she will be an Obama third term, then you vote for the other candidate, which is exactly what happened.
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Agreed, that's what happened.

The problem is, what candidates say they intend to do and what they actually do are two different things.

And Trump is a master at making people believe that he agrees with their point of view, all the while spouting total nonsense. Romney was right: Trump is a fraud, a conman. He has sold the country a bill of goods.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Agreed, that's what happened.

The problem is, what candidates say they intend to do and what they actually do are two different things.

And Trump is a master at making people believe that he agrees with their point of view, all the while spouting total nonsense. Romney was right: Trump is a fraud, a conman. He has sold the country a bill of goods.
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But we really don't know that yet. So far, it is just an opinion. Time will tell what the real truth is. Nobody actually has a working crystal ball but many on both sides claim that they do.
 
Bob Blaylock said:
I'm not implying anything. I'm outright stating it.

The OP is horrendously ignorant about the situation here in California. He doesn't live here, and he has no ideas what it is like to live here, under the mess that currently exists here.
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I guess you are not smart enough to start a $250mm business like my cal daughter. Educated and smart people always never had it so good . Easy really.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Actually, California ranks #17 in total taxes.

What happens when farmers have to start paying their field workers $15 an hour? Well, a lot of them already are, in order to get the best workers, but if/when that happens, the rest of the country will pay a bit more for fruit.
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Tax per $1000 is not the same as how much GDP the state takes. Which puts Cali 4th. And the point was not whether WE will pay, but whether businesses will even stay in business. Or california.
 
Moderate Right said:
It's amazing what total hypocrites they are. There is also probably more income inequality in California than any other state and more homelessness and more people needing government help in order to survive.
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I bet the politicians and bureaucrats are wealthy though.
 
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