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The 2nd Amendment applies to all weapons.

So you think people should be able to get weaponized smallpox?

Seriously?

Dieses of all kinds have been weaponized and used throughout recorded history and before. You can make a law against it and that would make it De Jure but not De Facto. The 2nd makes it clear any weapon is available to you. Until there is an amendment otherwise.
 
Dieses of all kinds have been weaponized and used throughout recorded history and before. You can make a law against it and that would make it De Jure but not De Facto. The 2nd makes it clear any weapon is available to you. Until there is an amendment otherwise.

There is absolutely no reason for anyone to have bioweapons and thank god no one has been dumb enough to allow it. They have no civilian purpose; weaponized smallpox can't be used to "defend your home" or to hunt, for instance.
 
True, but 'all other weaponry' is pretty much irrelevant because who carries swords around these days.
 
A virus is a living organism, it is not protected by the second amendment. Nuclear fallout is a toxic material, not a weapon.

Bullets are not weapons, so they can be regulated?
 
The way I see it, the second amendment should apply to all objects which are required to enforce the law. That is, the second amendment should be interpreted as specifically protecting whichever objects are the means of enforcing the law, not as specifically protecting any particular objects.

Back when the constitution was written, there was no standard police force as we now know it. Every town had a sheriff, and the sheriff organized the town folk to enforce the law when necessary. If the town folk had no right to the means of enforcing the law, then the law could not be enforced. If the laws of a polity cannot be enforced, then that polity is insecure. Therefore, the second amendment exists to assure that civilians have access to the means of enforcing the law.

Yeah... given that the Sheriff was a royal official responsible for keeping the peace on behalf of the king, I don't think our revolutionary founding fathers envisioned the 2nd amendment the way you are describing.
 
They cannot. They are required for a firearm to work. It's a part of a firearm. So it's protected by 2A
 
To put very simply, the wording of the 2nd Amendment applies to all forms of weaponry, based on the language of the 2nd Amendment.

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.
lol

You left a few things out.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
(Emphasis added)

Anyway. Even when you deliberately ignore literally half of the 2nd Amendment (which, yeah, you did): The simple fact is that rights are not unlimited. For example, the right to freedom of speech does not mean you can defame someone; the right to uphold your own religious practices does not mean you can neglect your child and refuse medical treatment; the requirement for police to need a warrant does not include situations where the police are in hot pursuit of a suspect or if you're smoking a crack pipe right next to an open window, and so on.

As a result, there are all sorts of legal restrictions on a variety of weapons, including knives, tasers, brass knuckles, expandable batons, cesti, whatever.
 
To put very simply, the wording of the 2nd Amendment applies to all forms of weaponry, based on the language of the 2nd Amendment.

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.

The 2nd Amendment here very clearly says 'Arms,' which means weaponry. Not FIREarms, which refers to guns.

Agreed.... but would you agree that the right to keep and bear arms isn't an unlimited right?

The 1st Amendment's freedom of speech doesn't give you the right to commit slander or incite violence. Freedom of religion doesn't give you the right to sacrifice your first-born. We as a society agree that there are reasonable limitations on every right enumerated within the Constitution... so why should it be any different where it comes to the right to keep and bear arms?

Just because a Stinger missile is technically a weapon doesn't mean they should be privately owned, does it?
 
lol

You left a few things out.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
(Emphasis added)

Anyway. Even when you deliberately ignore literally half of the 2nd Amendment (which, yeah, you did): The simple fact is that rights are not unlimited. For example, the right to freedom of speech does not mean you can defame someone; the right to uphold your own religious practices does not mean you can neglect your child and refuse medical treatment; the requirement for police to need a warrant does not include situations where the police are in hot pursuit of a suspect or if you're smoking a crack pipe right next to an open window, and so on.

As a result, there are all sorts of legal restrictions on a variety of weapons, including knives, tasers, brass knuckles, expandable batons, cesti, whatever.

Good post.... it's never failed to amaze me how the very same people who beat their chests and call themselves "strict constructionists" conveniently ignore the prefatory clause of the 2nd Amendment. It seems pretty obvious to me that the Founding Fathers intended it to be included (despite the fact that Madison's original draft didn't have it) and for that very fact alone, it ought to have some bearing on the right to keep and bear arms. Arguing that the prefatory clause is just so many "wasted words" and that the right to keep and bear arms has the same scope with it as it would without it is a pretty bizarre spin on original intent, don't you think?
 
No, and neither would extremely powerful bombs IE Nukes. These are weapons that harm innocent people...


Wait, US history is littered with innocent people being killed and maimed by guns.
 
lol

You left a few things out.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
(Emphasis added)

Anyway. Even when you deliberately ignore literally half of the 2nd Amendment (which, yeah, you did): The simple fact is that rights are not unlimited. For example, the right to freedom of speech does not mean you can defame someone; the right to uphold your own religious practices does not mean you can neglect your child and refuse medical treatment; the requirement for police to need a warrant does not include situations where the police are in hot pursuit of a suspect or if you're smoking a crack pipe right next to an open window, and so on.

As a result, there are all sorts of legal restrictions on a variety of weapons, including knives, tasers, brass knuckles, expandable batons, cesti, whatever.

If you take into consideration that the bill of rights was intended to restrain the power of government. At the time there was no standing national army. There was only small state militia. The first part of the 2nd amendment (A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State) makes more sense. This statement was giving the federal government the authority to regulate the state militias while still limiting the government authority to limit or regulate the weapons (arms) of individuals. If they wanted limit gun ownership to the. militia it would read (A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, , the right of the state militia to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.) But the used the word the people instead of state milia.


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If all the statements in amendment applied to each other. Then freedom of speech would only be valid while talking about religion on some form of media to Arrange a peaceable assembly so everyone could petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


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Dieses of all kinds have been weaponized and used throughout recorded history and before. You can make a law against it and that would make it De Jure but not De Facto. The 2nd makes it clear any weapon is available to you. Until there is an amendment otherwise.

you and I disagree on this and I doubt we will ever change the other's mind. The second amendment was based on the natural right of self defense, and some weapons have zero utility in that area. Secondly, the term arms-as the writings and speeches of the founders indicated, are individual weapons citizens normally would keep and bear. Weaponized anthrax or ICBMs do not qualify either way.
 
If you take into consideration that the bill of rights was intended to restrain the power of government. At the time there was no standing national army. There was only small state militia. The first part of the 2nd amendment (A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State) makes more sense. This statement was giving the federal government the authority to regulate the state militias while still limiting the government authority to limit or regulate the weapons (arms) of individuals. If they wanted limit gun ownership to the. militia it would read (A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, , the right of the state militia to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.) But the used the word the people instead of state milia.


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Anti gun rights advocates such as Visbeck, try to pretend the first part of the second was designed to limit a right that the founders believed pre existed government and was endowed to man by the creator. That alone destroys the tripe he and other anti gun advocates try to proffer. The reason why it is tripe is this:

the founders believed man had the right to self defense-and with it the arms to effectuate that right and this right existed PRIOR to the existence of government. When gun restrictionists pretend that the right is limited by membership in a "well regulated militia", they demonstrate a complete failure to understand and admit the intent of the founders.

YOU CANNOT possibly claim a right that pre-exists government and which was recognized by the second, requires membership in a government control entity to vest.
 
It was mostly to spark a debate with people who believe it only applies to guns. Also the leftist weirdos that think it only applies to muskets or should be repealed.

It applies to all weapons useful for individual self defense and which citizens would normally keep and bear

weapons designed to target areas or large numbers of people do not qualify either way
 
you and I disagree on this and I doubt we will ever change the other's mind. The second amendment was based on the natural right of self defense, and some weapons have zero utility in that area. Secondly, the term arms-as the writings and speeches of the founders indicated, are individual weapons citizens normally would keep and bear. Weaponized anthrax or ICBMs do not qualify either way.

You are right we disagree and there is evidence for both points of view. However the definition of arms is quite plain and has remained the same since before the constitution was enacted. Further is the point that heavily armed civilian warships were utilized by our government to hunt down pirates, and further was the fact that more cannons were in civilian hands than government at the time of enactment as well. It is only recently because of the NRA specifically compromising on the 1934 firearms act and others that we have the mess we have. Whether you like it or not arms is NOT just firearms. The term encompasses the entire scope of what can be used. The founders could have been far more specific. They weren't. Thats all I need to know. By the way the mere fact that there is a clause in the Constitution allowing congress to hire privateers and issue letters of Mark and Reprisal, should tell you everything you need to know about how well armed citizens in the beginning were and what kind of arms the civilians Congress was allowed to hire as privateers had.

Speaking of privateers, its time we started issuing letters of mark and reprisal again to hunt down our terrorist and cartel friends. They have plenty of money of which it would be lucrative to rob them of. Its time terrorism and drug smuggling paid literally. Typical arraignment would be the privateer would liquidate or capture said pirate or terrorist and confiscate their property and money of which a percentage went to Uncle Sam as sponsor of the letter of Mark and Reprisal. They generally had specific targets of which privateers could hunt.
 
While I agree that no citizens should have access to weapons of mass destruction the intent of the 2nd amendment was to cover all arms. Our founding fathers put checks and balance in every aspect of our government with the intent of limiting the power of the federal government. They did this because they feared falling under a tyrants government again. The final and greatest check and balance was armed citizens. With this I mind there is no doubt that they intended to cover all arms, all weapons.


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If you take into consideration that the bill of rights was intended to restrain the power of government. At the time there was no standing national army. There was only small state militia. The first part of the 2nd amendment (A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State) makes more sense. This statement was giving the federal government the authority to regulate the state militias while still limiting the government authority to limit or regulate the weapons (arms) of individuals.
Ooooh, so close.

The Bill of Rights was intended to restrict the federal government, not the state governments. The concern was primarily connected with incidents like the attempt by the British government to seize militia arms at Concord (which sparked the first real battle of the Revolutionary War). The Bill of Rights did not in any way restrict the individual states, until after the 14th Amendment incorporated those rights to the states and the courts recognized this. For the 2nd Amendment, that did not happen until 2010.

In other words, the 2nd Amendment was not intended to provide a blanket protection for gun rights. The intention was to prevent the federal government from interfering with the ability of the official state militias to do its job. The right to bear arms was explicitly protected in connection with the militias, as noted in rulings like Cruikshank and Presser. For centuries the 2nd Amendment was not seen as protecting any individual rights to bear arms, and that claim is basically an ahistorical fabrication of the pro-gun movement, foisted on the nation (with little practical effect, fortunately) by Scalia.

When you know this, you should realize that it is legally unacceptable to ignore the first half of the 2nd Amendment, which is exactly what Coyuga did. Not that it matters, because again, the right to bear arms is not unlimited, and even when you do ignore half the language of the amendment, the government is legitimately empowered to regulate weapons other than firearms.
 
Ooooh, so close.

The Bill of Rights was intended to restrict the federal government, not the state governments. The concern was primarily connected with incidents like the attempt by the British government to seize militia arms at Concord (which sparked the first real battle of the Revolutionary War). The Bill of Rights did not in any way restrict the individual states, until after the 14th Amendment incorporated those rights to the states and the courts recognized this. For the 2nd Amendment, that did not happen until 2010.

In other words, the 2nd Amendment was not intended to provide a blanket protection for gun rights. The intention was to prevent the federal government from interfering with the ability of the official state militias to do its job. The right to bear arms was explicitly protected in connection with the militias, as noted in rulings like Cruikshank and Presser. For centuries the 2nd Amendment was not seen as protecting any individual rights to bear arms, and that claim is basically an ahistorical fabrication of the pro-gun movement, foisted on the nation (with little practical effect, fortunately) by Scalia.

When you know this, you should realize that it is legally unacceptable to ignore the first half of the 2nd Amendment, which is exactly what Coyuga did. Not that it matters, because again, the right to bear arms is not unlimited, and even when you do ignore half the language of the amendment, the government is legitimately empowered to regulate weapons other than firearms.

People such as you, and those who argue as you do, have never ever explained how a right the founders both believed and intended to apply to individuals, since the beginning of time, would require membership in a state organized entity, for that right to vest. My only conclusion is you avoid that point, because it destroys the militia "rights"nonsense that anti gun activists have conjured up to support their anti gun schemes.
 
While I agree that no citizens should have access to weapons of mass destruction the intent of the 2nd amendment was to cover all arms. Our founding fathers put checks and balance in every aspect of our government with the intent of limiting the power of the federal government. They did this because they feared falling under a tyrants government again. The final and greatest check and balance was armed citizens. With this I mind there is no doubt that they intended to cover all arms, all weapons.


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I disagree. Arms was a specific term that meant individual weapons, not artillery, not ordnance.
 
The 2nd Amendment applies to any weapons a militiaman might reasonably be expected to own.
 
Ooooh, so close.

The Bill of Rights was intended to restrict the federal government, not the state governments. The concern was primarily connected with incidents like the attempt by the British government to seize militia arms at Concord (which sparked the first real battle of the Revolutionary War). The Bill of Rights did not in any way restrict the individual states, until after the 14th Amendment incorporated those rights to the states and the courts recognized this. For the 2nd Amendment, that did not happen until 2010.

In other words, the 2nd Amendment was not intended to provide a blanket protection for gun rights. The intention was to prevent the federal government from interfering with the ability of the official state militias to do its job. The right to bear arms was explicitly protected in connection with the militias, as noted in rulings like Cruikshank and Presser. For centuries the 2nd Amendment was not seen as protecting any individual rights to bear arms, and that claim is basically an ahistorical fabrication of the pro-gun movement, foisted on the nation (with little practical effect, fortunately) by Scalia.

When you know this, you should realize that it is legally unacceptable to ignore the first half of the 2nd Amendment, which is exactly what Coyuga did. Not that it matters, because again, the right to bear arms is not unlimited, and even when you do ignore half the language of the amendment, the government is legitimately empowered to regulate weapons other than firearms.
I love how leftists play fast and loose with the Constitution and rights.

So...you are saying that all states have the right to impose rules and restrictions on gay marriage, rights for homosexuals and transgendered indivifuals, etc....right?
 
lol

You left a few things out.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
(Emphasis added)

Anyway. Even when you deliberately ignore literally half of the 2nd Amendment (which, yeah, you did): The simple fact is that rights are not unlimited. For example, the right to freedom of speech does not mean you can defame someone; the right to uphold your own religious practices does not mean you can neglect your child and refuse medical treatment; the requirement for police to need a warrant does not include situations where the police are in hot pursuit of a suspect or if you're smoking a crack pipe right next to an open window, and so on.

As a result, there are all sorts of legal restrictions on a variety of weapons, including knives, tasers, brass knuckles, expandable batons, cesti, whatever.
I agree completely...the preamble to the right of the individual MUST be included. The preamble SPECIFICALLY dictates that the people MUST have the right to keep and bear military grade firearms in the support of the militia if needed. THAT is why 'the people' have the right to keep and bear fully automatic weapons.
 
If you take into consideration that the bill of rights was intended to restrain the power of government. At the time there was no standing national army. There was only small state militia. The first part of the 2nd amendment (A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State) makes more sense. This statement was giving the federal government the authority to regulate the state militias while still limiting the government authority to limit or regulate the weapons (arms) of individuals. If they wanted limit gun ownership to the. militia it would read (A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, , the right of the state militia to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.) But the used the word the people instead of state milia.


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Its OK. He knows better. He knows that no one is REALLY foolish enough to believe the Bill of Rights was written to protect STATE government entities. That wont stop him and people like him from making ridiculous arguments...but they DO know better.
 
To put very simply, the wording of the 2nd Amendment applies to all forms of weaponry, based on the language of the 2nd Amendment.

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.

The 2nd Amendment here very clearly says 'Arms,' which means weaponry. Not FIREarms, which refers to guns.

Correct. The 2nd Amendment re-affirms our natural right to self-defense. There is no constitutional limit on which forms of weaponry may be used to achieve self-defense... Obviously, some weaponry choices are much more practical/impractical than others...
 
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