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Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?[W:135]

Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
What you explained is irrelevant as it is your opinion. Fact is that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is not an official part of the Constitution.
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Not it's not an opinion. It's a fact. Your take is an opinion.

Sorry Don, it's only a windmill, you'll have to claw for some other argument to try and violate the rights of gun owners.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
Nor is that opinion part of the Constitution either.

What was Madison' official position when he wrote that report in 1800?
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Madison is the author of the BOR, it does not matter what his postion is......stop grasping at straws
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
Either the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is part of the Constitution or it is NOT. Do you agree on that?
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I think that depends on what the definition of "is" is. But I don't know why the question is important, except as a point of historical interest. If you know of any Supreme Court case that depended in any way on the Court's interpretation of the Preamble to the Bill of Rights, I'd like to see that case.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

matchlight said:
I think that depends on what the definition of "is" is. But I don't know why the question is important, except as a point of historical interest. If you know of any Supreme Court case that depended in any way on the Court's interpretation of the Preamble to the Bill of Rights, I'd like to see that case.
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One cannot discuss the Constitution unless one knows what the contents of the Constitution are.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

Master PO said:
Madison is the author of the BOR, it does not matter what his postion is......stop grasping at straws
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What was Madison's official position when he wrote that report in 1800 giving us his opinion?
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
What was Madison's official position when he wrote that report in 1800 giving us his opinion?
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your line of thought is ridiculous

its the same as saying Margaret Mitchell only has opinion about the book "Gone with the Wind", even though she wrote it.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
And if it does not exist as ratified and part of the Constitution because it was never submitted or ratified then it IS NOT part of the official US Constitution.
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Look at the coming-out moment. :lol:
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
In various discussions, people have brought up the fact that there was a Preamble that was written that went with the first twelve proposed Amendments to the US Constitution. We know that ten were ratified and became known as The Bill of Rights. Does anyone have verifiable evidence that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights was ever ratified by enough states to become an official part of the US Constitution?




If so, please present it here.[/FONT][/COLOR]
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The Preamble is an introduction to the amendments as submitted. I don't think that it would be ratified as such, other than to be included. This line is interesting though:
in order to prevent misconstruction or abuse of its powers, that further declaratory and restrictive clauses should be added: And as extending the ground of public confidence in the Government, will best insure the beneficent ends of its institution.
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Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

Madison 1800 report

In pursuance of the wishes thus expressed, the first Congress that assembled under the Constitution proposed certain amendments, which have since, by the necessary ratifications, been made a part of it; among which amendments is the article containing, among other prohibitions on the Congress, an express declaration that they should make no law abridging the freedom of the press.

Translation:the first congress under the constitution proposed the amendments, the BOR, which have since been made part of the constitution, which among the amendments in the artile are prohibitions on congress by express declaration that they should make no law abridging freedom of speech/press



its very clear, the congress is prohibited from making any laws concerning religion, speech, association, militias of states, the bearing of firearms by the people to name a few.
 
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Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

Master PO said:
your line of thought is ridiculous

its the same as saying Margaret Mitchell only has opinion about the book "Gone with the Wind", even though she wrote it.
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I have no doubt Ms. Mitchell had many opinions about her book. That is irrelevant however.

Why are you so afraid to answer two very simple questions?

1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

American said:
Look at the coming-out moment. :lol:
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I have no idea what that means but do you disagree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the Constitution?
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
Why are you so afraid to answer two very simple questions?

1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?
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i already told you several times what the BOR IS..., your constant attempts to derail will not help you, after you opened a can of worms
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
I have no doubt Ms. Mitchell had many opinions about her book. That is irrelevant however.

Why are you so afraid to answer two very simple questions?

1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?
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You seem to be the one in fear; all wrapped around the axle about a preamble. Has this been a constant issue in any related forum? I don't think so, but you seem intent on making it one.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
I have no idea what that means but do you disagree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the Constitution?
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I'm uncertain.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

Master PO said:
i already told you several times what the BOR IS..., your constant attempts to derail will not help you, after you opened a can of worms
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I do not need you to tell me anything that I do not ask you about. I do find it revealing that you want to pontificate about all manner of things I never asked you about but you are impotent to answer very direct questions put to you.

1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

American said:
You seem to be the one in fear; all wrapped around the axle about a preamble. Has this been a constant issue in any related forum? I don't think so, but you seem intent on making it one.
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FEAR!?!?!?!?!? It seems you seem to be the fearful one - afraid of a simple fact of history.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
I do not need you to tell me anything that I do not ask you about. I do find it revealing that you want to pontificate about all manner of things I never asked you about but you are impotent to answer very direct questions put to you.

1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?
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again read my pasting postings, i am tired of you deflecting [by several ways] and not reading and asking the same questions over and over.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

Master PO said:
again read my pasting postings, i am tired of you deflecting [by several ways] and not reading and asking the same questions over and over.
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You have not yet answered these questions even a first time.

1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?

Number 1 requires a simple title or the name of his position.
Number 2 is a simple Yes or No.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
I have no idea what that means but do you disagree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the Constitution?
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I'm no Constitutional expert, but it seems clear to me that the 12 amendments + the preamble were sent to the states for ratification as a package to be voted on individually. Otherwise we would have 12 amendments + the preamble in the BOR. We don't. So no, the never ratified preamble is not part of the Constitution.

Why does this matter? Unless an attempt at a gotcha moment.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
FEAR!?!?!?!?!? It seems you seem to be the fearful one - afraid of a simple fact of history.
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None of my Constitutional arguments ever include a reference the preamble or the preamble itself. Therefore you are wrong.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

jimbo said:
I'm no Constitutional expert, but it seems clear to me that the 12 amendments + the preamble were sent to the states for ratification as a package to be voted on individually. Otherwise we would have 12 amendments + the preamble in the BOR. We don't. So no, the never ratified preamble is not part of the Constitution.

Why does this matter? Unless an attempt at a gotcha moment.
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It is a very simple exercise to find out what is part of the Constitution and what is not.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

American said:
None of my Constitutional arguments ever include a reference the preamble or the preamble itself. Therefore you are wrong.
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I never said a word here about your constitutional arguments. So there is nothing for me to be wrong about.
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
You have not yet answered these questions even a first time.

1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?

Number 1 requires a simple title or the name of his position.
Number 2 is a simple Yes or No.
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last time...i already told you what the preamble is..... accept it or reject it, but don't bother asking me the same question over and over in an attempt to deflect away from my postings of Madison words of the preamble
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

Master PO said:
last time...i already told you what the preamble is..... accept it or reject it, but don't bother asking me the same question over and over in an attempt to deflect away from my postings of Madison words of the preamble
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I never asked you what a preamble is. That is not what you were asked. What you were asked and what you refuse to answer is


1 - What was Madisons official position in 1800 when he wrote that report?

2 - Do you agree that the Preamble to the Bill of Rights is NOT part of the US Constitution?
 
Re: Preamble to Bil of Rights part of the Constitution?

haymarket said:
It is a very simple exercise to find out what is part of the Constitution and what is not.
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Again, why? The Constitution along with the amendments and even the relevant SC rulings, are readily available. The preamble and the forgotten two amendments are not part of the Constitution.

I, like many on this thread, question the motives of the OP. The 2nd amendment along with all the other amendments are the law of the land.
 
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