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The Mystery Gospel of Mark

Do you believe that the Gospel of Mark is the oldest written among the four Gospels?

  • Yes

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Maybe

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    1
  • Poll closed .

stan1990

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Jesus didn’t leave a written trial for his life and preaching, his childhood or the family’s escape to Egypt and the time lived there. The first Christian groups received Jesus' teachings and narratives about his life through the twelve apostles and their disciples. Paul that wrote many years before the gospels, didn’t tell much about Jesus. Paul never saw Jesus in person, but he got a vision on his way from Jerusalem to Damascus.

There is a consensus among New Testament scholars that the Gospel of Mark is the oldest among the Gospels and that it was written around 70 AD, about forty years after the death of Jesus, followed by the Gospel of Matthew and Luke between 80-100 AD, and finally the Gospel of John, which was written between 100-110 AD. However, I found a book by Enoch Powell, “The evolution of the Gospel,” contradictory to these views with a different opinion. Enoch Powell claimed that Mathew, not Mark, is the oldest among the four canonical gospels.

The Gospel of Mark authenticity as the oldest among the four gospels has created a tendency with many researchers to adopt it as a reliable source, closer to the reality when the Gospels differ among them. The problem in the Gospel of Mark is recognized by different churches and Bible editions that the ending of the Gospel(Mark 8-16) added at a later period and that it is not found in the oldest manuscripts such as the Codex Sinaiticus and codex Vaticanus. Furthermore, a letter written by Clement of Alexandria, one of the church's early fathers, directed to Theodore of Palestine mentioned that a hidden version of Mark’s Gospel exists.

There are two main differences between the Gospel of Mark and the version mentioned by Clement in his letter: the first was a paragraph added in Chapter 10, paragraphs 34-35, and the second was added in Chapter 10, paragraph 46. But paragraph 34-35 adds the account of Jesus's resurrection of Lazarus, which was mentioned only by the Gospel of John. While the second paragraph 10:46 is an addition that when Jesus Christ came to Jericho, he refused to receive women who were presented to welcome him, they are the sister of the disciple whom Jesus loved, his mother, and Salome. But Salome's personality is not unknown to the Bible traditions, she is introduced in 15:40 and 16: 1. Likewise, the incident of not receiving his mother and brothers mentioned on more than one occasion in the Gospels, even in the Gospel of Mark that is in our hands, with a difference in some details, Mark (3: 31-35), Matthew (12: 46-50) and Luke (8: 19-21).
But why was the Gospel of Saint John different from other gospels by telling the story of Jesus' resurrection of Lazarus? Perhaps it is the same purpose to hide the story from the Gospel of St. Mark, which prompted John to mention it with an alteration to the details, even though the story was not mentioned in the Gospel of Matthew and Luke, who considered that the Gospel of Mark was the main source of the narratives. These differences can be summarized from us as follows: First, the secret Gospel of Mark does not mention the name of the boy Jesus Christ resurrected from death while John mentions his name, Lazarus. Second, the secret Bible speaks of one sister he did not name while John mentioned Martha and Mary. Third, in the secret Gospel of Mark, Jesus Christ is called "the son of David," while in the Gospel of John, the two sisters call him "Lord." Fourth, in the secret Gospel of Mark, Jesus Christ rolls the stone that was covering the entrance to the grave himself, while in the Gospel of John he asks the people in the place to do so. Fifth, Jesus approaching the grave in the secret Gospel of Mark is a miracle, as Lazarus shouts, and Christ extends his hand to him and brings him out, while in the Gospel of John, Jesus suffices with directing a loud voice, as Lazarus comes out of his grave. Despite the difference in some of the details that were the result of John's attempt to narrate the incident in a manner that makes it far from the misinterpretation of heresy Gnostic sects, there are common factors that the location of the accident is the village of Bethany and that there is a woman whose brother died and asked Jesus to resurrect and that there is a person he was dead, but he got out of the grave.

The secret Gospel of Mark omitted the story of Lazarus resurrection so that it will not be abused by heretical Christian sects, as Clement mentioned in his letter to the Reverend Theodore, in response to the latter questions about some of the teachings that spread in the region and are attributed to traditions mentioned in the Gospel of Mark. But the secret Gospel of Mark is not the only mystery in the Gospels that raises many questions, but rather there are many that I will talk about in the upcoming topics.

End
 
Do you believe that the Gospel of Mark is the oldest written among the four Gospels?

How can we know?
 
No, Matthew is...
 
Jesus didn’t leave a written trial for his life and preaching, his childhood or the family’s escape to Egypt and the time lived there. The first Christian groups received Jesus' teachings and narratives about his life through the twelve apostles and their disciples. Paul that wrote many years before the gospels, didn’t tell much about Jesus. Paul never saw Jesus in person, but he got a vision on his way from Jerusalem to Damascus.

There is a consensus among New Testament scholars that the Gospel of Mark is the oldest among the Gospels and that it was written around 70 AD, about forty years after the death of Jesus, followed by the Gospel of Matthew and Luke between 80-100 AD, and finally the Gospel of John, which was written between 100-110 AD. However, I found a book by Enoch Powell, “The evolution of the Gospel,” contradictory to these views with a different opinion. Enoch Powell claimed that Mathew, not Mark, is the oldest among the four canonical gospels.

The Gospel of Mark authenticity as the oldest among the four gospels has created a tendency with many researchers to adopt it as a reliable source, closer to the reality when the Gospels differ among them. The problem in the Gospel of Mark is recognized by different churches and Bible editions that the ending of the Gospel(Mark 8-16) added at a later period and that it is not found in the oldest manuscripts such as the Codex Sinaiticus and codex Vaticanus. Furthermore, a letter written by Clement of Alexandria, one of the church's early fathers, directed to Theodore of Palestine mentioned that a hidden version of Mark’s Gospel exists.

There are two main differences between the Gospel of Mark and the version mentioned by Clement in his letter: the first was a paragraph added in Chapter 10, paragraphs 34-35, and the second was added in Chapter 10, paragraph 46. But paragraph 34-35 adds the account of Jesus's resurrection of Lazarus, which was mentioned only by the Gospel of John. While the second paragraph 10:46 is an addition that when Jesus Christ came to Jericho, he refused to receive women who were presented to welcome him, they are the sister of the disciple whom Jesus loved, his mother, and Salome. But Salome's personality is not unknown to the Bible traditions, she is introduced in 15:40 and 16: 1. Likewise, the incident of not receiving his mother and brothers mentioned on more than one occasion in the Gospels, even in the Gospel of Mark that is in our hands, with a difference in some details, Mark (3: 31-35), Matthew (12: 46-50) and Luke (8: 19-21).
But why was the Gospel of Saint John different from other gospels by telling the story of Jesus' resurrection of Lazarus? Perhaps it is the same purpose to hide the story from the Gospel of St. Mark, which prompted John to mention it with an alteration to the details, even though the story was not mentioned in the Gospel of Matthew and Luke, who considered that the Gospel of Mark was the main source of the narratives. These differences can be summarized from us as follows: First, the secret Gospel of Mark does not mention the name of the boy Jesus Christ resurrected from death while John mentions his name, Lazarus. Second, the secret Bible speaks of one sister he did not name while John mentioned Martha and Mary. Third, in the secret Gospel of Mark, Jesus Christ is called "the son of David," while in the Gospel of John, the two sisters call him "Lord." Fourth, in the secret Gospel of Mark, Jesus Christ rolls the stone that was covering the entrance to the grave himself, while in the Gospel of John.

The secret Gospel of Mark omitted the story of Lazarus resurrection so that it will not be abused by heretical Christian sects, as Clement mentioned in his letter to the Reverend Theodore, in response to the latter questions about some of the teachings that spread in the region and are attributed to traditions mentioned in the Gospel of Mark. But the secret Gospel of Mark is not the only mystery in the Gospels that raises many questions, but rather there are many that I will talk about in the upcoming topics.

End

Man, this is the easiest answer ever..

Mark was likely written by a Jew who converted either before, or during Christianity’s swap from a religion by Jews, for Jews. To a religion by romans, for romans..and Mark was used as a source...

There are just loads of discrepancies between mark and the other gospels..

Mark does not think Jesus thought he was the son of god, nor did he know his fate..

In Mark , Jesus is in shock at his crucifixion, he is silent the whole trip before shouting out “father, father why have you forsaken me!!”

By the time John was written the narrative had changed completely..

Now Jesus knows exactly what his fate will be and is comforting everyone else..



It is VERY obvious that Jesus became more of a divine being as the gospels were written..



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Why should only the Gospel of Mark be a Mystery - and the three others not?
 
How can we know?

A) it has the oldies fragments..

B) it is the farthest from the mainstream narrative..


If some scribe were going to add or subtract from the texts as he is copying them, he would not add something that did not fit the narrative he personally believed in..

For example say mark says “then Jesus slapped the little girl” and John says “then Jesus hugged the little girl.”


Well no scribe is going to change the text to say he slapped her.. Jesus slapping a little girl would be totally against the narrative they are pushing..

But a scribe might read the “slapped the little girl” part and think, “well that can’t be right!!! Jesus would never slap a little girl, I bet it is supposed to be hugged.”

It is called the doctrine of dissimilarity..

Very similar to when a witness in a crime does or does not have a reason to lie....





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Why should only the Gospel of Mark be a Mystery - and the three others not?

I personally would say that only the gospel of mark is credible. It is the only book with any chance of being from a primary source. ... it is obvious that Jesus became more and more divine as time passes..

For example in mark Jesus did not know what was going on during his crucifixion, he was shocked god was allowing it..

But John then claims Jesus knew exactly what his fate was gonna be and was comforting everyone else.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
A consensus is a speculation while almost nothing can be confirmed in terms of history (= his story).
 
Man, this is the easiest answer ever..

Mark was likely written by a Jew who converted either before, or during Christianity’s swap from a religion by Jews, for Jews. To a religion by romans, for romans..and Mark was used as a source...

There are just loads of discrepancies between mark and the other gospels..

Mark does not think Jesus thought he was the son of god, nor did he know his fate..

In Mark , Jesus is in shock at his crucifixion, he is silent the whole trip before shouting out “father, father why have you forsaken me!!”

By the time John was written the narrative had changed completely..

Now Jesus knows exactly what his fate will be and is comforting everyone else..



It is VERY obvious that Jesus became more of a divine being as the gospels were written..



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good comment
Thank you very much
 
Good comment
Thank you very much

The mainstream critical scholarly view is that Jesus was not made a divine being until his crucifixion..

See in the ancient Roman world adoption trumped your natural children..

Your natural children were a crap shoot... maybe they were trash, maybe super competent.. who knows when they are born?!?!

But you only adopted someone because you already knew they were awesome.. Mostly romans adopted adults.. and prominent families would adopt the best of the best..


So where originally it is believed they thought Jesus was adopted by god at his resurrection, as society shifted to favor natural children the fact Jesus was adopted became less cool..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I personally would say that only the gospel of mark is credible. It is the only book with any chance of being from a primary source. ... it is obvious that Jesus became more and more divine as time passes..

For example in mark Jesus did not know what was going on during his crucifixion, he was shocked god was allowing it..

But John then claims Jesus knew exactly what his fate was gonna be and was comforting everyone else.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Some early copies have different endings to 16, suggesting the possibility of interpolation.
 
Last edited:
The mainstream critical scholarly view is that Jesus was not made a divine being until his crucifixion..

See in the ancient Roman world adoption trumped your natural children..

Your natural children were a crap shoot... maybe they were trash, maybe super competent.. who knows when they are born?!?!

But you only adopted someone because you already knew they were awesome.. Mostly romans adopted adults.. and prominent families would adopt the best of the best..


So where originally it is believed they thought Jesus was adopted by god at his resurrection, as society shifted to favor natural children the fact Jesus was adopted became less cool..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And prominent Roman emperors at the time were ascending into heaven on the backs of swans (Julius [although technically not an emperor], Augustus & Claudius). It seems to have been somewhat of a 'tradition' that may have been 'appropriated' into the literature.
 
Some early copies have different endings to 16, suggesting the possibility of interpolation.

Except for the doctrine of dissimilarity...

No later Christian scribe is going to change the text to say Jesus was ignorant of his fate....

It goes against the narrative they already believe in.

But one might read the crucifixion story and think, “hmmm I mean Jesus was the son of god.. I’m sure he knew exactly what was going on and Mark’s story is wrong! I better fix that before there is some confusion...”


People do not change the text to make it say something they do not want it to say.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Except for the doctrine of dissimilarity...

No later Christian scribe is going to change the text to say Jesus was ignorant of his fate....

It goes against the narrative they already believe in.

But one might read the crucifixion story and think, “hmmm I mean Jesus was the son of god.. I’m sure he knew exactly what was going on and Mark’s story is wrong! I better fix that before there is some confusion...”


People do not change the text to make it say something they do not want it to say.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Indeed, and this why many ancient texts contain interpolations (cf. Josephos).
 
And prominent Roman emperors at the time were ascending into heaven on the backs of swans (Julius [although technically not an emperor], Augustus & Claudius). It seems to have been somewhat of a 'tradition' that may have been 'appropriated' into the literature.

Not sure what you mean??

More than one emporer skipped one of his own children in favor of an adopted “son”.

The romans did not do the whole “divine right to rule”.

Favoring natural children comes from evolution and then separately in the ancient world the “divine right to rule” , which I think comes from the “Adam was perfect and humanity is getting worse.”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Not sure what you mean??

More than one emporer skipped one of his own children in favor of an adopted “son”.

The romans did not do the whole “divine right to rule”.

Favoring natural children comes from evolution and then separately in the ancient world the “divine right to rule” , which I think comes from the “Adam was perfect and humanity is getting worse.”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I simply meant, as the supposed Jewish authors of the texts appropriated the Roman concept of adoption, as you suggest, I posit that they adopted the Roman concept of ascension into heaven into the literature as well.

Back to your point, I do find it somewhat interesting that although Jesus was supposed to be the Son of God, many make a great effort to prove his lineage back to King David.
 
Some early copies have different endings to 16, suggesting the possibility of interpolation.

If I’m right the end is a total fabrication/addition..
the original mark ended there and the story of the prostitute Jesus saved was added later..

Sad because it is a super deep and beautiful story..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I simply meant, as the supposed Jewish authors of the texts appropriated the Roman concept of adoption, as you suggest, I posit that they adopted the Roman concept of ascension into heaven into the literature as well.

Back to your point, I do find it somewhat interesting that although Jesus was supposed to be the Son of God, many make a great effort to prove his lineage back to King David.

Crazy good point?!?!

Well I have heard it is supposed to be through Mary, but either way. It shouldn’t matter.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I simply meant, as the supposed Jewish authors of the texts appropriated the Roman concept of adoption, as you suggest, I posit that they adopted the Roman concept of ascension into heaven into the literature as well.

Back to your point, I do find it somewhat interesting that although Jesus was supposed to be the Son of God, many make a great effort to prove his lineage back to King David.

You may find this link interesting...

Jesus genealogies - creation.com
 
The mainstream critical scholarly view is that Jesus was not made a divine being until his crucifixion..

See in the ancient Roman world adoption trumped your natural children..

Your natural children were a crap shoot... maybe they were trash, maybe super competent.. who knows when they are born?!?!

But you only adopted someone because you already knew they were awesome.. Mostly romans adopted adults.. and prominent families would adopt the best of the best..


So where originally it is believed they thought Jesus was adopted by god at his resurrection, as society shifted to favor natural children the fact Jesus was adopted became less cool..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

:happy::happy::happy::happy::happy::
 
Crazy good point?!?!

Well I have heard it is supposed to be through Mary, but either way. It shouldn’t matter.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is the justification given for one genealogy being quite different to the other, but it is somewhat shallow, as both texts explicitly state it is through Joseph.
 
You may find this link interesting...

Jesus genealogies - creation.com

I've read all the justifications for the discrepancies before (see Rawlinson) and I even wrote a paper on the problem, however, the claims do not stand up to textual scrutiny, as they both (Matthew and Luke) explicitly state it is through Joseph. To make Rawlinson's hypothesis work, one has to omit this fact. The adoptive belief is specious as the society didn't really practise this, and the concept was appropriated from the Roman custom.
 
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