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Try to look at Islam academically.

Define fundamentalist Christianity and tell us why it's detrimental to society?

Christianity is harmful, as is any other movement which promotes irrationality and superstition. In Europe the advance of scientific understanding was impeded, every step of the way, by Christianity. The USA, to its shame, is still infested by 'creationists' and other religious promoters of ignorance.
 
Define fundamentalist Christianity and tell us why it's detrimental to society?

I think we've been down this road before, but here is a decent definition:
Christian fundamentalism - Wikipedia

Christian fundamentalism began in the late 19th and early 20th centuries among British and American Protestants[1][2] as a reaction to theological liberalism and cultural modernism. Fundamentalists argued that 19th-century modernist theologians had misinterpreted or rejected certain doctrines, especially biblical inerrancy, that they viewed as the fundamentals of the Christian faith.[3] Fundamentalists are almost always described as having a literal interpretation of the Bible. A few scholars label Catholics who reject modern theology in favor of more traditional doctrines as fundamentalists.[4] Scholars debate how much the terms "evangelical" and "fundamentalist" are synonymous.[5] In keeping with traditional Christian doctrines concerning biblical interpretation, the role Jesus plays in the Bible, and the role of the church in society, fundamentalists usually believe in a core of Christian beliefs that include the historical accuracy of the Bible and all its events as well as the Second Coming of Jesus Christ.[6]

Interpretations of Christian fundamentalism have changed over time.[7] Fundamentalism as a movement manifested in various denominations with various theologies, rather than a single denomination or systematic theology. It became active in the 1910s after the release of The Fundamentals, a twelve-volume set of essays, apologetic and polemic, written by conservative Protestant theologians to defend what they saw as Protestant orthodoxy. The movement became more organized in the 1920s within U.S. Protestant churches, especially Baptist and Presbyterian ones.

Many such churches adopted a "fighting style"[clarification needed] and combined Princeton theology with Dispensationalism.[2] Since 1930, many fundamentalist churches have been represented by the Independent Fundamental Churches of America (renamed IFCA International in 1996), which holds to biblical inerrancy.
 
Sooooo, how's that tutorial coming along? I can't wait to see what the real interpretation of "kill the infidels" is. Could it actually mean, "invite them to tea and have a chat"????? I await with bated breath.

lol...told you no one believes you. Good grief, but the impotence must be frustrating.

Enjoy your little echo chamber. Looks like all your conversations end the same way. :shrug:
 
So no debate, no informed discussion. Just trotting out the idiot word 'Islamophobic'. Pathetic indeed and entirely expected from a poster who has never contributed even one interesting idea.

You? I'm shocked, I say! Shocked!
 
That is not quite right. I was a 'Catholic child' because my mother was a Catholic. Italians were Catholic because hundreds of generations of their ancestors were. That's 'ethnic' enough to meet any reasonable definition.
we were talking about the Italian ethnicity not the Catholic ethnicity. Sure a lot of Italians are Catholic put a lot of Catholics are not Italian.

there is no such thing as a cultural Catholic when you say Catholic you are referring to people that are members of the Church of Rome.

I do hope you are not implying that Jews are somehow a 'race'.
well I referred to cultural and ethnic Jews. Culture and ethnicity are not tied to race. Race is biological
 
What is being criticised is not a 'them', that is Muslims. But an 'it', that is Islam. Islam runs contrary to Western values of tolerance acceptance of individual rights. It promotes a cruel and blatantly unjust legal system and theocracy and those who try to shut down all criticism of Islam are contemptible appeasers.

I can name at least five or ten Republicans whose values run contrary to Western values of tolerance, acceptance of individual rights and even democracy itself. They are open theocrats and they openly state that they believe that biblical law should take precedence over Constitutional law.
 
I don't know about that. Jesus was a fundamentalist and he was arguably the finest example of love the world has ever seen. Thomas Jefferson called Christ’s teachings “the most sublime and benevolent code of morals which has ever been offered to man.”

On the other hand, there's liberal fundamentalism.

Beware of Liberal Fundamentalism

"Rather than truly embrace “freedom,” liberal fundamentalists seek to control virtually every aspect of the lives of the masses that are unfortunate enough to be under their fundamentalist rulership. They seek to outlaw SUV’s, impose smoking bans while advocating marijuana use, prohibit freedom of religious expression in government and public schools, advocate compulsory training in politically correct opinions and attitudes, seek to enforce Bible bans in schools and the workplace, embrace a de-facto litmus test against pro-life judicial nominees, seek to criminalize pro-life demonstrations through the RICO racketeering statute, try to squelch legitimate religious speech via “hate-speech” laws (note Canada), and generally engage in a wide range of behaviors designed to subvert the U.S. Constitution and traditional American values."

"It is certainly arguable, then, that “progressive” liberal fundamentalism substantially undermines the basic effectiveness of the government and other societal elements of democracy. Despite the idealistic goals of liberalism, attempts to build a utopian liberal society in America have only led to heightened outbreaks of AIDS, VD, porno-related crime, social divisions, divorce, abortion, drug addictions, deficit spending, the welfare state, a crushing tax burden, the breakdown of the family unit, moral depravity, and numerous other such scourges which have resulted in enormous societal suffering and discontent. As a result, liberal fundamentalism is strongly associated with left-wing fanaticism, reverse-racism, anti-intellectualism, elitism, nihilism, godlessness, and societal violence."

Liberal Fundamentalism << The Righter Report

Cheers...

We have differing views of fundamentalism and I never said that "liberal" fundamentalism was somehow exempt from criticism.
 
we were talking about the Italian ethnicity not the Catholic ethnicity. Sure a lot of Italians are Catholic put a lot of Catholics are not Italian.

there is no such thing as a cultural Catholic when you say Catholic you are referring to people that are members of the Church of Rome.

well I referred to cultural and ethnic Jews. Culture and ethnicity are not tied to race. Race is biological

'Race' is unknown to biology- It is a cultural artifact, a concept devised by fools in the 19thcentury which should hae been junked long ago.

And some Jews are not born Jewish but are converts. Enough with the ethnicity already.
 
'Race' is unknown to biology- It is a cultural artifact, a concept devised by fools in the 19thcentury which should hae been junked long ago.
No race is physically observable.

And some Jews are not born Jewish but are converts. Enough with the ethnicity already.
Sure there are converts. But they're are ethnic Jews.
 
lol...told you no one believes you. Good grief, but the impotence must be frustrating.

Enjoy your little echo chamber. Looks like all your conversations end the same way. :shrug:

He gives his Trollodex a spin and it comes up............echo chamber.
 
If I may reply: Because Europe is mainly post-Christian. Only a small minority of Swedes, for example, know what is is the Bible and even fewer care. Christianity is tamed and powerless which is why we are unconcerned that it is not yet quite dead.

So it’s not actually the words in the book that matter.
 
So it’s not actually the words in the book that matter.

Correct. Words only matter when they are read and believed. This is much more the case with Muslims in Europe than of 'Christians'. Most/nearly all of the latter are actually post-Christians(like me).
 
He gives his Trollodex a spin and it comes up............echo chamber.

Not sure why the reaction, it's clear that's what you're attempting to establish, with your evangelization of Islamophobia. You want everyone to agree with you, to say how right you are, how wise you are, how incredibly well read you are. You want everyone to justify your terror and impotent rage, to join you in condemning a group of people who dare believe in a different direction than you. That's what they call an echo chamber.

But while certain aspects of their belief system and culture, practiced by only a portion of their population in it's extreme, can be condemned and made illegal in countries where that kind of behavior is unprecedented and unsupported, those of us without head up ass know that generalization is the best way to be wrong, especially when generalizing based on outlier demographics.

So, despite best efforts by you to create this echo chamber, the only folks you're going to get to sign on to your bottom of the barrel ideas are bottom of the barrel people. The rest of us may try to help you out from time to time, cuz good grief, carrying around all that unnecessary anxiety and anger must be a hell of a burden, but you're not going to change our minds, because your presentation lacks credibility. The world you describe doesn't look like the world we live in. :shrug:

You really ought to find a new hobby, man. This one doesn't appear to be getting you much, except the agreement of dumb people.
 
I can name at least five or ten Republicans whose values run contrary to Western values of tolerance, acceptance of individual rights and even democracy itself. They are open theocrats and they openly state that they believe that biblical law should take precedence over Constitutional law.
You can?

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You can?

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Absolutely.

Ted Cruz, Matt Shea, Mike Pence, James Inhofe, Mike Enzi, Chuck Grassley, John Thune, Louie Gohmert...all of these people (and many more) subscribe to "dominion theology", the extremist far Right branch of fundamentalist Christianity that feels the destruction of government, the social contract and civic duty is part of God’s plan to put a theocracy in place.

These are not the Ayn Rand Objectivist/Libertarian types who feel that government simply has no place outside of the military, these are committed demagogues who are committed to an eternal fight to install pure theocracy as the ultimate form of government.

Dominionism is one hundred percent incompatible with any form of secular constitutional republican government, and diametrically opposed to any form of democracy which functions within such a republican constitutional framework.

By the way, have you ever heard of Matt Shea's "Biblical Basis for War" document?

One of my favorite passages:

c. Make an offer of Peace before declaring war.

i. Not a negotiation or compromise of righteousness.
ii. Must surrender on terms of justice and righteousness:
1. Stop all abortions;
2. No same-sex marriage;
3. No idolatry or occultism;
4. No communism; and
5. Must obey Biblical law.
iii. If they yield – must pay share of work or taxes.
iv. If they do not yield – kill all males.

Interestingly, since the Bible is a work of fiction, and since literally THOUSANDS of different versions are in circulation, each with their own translations and interpretations, it obviously falls to Matt Shea and or his duly appointed fellow fundamentalists to be the arbiters of what "biblical law" is precisely, therefore these appointed fundies ARE the LAW, and law issues as they SPEAK IT FROM THEIR MOUTHS.

But that's how it works in a theocracy.

Idolatry and communism...hmmmm...I guess it's like cable TV and internet, they're bundled.
And of course, as usual, THEY are the ones who decide what idolatry and communism are...typically it's anything they don't agree with.

I "get" that they refuse to allow gay marriage and that abortion under any circumstances is murder to them.
This is not surprising.
Of course, the Bible lists some 17 different types of marriage, including marrying a slave, marrying a woman AND taking a concubine, forced marriage of a dead soldier's bride to a brother, polygamy, etc....I guess that will all get worked out by the top theocrats.

But the last one (iv. If they do not yield – kill all males.) is why I, a liberal, feel very comfortable with the Second Amendment, because I view any politician who lays out a document that calls for the summary execution of all males who "will not yield" as an immediate and direct threat to safety and security for myself, my family and my loved ones.

And when someone is arrogant enough and stupid enough to telegraph such a thing in advance, I consider it a warning and I heed warnings from people in power.

It is interesting to note that Matt Shea visited armed militants during their armed occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Eastern Oregon in 2016.

I do not agree with Matt Shea's plan for theocracy, I will not yield.
And therefore, Matt Shea has given ample justification for an equal response.
 
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Islam is so much more than mere religion. It, if followed according to the Qur'an, is a way of life rather than something you just happen to believe as you lead an otherwise secular life.

Also one cannot separate the law from the religion as Sharia law is just that. Law.

And can directly conflict with many of the constitutional beliefs.

All cannot be equal when some are oppressed. i.e women, etc.
 
Absolutely.

Ted Cruz, Matt Shea, Mike Pence, James Inhofe, Mike Enzi, Chuck Grassley, John Thune, Louie Gohmert...all of these people (and many more) subscribe to "dominion theology", the extremist far Right branch of fundamentalist Christianity that feels the destruction of government, the social contract and civic duty is part of God’s plan to put a theocracy in place.

These are not the Ayn Rand Objectivist/Libertarian types who feel that government simply has no place outside of the military, these are committed demagogues who are committed to an eternal fight to install pure theocracy as the ultimate form of government.

Dominionism is one hundred percent incompatible with any form of secular constitutional republican government, and diametrically opposed to any form of democracy which functions within such a republican constitutional framework.

By the way, have you ever heard of Matt Shea's "Biblical Basis for War" document?

One of my favorite passages:

c. Make an offer of Peace before declaring war.

i. Not a negotiation or compromise of righteousness.
ii. Must surrender on terms of justice and righteousness:
1. Stop all abortions;
2. No same-sex marriage;
3. No idolatry or occultism;
4. No communism; and
5. Must obey Biblical law.
iii. If they yield – must pay share of work or taxes.
iv. If they do not yield – kill all males.

Interestingly, since the Bible is a work of fiction, and since literally THOUSANDS of different versions are in circulation, each with their own translations and interpretations, it obviously falls to Matt Shea and or his duly appointed fellow fundamentalists to be the arbiters of what "biblical law" is precisely, therefore these appointed fundies ARE the LAW, and law issues as they SPEAK IT FROM THEIR MOUTHS.

But that's how it works in a theocracy.

Idolatry and communism...hmmmm...I guess it's like cable TV and internet, they're bundled.
And of course, as usual, THEY are the ones who decide what idolatry and communism are...typically it's anything they don't agree with.

I "get" that they refuse to allow gay marriage and that abortion under any circumstances is murder to them.
This is not surprising.
Of course, the Bible lists some 17 different types of marriage, including marrying a slave, marrying a woman AND taking a concubine, forced marriage of a dead soldier's bride to a brother, polygamy, etc....I guess that will all get worked out by the top theocrats.

But the last one (iv. If they do not yield – kill all males.) is why I, a liberal, feel very comfortable with the Second Amendment, because I view any politician who lays out a document that calls for the summary execution of all males who "will not yield" as an immediate and direct threat to safety and security for myself, my family and my loved ones.

And when someone is arrogant enough and stupid enough to telegraph such a thing in advance, I consider it a warning and I heed warnings from people in power.

It is interesting to note that Matt Shea visited armed militants during their armed occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Eastern Oregon in 2016.

I do not agree with Matt Shea's plan for theocracy, I will not yield.
And therefore, Matt Shea has given ample justification for an equal response.
Sorry I asked. Lol .....What a train wreck.

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Correct. Words only matter when they are read and believed. This is much more the case with Muslims in Europe than of 'Christians'. Most/nearly all of the latter are actually post-Christians(like me).

So the problem isn’t Islam or the Quran. Maaaaybe it’s the conditions.
 
I can name at least five or ten Republicans whose values run contrary to Western values of tolerance, acceptance of individual rights and even democracy itself. They are open theocrats and they openly state that they believe that biblical law should take precedence over Constitutional law.

You're probably right. Fortunately, one of them is not Trump. Pence, I'm not so sure about.
 
So the problem isn’t Islam or the Quran. Maaaaybe it’s the conditions.

I think you misunderstood him. He was saying that Muslims are more likely to act on the words in their "holy" book than Christians are. However, what those words are, and which book is more in line with the 21st century, is a completely different subject.
 
Not sure why the reaction, it's clear that's what you're attempting to establish, with your evangelization of Islamophobia. You want everyone to agree with you, to say how right you are, how wise you are, how incredibly well read you are. You want everyone to justify your terror and impotent rage, to join you in condemning a group of people who dare believe in a different direction than you. That's what they call an echo chamber.

But while certain aspects of their belief system and culture, practiced by only a portion of their population in it's extreme, can be condemned and made illegal in countries where that kind of behavior is unprecedented and unsupported, those of us without head up ass know that generalization is the best way to be wrong, especially when generalizing based on outlier demographics.

So, despite best efforts by you to create this echo chamber, the only folks you're going to get to sign on to your bottom of the barrel ideas are bottom of the barrel people. The rest of us may try to help you out from time to time, cuz good grief, carrying around all that unnecessary anxiety and anger must be a hell of a burden, but you're not going to change our minds, because your presentation lacks credibility. The world you describe doesn't look like the world we live in. :shrug:

You really ought to find a new hobby, man. This one doesn't appear to be getting you much, except the agreement of dumb people.

After what happened in NZ, it seems your statement has become very relevant.
 
But that is the same for other religions, like Christianity and Judaism. IF you follow it according to the teachings then it is a way of life. Hell, back in my younger Born-Again-Christian days my life revolved around my faith. I lived in Indonesia, the largest Muslim country in the world, for three years and most Muslims there live a fairly secular life when they aren't attending mosque. Seriously, we are talking strip clubs and alcohol and every other vice you can imagine. The exception is the province of Aceh, which is a semi-autonomous region that is populated and governed by more fundamentalist types.

Now, if you are talking about countries like Saudi Arabia that are theocratic, then in those cases you are certainly correct.

Basic common sense, fact and reality that SOME people will ignore
 
It is something that the west needs to debate. Does Islam allow Muslims to assimilate in the west? Is Islam compatible with the west?

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Yes and yes :shrug:
 
Islam is so much more than mere religion. It, if followed according to the Qur'an, is a way of life rather than something you just happen to believe as you lead an otherwise secular life.

So is my Christianity :shrug:

SO are other religions i imagine/
 
Waaaaay over the top. Christians who want to convert you ring your doorbell. Muslims who want to convert you fly into your buildings.

:lamo:2rofll:

and there it is LMAO
9 posts in and you expose yourself to way YOU cant have normal talks about religion . .you just proved the issue is FACTUALLY you :shrug:

Wow what an instant and complete fail.
 
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