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Tour De France: The Cheating Continues

PeteEU said:
Easy... he takes astma medicine last I looked... amazing how many top sports people have astma or heart disease...
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Yup. Froome was a nobody for years and then he just comes out of nowhere and all of a sudden starts wining all these championships? I'm not buying it. It's the Lance Armstrong story all over again.

It's clear he's using the asthma medication to mask his PED use. There's even been allegations against his Sky TV team.
 
PoS said:
Yup. Froome was a nobody for years and then he just comes out of nowhere and all of a sudden starts wining all these championships? I'm not buying it. It's the Lance Armstrong story all over again.

It's clear he's using the asthma medication to mask his PED use. There's even been allegations against his Sky TV team.
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It comes down to money. Froome is too big a product still for the hammer to fall. Sky is the dominant team, just as US Postal was when Armstrong was doing his thing. But it is not only cycling... most sports have these issues and it has to stop. The Tour it self has been calling out cheaters for years but the Cycle union and the anti-doping agencies have been protecting the accused... and yet as with this OP, the Tour gets blamed..
 
TDF 1905

oly_tourdefrance_02.jpg
 
PoS said:
Yup. Froome was a nobody for years and then he just comes out of nowhere and all of a sudden starts wining all these championships?
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Uh... No, actually, he was a pro for 5 years, riding numerous stage races and showing strong TT skills, before he won his first Grand Tour.


I'm not buying it. It's the Lance Armstrong story all over again.

It's clear he's using the asthma medication to mask his PED use. There's even been allegations against his Sky TV team.
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Well, if there are allegations against his team, then that settles it. Who needs evidence when you've got innuendo?
 
Visbek said:
Uh... No, actually, he was a pro for 5 years, riding numerous stage races and showing strong TT skills, before he won his first Grand Tour.
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Thanks for confirming what I said. He was a nobody for years.

Well, if there are allegations against his team, then that settles it. Who needs evidence when you've got innuendo?
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He failed a drugs test. Apparently you keep forgetting about that little piece of evidence in your quest to elevate Froome to sainthood.
 
PoS said:
2018 Tour de France -- Chris Froome and team Sky booed at race presentation



So they ban Lance Armstrong for life but clear another guy who tested positive in another race. The Tour De France ought to be gotten rid of-its pure farce.
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They banned him for his team wide years long orchestrated Doping program set up and run by Armstrong, where he destroyed people's lives and destroyed their reputation.

However people feel about Froome, he gets tested all the frigging time and one time he had too high a level of something, the investigation was done and he was found not be have done anything illegal.

The Tour de France is a fine race and needs to continue for as long as it is a great sporting event (and it is that).
 
Peter King said:
However people feel about Froome, he gets tested all the frigging time and one time he had too high a level of something, the investigation was done and he was found not be have done anything illegal.
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Thats exactly what happened to Lance during his time on the tour too, thanks for repeating it.

The Tour de France is a fine race and needs to continue for as long as it is a great sporting event (and it is that).
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It's a joke when hypocrisy like this happens time and time again. Froome was booed, and rightly so.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Don't we as sport fans deserve to see the absolute best performance the human body with modern science and chemicals can achieve? I say let everyone juice up and improve the viewing quality for all of us.
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I have started to come to that same conclusion. It is going to happen anyway so just let them. At least in professional sports.
 
PoS said:
2018 Tour de France -- Chris Froome and team Sky booed at race presentation

So they ban Lance Armstrong for life but clear another guy who tested positive in another race. The Tour De France ought to be gotten rid of-its pure farce.
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I'm not sure what your point is, but Lance was a cheating sociopath, and should clearly have been banned for life. The problem with the cycling agencies at that time is they protected SOME cheaters, including Lance and his team for quite a while. So they were corrupt, no doubt, but that's no excuse for Lance who was sitting in the middle of it.

I don't know enough about Froome's case to make a judgment, and perhaps he should have been banned, I just can't go along with any defense of Lance Armstrong. Greg LeMond lives nearby where his company is using a new process for making carbon, and he gave a talk a few months ago that ended up being a long diatribe about cheating in cycling, then about Lance. It was pretty shocking stuff. The worst parts about Lance were many, many cases of him viciously attacking people TELLING THE TRUTH about Lance's cheating - the many attempts, some successful, to ruin their lives for being honest. He's a POS.
 
JasperL said:
I'm not sure what your point is, but Lance was a cheating sociopath, and should clearly have been banned for life. The problem with the cycling agencies at that time is they protected SOME cheaters, including Lance and his team for quite a while. So they were corrupt, no doubt, but that's no excuse for Lance who was sitting in the middle of it.
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My point is obvious: hypocrisy. Im not denying Lance was a cheater, because they all were. But I find it laughable that everybody else got off scott free- like Contador- who cheated the same way. And now Froome is doing it, so nothing has changed. And since everybody is still doing it, why is it only Lance who got banned?
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Don't we as sport fans deserve to see the absolute best performance the human body with modern science and chemicals can achieve? I say let everyone juice up and improve the viewing quality for all of us.
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NO, blood doping is extremely dangerous. It has caused many deaths.
 
PeteEU said:
It comes down to money. Froome is too big a product still for the hammer to fall.
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You could say the same about Basso, Vino, Contador, Valverde, Ulrich, and so many other big stars that got busted. Contador was one of the highest-paid riders in the sport when he got popped for clenbuterol. Why didn't the UCI cover up his positive test result?

What happens when you follow the money? It takes you straight to the corporations that sponsor the teams -- who have no interest anymore in being embarrassed by doping cyclists who smear the company's good name. The riders still have strong financial incentives to cheat, but the teams have incentives to stop them, whereas in the past they didn't care. They're in this for the publicity, not the prize money.


The Tour it self has been calling out cheaters for years but the Cycle union and the anti-doping agencies have been protecting the accused... and yet as with this OP, the Tour gets blamed..
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Then why did ASO clear Froome to ride? They're certainly willing to clash with the UCI and WADA, including over doping issues.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
I have started to come to that same conclusion. It is going to happen anyway so just let them. At least in professional sports.
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Athletes were dying, and teens were imitating the pros.

Which leaves me on the brink of a rant on the insanity of American high school football.
 
PeteEU said:
yea... sure. Guess what.. if you get sick from exercising so much.. then dont do so much. The issue is, that asthma medicine is performance enhancing and getting a crooked doctor to sign off on it.. is easy as we have seen time and time again.
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Is it performance enhancing for someone who doesn't have asthma?
 
PeteEU said:
yea... sure. Guess what.. if you get sick from exercising so much.. then dont do so much.
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Riiiiight

By that logic, any athlete with allergies should just quit, and give up sports forever, rather than take legal medications that do not enhance performance.


The issue is, that asthma medicine is performance enhancing and getting a crooked doctor to sign off on it.. is easy as we have seen time and time again.
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Incorrect.

Asthma medicines do not enhance performance.

Salbutamol no longer requires a Therapeutic Use Exception.

Try to keep up.
 
PoS said:
Thanks for confirming what I said. He was a nobody for years.
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lol

Yeah, don't let the actual words I wrote get in the way. :mrgreen:

He worked his way up about as fast as anyone of his abilities. E.g. his career isn't much different than Greg Lemond's, except that the handoff from Hinault to Lemond was much much messier than Wiggins to Froome. Similarly, we could squeal that "Quintana came out of nowhere!" but that's not really true either. He's an outstanding climber on a team whose top GC guy was slowly losing steam.


He failed a drugs test. Apparently you keep forgetting about that little piece of evidence in your quest to elevate Froome to sainthood.
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I don't particularly care for Froome. However, he is the strongest stage racer of his generation, on the strongest team in the peloton. That's just how it is.

And again... The test he failed has so many problems that even the man who developed it thinks it's a bad test.

Let us know when you come up with some actual facts to back your position, kthx.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
The level of doping by Lance Armstrong was literally an order of magnitude greater than what Chris Froome has been accused of.
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We dont know what the extent of Froome's cheating is, but I will bet this is just the tip of the iceberg.

Visbek said:
I don't particularly care for Froome.
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Sure you dont ... your obsession with defending a man who failed a drugs test is proof of that already. Are you the president of his fan club? :lol:
 
I lost interest in the sport after the Lance bust. They either need to clean it up in a believable way or give everyone access to the same doping.
 
PoS said:
We dont know what the extent of Froome's cheating is, but I will bet this is just the tip of the iceberg.


Sure you dont ... your obsession with defending a man who failed a drugs test is proof of that already. Are you the president of his fan club? :lol:
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With today's biological passports, you can bet that Froome's cheating has nothing on what Lance was doing. We know Froome is not using anabolics and is not using EPO.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
With today's biological passports, you can bet that Froome's cheating has nothing on what Lance was doing. We know Froome is not using anabolics and is not using EPO.
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We dont know that for sure. Lance was always clean in all of his tests, and it wasnt until they developed a new type of testing did they get a positive on an old sample. The doping scene is always a step ahead since they know how the tests work. Lance stopped using EPOs after his 2nd tour win.
 
PoS said:
My point is obvious: hypocrisy. Im not denying Lance was a cheater, because they all were. But I find it laughable that everybody else got off scott free- like Contador- who cheated the same way. And now Froome is doing it, so nothing has changed. And since everybody is still doing it, why is it only Lance who got banned?
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- Not everyone else got off scott free.
- Contator had his 2010 TDF title stripped, so didn't get off scott free.
- Lance viciously attacked people for telling the TRUTH about his doping, tried and succeeded in ruining some of their lives, and deserved to be banned because he's a cheating sociopath. I don't know how you can know what he did, and especially the tactics he used to silence his HONEST accusers, and defend the guy with "everyone did it." They didn't. That's the story the self serving, lying sociopath tells.
- Froome might have cheated - I don't know - but you alleging an apples to apples comparison to the years long doping program Lance was involved in doesn't make it true.
 
PoS said:
We dont know that for sure. Lance was always clean in all of his tests, and it wasnt until they developed a new type of testing did they get a positive on an old sample. The doping scene is always a step ahead since they know how the tests work. Lance stopped using EPOs after his 2nd tour win.
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Right, but he switched from EPO to blood doping.

Froome's vo2 max is high, but not particularly high for the elite level of cyclists. His HCT is in the normal range as well.
 
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