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Oklahoma, Kentucky public schools close as thousands of teachers strike[W:21]

Rogue Valley

Rogue Valley

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Oklahoma, Kentucky public schools close as thousands of teachers strike

h=300

Thousands of teachers from across Kentucky fill the state Capitol to rally for
increased funding and to protest last minute changes to their state funded pension system
on April 2, 2018, in Frankfort, Kentucky.

Apr.02.2018

Frustrated educators were asking politicians to do the math on Monday as thousands swarmed the Oklahoma and Kentucky state capitals to demand an increase in teachers' wages and school funding. Every public school in Kentucky and many schools in Oklahoma closed on Monday due to the volume of teachers protesting. The simultaneous protests across the country marked a breaking point for many teachers who say they're tired of raising money and paying out of pocket for their underfunded classrooms. In Oklahoma, one teacher held a sign that simply read, "5,655" — the amount of money she'd raised over the last two years for basic supplies for her students. Another teacher's sign read, "My class size 40 - 45." And several had the same words that read, "609,463 reasons to fund education." The demand for lawmakers to approve more education funding comes just days after the state Legislature approved educators' first pay raise in 10 years.

While many said the recent approval of a pay raise for teachers was a step in the right direction, several educators at the Oklahoma rally said more overall funding for their schools was their top priority. Heather Caram, another teacher at the protest, told MSNBC she would soon be leaving Oklahoma to accept a job in Georgia. Her sign read, "Oklahoma's #1 export is teachers." National Education Association President Lily Eskelsen García, who attended the Oklahoma rally, said educators who are tired of 20-year-old text books held together by duct tape had gathered to say "enough is enough." "This wasn’t caused by a natural disaster. This is a man-made crisis," she said. In 2011, Republicans in 11 states, including Oklahoma, cut back teachers' collective bargaining rights. Oklahoma ranks 47th in the nation in public school revenue per student, nearly $3,000 below the national average, while its average teacher salary of $45,276 ranks 49th.
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Red-state teachers are discovering that GOP state legislators are assigning them and state school funding to the back of the class. Arizona teachers are also on the verge of walking out.
 
Rogue Valley said:
Oklahoma, Kentucky public schools close as thousands of teachers strike

h=300

Thousands of teachers from across Kentucky fill the state Capitol to rally for
increased funding and to protest last minute changes to their state funded pension system
on April 2, 2018, in Frankfort, Kentucky.



Red-state teachers are discovering that GOP state legislators are assigning them and state school funding to the back of the class. Arizona teachers are also on the verge of walking out.
Click to expand...

1 State, no raises in 10 years, cuts to budgets.
 
Rogue Valley said:
Oklahoma, Kentucky public schools close as thousands of teachers strike

h=300

Thousands of teachers from across Kentucky fill the state Capitol to rally for
increased funding and to protest last minute changes to their state funded pension system
on April 2, 2018, in Frankfort, Kentucky.



Red-state teachers are discovering that GOP state legislators are assigning them and state school funding to the back of the class. Arizona teachers are also on the verge of walking out.
Click to expand...

Hardly the back of the class. Its their top spending category.

Oklahoma spends $8000 per student, about 40% of their budget, up from 33% in 2010. As if thats not enough, they just gave teachers a $6000 raise, which they paid for with cigarette taxes. I dont live there but it seems people should be asking where the money is going and how much parents are willing to pay. Teacher are demanding an additional 200 mil plus 10,000 raise for themselves. 200 million would add about $200 per student. Is that enough?
 
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jonny5 said:
Hardly the back of the class. Its their top spending category.

Oklahoma spends $8000 per student, about 40% of their budget, up from 33% in 2010. As if thats not enough, they just gave teachers a $6000 raise, which they paid for with cigarette taxes. I dont live there but it seems people should be asking where the money is going and how much parents are willing to pay. Teacher are demanding an additional 200 mil plus 10,000 raise for themselves. 200 million would add about $200 per student. Is that enough?
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Nope, it's not. Not even close.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/3/9/17100404/teacher-salary-underpaid-database

Teachers in states such as Oklahoma and Kentucky are pathetically underpaid. I strongly support their walkout and their unified to their state governments, enough!
 
jonny5 said:
Hardly the back of the class. Its their top spending category.

Oklahoma spends $8000 per student, about 40% of their budget, up from 33% in 2010. As if thats not enough, they just gave teachers a $6000 raise, which they paid for with cigarette taxes. I dont live there but it seems people should be asking where the money is going and how much parents are willing to pay. Teacher are demanding an additional 200 mil plus 10,000 raise for themselves. 200 million would add about $200 per student. Is that enough?
Click to expand...

If they add nearly $4,000 per student they'll be at the national average.

NEA - Rankings of the States 2016 and Estimates of School Statistics 2017

"The average per student expenditure in 2015–16 fall enrollment was $11,787. "

Oklahomans need to ask themselves if being that far sub-par, that much short of just average, is acceptable.
 
Phys251 said:
Nope, it's not. Not even close.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/3/9/17100404/teacher-salary-underpaid-database

Teachers in states such as Oklahoma and Kentucky are pathetically underpaid. I strongly support their walkout and their unified to their state governments, enough!
Click to expand...

Only if you set objectivity aside and center your thinking around simplistic union rhetoric.

There needs to be compensation standards that maintain competitiveness relative to cost of living. States like Oklahoma, Mississippi, and Kentucky have some of the lowest costs of living in the entire country, so it's not a shock that they are toward the lower end in terms of nominal teacher salaries. When adjusting for cost of living, Oklahoma and Kentucky average teacher salaries are in the middle, ranking higher than states like California, Vermont, Maine, Hawaii, Oregon, D.C., Virginia, and New Hampshire.

Compensation standards, driven by laws and regulations, can look at these things objectively, whereas unions do nothing but spout rhetoric and have zero concern for honesty or objectivity.
 
Kentucky are only having their pensions stolen, how dare they strike!
 
Kentucky & Oklahoma; who would dare live in these **** hole states?
 
Neomalthusian said:
Only if you set objectivity aside and center your thinking around simplistic union rhetoric.

There needs to be compensation standards that maintain competitiveness relative to cost of living. States like Oklahoma, Mississippi, and Kentucky have some of the lowest costs of living in the entire country, so it's not a shock that they are toward the lower end in terms of nominal teacher salaries. When adjusting for cost of living, Oklahoma and Kentucky average teacher salaries are in the middle, ranking higher than states like California, Vermont, Maine, Hawaii, Oregon, D.C., Virginia, and New Hampshire.

Compensation standards, driven by laws and regulations, can look at these things objectively, whereas unions do nothing but spout rhetoric and have zero concern for honesty or objectivity.
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Pure anti-teacher propaganda. I want my teachers supported. Do you?

ETA: Oklahoma teacher strike: 'I have 29 textbooks for 87 pupils' - BBC News

I guess you are okay with that status quo?
 
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cuban smokes said:
Kentucky & Oklahoma; who would dare live in these **** hole states?
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They're not that bad...as long as you live near a city like Louisville or OKC.
 
Phys251 said:
Pure anti-teacher propaganda.
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Comparing average teacher salaries relative to cost of living is “propaganda?” Only a unionist would be so anti-fact.

I want my teachers supported.
Click to expand...

No you don’t. You want more of their money going to unions so that unions can give it to Democrats. That’s all you care about. If you cared about teachers being supported generally, you’d oppose unionism. Unionism has failed to level the teacher compensation playing field. Teaching has been extremely unionized for eons and yet we still have as much variability and unrest as ever. Pure failure.

I guess you are okay with that status quo?
Click to expand...

The status quo is a union-controlled teaching profession that has utterly failed to result in effective compensation policies. I am not okay with that status quo. You are.
 
Neomalthusian said:
Comparing average teacher salaries relative to cost of living is “propaganda?” Only a unionist would be so anti-fact.

No you don’t. You want more of their money going to unions so that unions can give it to Democrats. That’s all you care about.
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Stopped reading right there. Take back your disgusting lies. You have no clue what it's like to lead a classroom. It is people who show tone-deafness such as yourself that lead to the deplorable conditions depicted in the news story, which you stubbornly refuse to listen to.
 
Neomalthusian said:
Comparing average teacher salaries relative to cost of living is “propaganda?” Only a unionist would be so anti-fact.



No you don’t. You want more of their money going to unions so that unions can give it to Democrats. That’s all you care about. If you cared about teachers being supported generally, you’d oppose unionism. Unionism has failed to level the teacher compensation playing field. Teaching has been extremely unionized for eons and yet we still have as much variability and unrest as ever. Pure failure.



The status quo is a union-controlled teaching profession that has utterly failed to result in effective compensation policies. I am not okay with that status quo. You are.
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Wht's wrong with you? Why does everything equal union corruption? How did your world become so 2 dimensional and monochrome?
 
Phys251 said:
Stopped reading right there. Take back your disgusting lies. You have no clue what it's like to lead a classroom.
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“What it’s like to lead a classroom” has nada to do with unionism. Unionism has failed to regulate teacher compensation in this country, despite eons of NEA/AFT dominance of the discourse. They thrive only on unrest.
 
Grand Mal said:
Wht's wrong with you? Why does everything equal union corruption? How did your world become so 2 dimensional and monochrome?
Click to expand...

Multiple forums, anti-union garbage is the only thing this person posts. Probably paid to troll
 
Sampson Simpson said:
DOC Asks Lawmakers For $800M To Build New Prisons - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports |

Yet, Oklahoma wants to spend 700 million on new prison. The hell with educating kids and paying teachers, just imprison them

And people wonder why this country is going to ****.

Cue the dumb right wingers yelling "errr, we spend so much money on school" err teachers work half the year and all the other dumb **** they always spew in these forums
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Your insults are unconvincing.
 
West Virginia just shuffled deck chairs to mollify teachers there, now Oklahoma and Kentucky are following suit. Has anyone heard from Secretary DeVos?
 
Neomalthusian said:
“What it’s like to lead a classroom” has nada to do with unionism. Unionism has failed to regulate teacher compensation in this country, despite eons of NEA/AFT dominance of the discourse. They thrive only on unrest.
Click to expand...

More comments from someone who literally has no clue what goes on in the classroom.
 
Moderator's Warning:
Enough. Everyone dial back the personal stuff. Stick to the topic, which is not each other. Posts made before this in thread may still be subject to moderation.
 
Grand Mal said:
Wht's wrong with you? Why does everything equal union corruption?
Click to expand...

Because the NEA and AFT have absolutely dominated the discourse over teacher compensation for decades. Teaching is extremely unionized. There is no singular thing more relevant to talk about in this context than teachers' unions. We can't improve teacher compensation standards in this country primarily because teachers' unions are standing in the way.

Sampson Simpson said:
DOC Asks Lawmakers For $800M To Build New Prisons - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports |

Yet, Oklahoma wants to spend 700 million on new prison. The hell with educating kids and paying teachers, just imprison them

And people wonder why this country is going to ****.

Cue the dumb right wingers yelling "errr, we spend so much money on school" err teachers work half the year and all the other dumb **** they always spew in these forums
Click to expand...

Relative to cost of living, Oklahoma pays its teachers pretty close to what California pays its teachers.

Sampson Simpson said:
Multiple forums, anti-union garbage is the only thing this person posts. Probably paid to troll
Click to expand...

That's an obvious lie. So who's trolling?

Phys251 said:
More comments from someone who literally has no clue what goes on in the classroom.
Click to expand...

"What goes on in the classroom" does not have anything to do with the disorganized mess that is teacher compensation policy in this country.
 
Grand Mal said:
Wht's wrong with you? Why does everything equal union corruption? How did your world become so 2 dimensional and monochrome?
Click to expand...

Sampson Simpson said:
Multiple forums, anti-union garbage is the only thing this person posts. Probably paid to troll
Click to expand...

One other thing about these little chirps.

Topics like this too often conveniently leave out the enormous role unions play in this. Conservatives sling mud against "bad government," largely overlooking the role unions play, and want to just slash budgets, and liberals attack conservatives for being anti-education and wanting to destroy it to save a few tax dollars, also largely ignoring the role unions are playing. Meanwhile union leaders sit in the back row and smirk and giggle as everyone accuses everyone else of being the reason we're in the situation we're in. Unions love to see this mudslinging and unrest, because it's good for them when school administrators and school boards and city councils are widely characterized as evil the moment they hold a boundary around their finite financial resources. It is good for unions that people be at each other's throats, while failing to recognize the unions' central role.

Unions do not get anywhere near the amount of scrutiny and criticism they deserve when it comes to public sector employment compensation policies. They are absolutely central to that issue, yet they're constantly overlooked. I'm not overemphasizing unions' role in this issue. Everyone else is under-emphasizing it.Public sector employment is extremely unionized relative to all other sectors of the economy, so every discussion about government spending and public sector employment involves unions.
 
Neomalthusian said:
One other thing about these little chirps.

Topics like this too often conveniently leave out the enormous role unions play in this. Conservatives sling mud against "bad government," largely overlooking the role unions play, and want to just slash budgets, and liberals attack conservatives for being anti-education and wanting to destroy it to save a few tax dollars, also largely ignoring the role unions are playing. Meanwhile union leaders sit in the back row and smirk and giggle as everyone accuses everyone else of being the reason we're in the situation we're in. Unions love to see this mudslinging and unrest, because it's good for them when school administrators and school boards and city councils are widely characterized as evil the moment they hold a boundary around their finite financial resources. It is good for unions that people be at each other's throats, while failing to recognize the unions' central role.

Unions do not get anywhere near the amount of scrutiny and criticism they deserve when it comes to public sector employment compensation policies. They are absolutely central to that issue, yet they're constantly overlooked. I'm not overemphasizing unions' role in this issue. Everyone else is under-emphasizing it.Public sector employment is extremely unionized relative to all other sectors of the economy, so every discussion about government spending and public sector employment involves unions.
Click to expand...

Okay. Lemme tell you something about unions. And I'll make a long story short.
In a capitalism you get paid according to the value of what you produce. Unless you're a high-level executive but we won't go there. The value of what you produce. That's an easy calulation in many, maybe most, trades. I was a structural Ironworker (yes, union) and the fabricated steel had a certain value when it arrived on the job on trucks and it had another value when it was erected into a bridge or building or whatever. The difference was the value of what I produced and everyone involved got their piece of that value. Simple. Not so simple is the value of what public employees produce. How valuable is what cops or teachers produce? Who decides that number? If you make the number too low, for example, will you not be able to recruit quality people?
Your call. Pay crap wages, get crap employees. Pay good money, get good people. What's the value of what they're producing?
 
Rogue Valley said:
Oklahoma, Kentucky public schools close as thousands of teachers strike

h=300

Thousands of teachers from across Kentucky fill the state Capitol to rally for
increased funding and to protest last minute changes to their state funded pension system
on April 2, 2018, in Frankfort, Kentucky.



Red-state teachers are discovering that GOP state legislators are assigning them and state school funding to the back of the class. Arizona teachers are also on the verge of walking out.
Click to expand...

I love that the AZ teachers are fighting back, they don't get paid squat, and our public education system is garbage.
 
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