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[W:363]accepting gay as normal

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dixon01767 said:
Its the most frequent option



You will need to point out what was false. I made no assertions about it being the only option.
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The false point that nuclear family is the best option. The studies don't look at the other options. But please feel free to show me studies that include poly, as well as co-habitation w/o legal marriage.
 
dixon01767 said:
I wouldn't consider it a real problem, but yes, cant any longer prefer the nuclear family because it offends the delicate sensibilities of the gays who can not participate
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Nothing stopping them. I've already shown that nuclear family isn't limited to the biologically related.
 
dixon01767 said:
I wouldn't consider it a real problem, but yes, cant any longer prefer the nuclear family because it offends the delicate sensibilities of the gays who can not participate
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How about it makes no judgement on the character of the parents involved??


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maquiscat said:
The false point that nuclear family is the best option. The studies don't look at the other options. But please feel free to show me studies that include poly, as well as co-habitation w/o legal marriage.
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Actually the studies compare children born to their married mother and father with ALL other children including those options.
 
dixon01767 said:
Actually the studies compare children born to their married mother and father with ALL other children including those options.
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Show me the studies that compare children of a married male/female pair, to that of a cohabitating non married male/female pair.

Show me the studies that compare children of a married male/female pair, to that of a poly family

Show me the studies that compare children of a married male/female pair, to that of a same sex couple.

Every study that has ever been shown to me has been comparing a married male/female to a single mother. Not even a single father situation.

For the record, given my stances in other threads, I am using married in only the legal sense here.
 
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maquiscat said:
Show me the studies that compare children of a married male/female pair, to that of a cohabitating non married male/female pair.

Show me the studies that compare children of a married male/female pair, to that of a poly family

Show me the studies that compare children of a married male/female pair, to that of a same sex couple.

Every study that has ever been shown to me has been comparing a married male/female to a single mother. Not even a single father situation.

For the record, given my stances in other threads, I am using married in only the legal sense here.
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Compared to all others collectively. Not each different group you describe. Likely, there weren't ANY kids raised in polyandrous homes included in the study. They compare kids born to their married mother and father to all other kids.
 
dixon01767 said:
Compared to all others collectively. Not each different group you describe. Likely, there weren't ANY kids raised in polyandrous homes included in the study. They compare kids born to their married mother and father to all other kids.
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Show me the studies. As I said the only ones that anyone has ever presented on these debates, at least in the threads I have been in, are always the comparison of married male/female couples to single moms. In particular, using lesbian single moms when they are trying to show that SSM wouldn't work.
 
maquiscat said:
Show me the studies. As I said the only ones that anyone has ever presented on these debates, at least in the threads I have been in, are always the comparison of married male/female couples to single moms. In particular, using lesbian single moms when they are trying to show that SSM wouldn't work.
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Believe whatever you like but studies before the concept of gay marriage even existed show that children born to their married mother and father have lower rates of poverty, juvenile delinquency, drug and alcohol abuse, teen pregnancy and criminal conviction as an adult.
 
dixon01767 said:
Believe whatever you like but studies before the concept of gay marriage even existed show that children born to their married mother and father have lower rates of poverty, juvenile delinquency, drug and alcohol abuse, teen pregnancy and criminal conviction as an adult.
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As compared to what? If the only comparison is that of single parents, and/or they are not counting cohabitating the same as marriage, then we don't get to see how they compared to a male/female pair with a legal marriage. You can't say that poly is worse than 2 person legal marriage but better than single parenthood, unless you are comparing all three in the same study. without the actual configuration in the study, you can't say how they compare at all.
 
maquiscat said:
As compared to what?
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Children who are not born to their married mother and father. Of course.


maquiscat said:
If the only comparison is that of single parents,
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No, that is just the most common alternative. Many of those single mothers move on to marry someone other than the other biological parent.
 
dixon01767 said:
Children who are not born to their married mother and father. Of course.

No, that is just the most common alternative. Many of those single mothers move on to marry someone other than the other biological parent.
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Again, I have yet to see anyone who has presented a study here that would include step families, and adopted families. By what you are saying, the genetic parents are superior to them.
 
dixon01767 said:
Believe whatever you like but studies before the concept of gay marriage even existed show that children born to their married mother and father have lower rates of poverty, juvenile delinquency, drug and alcohol abuse, teen pregnancy and criminal conviction as an adult.
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Studies show it's actually best to be raised by a single transgender parent.
 
Deuce said:
Studies show it's actually best to be raised by a single transgender parent.
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Since there is a lack of a sarcasm indicator, I am going to hold you to the same standard as I do the others. Cite your study.
 
maquiscat said:
Since there is a lack of a sarcasm indicator, I am going to hold you to the same standard as I do the others. Cite your study.
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Dixon will have to go first.
 
dixon01767 said:
Its the most frequent option



You will need to point out what was false. I made no assertions about it being the only option.
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It is only most frequent in the US. Extended families are much more frequent elsewhere.

U.S. has world's highest rate of children living in single-parent households | Pew Research Center

And since extended families tend to do better, especially when compared to simply single parents, that should be encouraged.

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dixon01767 said:
I wouldn't consider it a real problem, but yes, cant any longer prefer the nuclear family because it offends the delicate sensibilities of the gays who can not participate
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That has zero to do with preferring other family types to nuclear. Nuclear is one that works, but not the only one and it, like almost every other family types doesnt work for everyone. Same sex couples are just as nuclear as the opposite sex couple who adopted their children or brought in children from a different relationship.

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dixon01767 said:
They are only concerned with the wellbeing of children and not concerned with government helping gays feel better about their homosexuality.
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Being concerned with the wellbeing of children recognizes that different family types work just as well, sometimes better, than bio mom and bio dad raising their children. The world is not black or white. Family types that work well to raise children in come in many different forms and you have no evidence that those other forms dont work. Claiming "nuclear works best" is a subjective claim that fails to take into account that most studies only compare nuclear to one other type of family (if you dont agree, post evidence to the contrary) and that even other types that are less frequent can provide better results for children, depending on situations.

Real life does not follow statistics, especially when raising children.

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Mugahigh said:
At least they cant breed, not without another persons help.
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Neither can about 10-15% of married opposite sex couples. So why does that matter exactly?

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maquiscat said:
Again, I have yet to see anyone who has presented a study here that would include step families, and adopted families. By what you are saying, the genetic parents are superior to them.
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Actually, if I recall adopted kids on average do better in studies 10-20 years ago back when virtually all adoptions were to a married man and woman and relatively higher incomes. Even with adopted kids included among those who were not born to their married mother and father, on average the children born to their married mother and father do better. Because the majority of the kids not born to their married mother and father are born to and dependent upon a single mother, and not a wealthy husband and wife who adopt them.
 
dixon01767 said:
Actually, if I recall adopted kids on average do better in studies 10-20 years ago back when virtually all adoptions were to a married man and woman and relatively higher incomes. Even with adopted kids included among those who were not born to their married mother and father, on average the children born to their married mother and father do better. Because the majority of the kids not born to their married mother and father are born to and dependent upon a single mother, and not a wealthy husband and wife who adopt them.
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You're still not showing the studies that make all these comparisons outside of single motherhood.
 
dixon01767 said:
You are demonstrating my point for me. Yes, the US has some of the highest rates in the world of single parents. But now our gays can feel better about their homosexuality which takes precedence over the wellbeing of children.
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Treating homosexuals as equals betters the well being of our children
 
dixon01767 said:
You are demonstrating my point for me. Yes, the US has some of the highest rates in the world of single parents. But now our gays can feel better about their homosexuality which takes precedence over the wellbeing of children.
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The two things are not related. Single parents raising children has no relation to same sex couples getting married nor even to them raising children. They are different types of families.

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