• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Asia Argento: Double Standard?

Sampson Simpson said:
I don't buy it for a second, I just googled her name with pictures of her and the guy laying in bed, he seems pretty happy to me. She is attractive. This is no way the same as a guy forcing themselves on women, because the reality is when it comes to sex men and woman are different. It does seem the kid was looking for money with his claim (I can be wrong without knowing specifics) because I found it hard to believe he would bring up sexual harassment charges for having sex with an attractive actress.

As I said, I could be wrong but this story doesn't smell right

Click to expand...

Come on.

If I said this kind of stuff about woman accusing a man, I'd be labeled a sexist by my friends on the left.

You can find lots of pictures of the women that accused Ailes, Sheen, Lauer, and Weinstein smiling, and even some of them praising him in public, but that didn't stop anybody from getting out the cross and looking for a hill - rightfully so.

If you start saying that simply because of physical size that women should be held to lower standards than men, you're just engaging in the kind of **** that MGTOW's do, only in reverse.
 
Sampson Simpson said:
I don't buy it for a second, I just googled her name with pictures of her and the guy laying in bed, he seems pretty happy to me. She is attractive. This is no way the same as a guy forcing themselves on women, because the reality is when it comes to sex men and woman are different. It does seem the kid was looking for money with his claim (I can be wrong without knowing specifics) because I found it hard to believe he would bring up sexual harassment charges for having sex with an attractive actress.

As I said, I could be wrong but this story doesn't smell right

Click to expand...

Come on.

If I said this kind of stuff about woman accusing a man, I'd be labeled a sexist by my friends on the left.

You can find lots of pictures of the women that accused Ailes, Sheen, Lauer, and Weinstein smiling, and even some of them praising them in public, but that didn't stop anybody from getting out the cross and looking for a hill - rightfully so.

If you start saying that simply because of physical size that women should be held to lower standards than men, you're just engaging in the kind of **** that MGTOW's do, only in reverse.
 
MovingPictures said:
Absolutely.

She pretty much forced herself on this guy, much like Weinstein did on other women. It's the height of hypocrisy to talk about sexual misconduct when you're paying people to keep silent about your own perversions.
Click to expand...

I used to fantasize about that happening to me when I was 17. Oh well.
 
ecofarm said:
There's a larger point to be had above the petty discussion of "double standards" based on one instance.
Click to expand...

Most certainly. And I am happy to discuss that point, which is: Should people be held to the same standards of sexual conduct, regardless of their sex? Or should an alleged offender's sex (along with their accuser's sex) be a social or legal defense to charges of sexual impropriety and misconduct?
 
Last edited:
Felis Leo said:
Most certainly. And I am happy to discuss that point, which is: Should people be held to the same standards of sexual conduct, regardless of their sex? Or should an alleged offender's sex (along with their accuser's sex) be a defense to charges of impropriety?
Click to expand...

That's a strawman and bogged in the petty victim narrative pushed by "double standard". Now you're gonna tell us about how life is so unfair for men and blah blah tissue please. Spare me.
 
ecofarm said:
For every one woman that sexually harasses or assaults a man, there are 10000 men that do it to a woman. Being more concerned about men than women is not a double standard, it's using stats to set priorities and live in the real world.

If there's a one in a million chance a purple person steals, and one is convicted of theft, I'm not gonna make a big deal.

Women sexually harassing and assaulting men is not a problem in this country. The opposite is a serious problem. I will address my concerns as such. That's real, not "double standard".
Click to expand...

This doesn't at all argue for different standards. Perhaps for where to focus limited resources when trying to help victims but not different standards of criminality or morality. Sexual abuse is sexual abuse is sexual abuse and the genders of those involved are utterly irrelevant.
 
Sampson Simpson said:
I don't buy it for a second, I just googled her name with pictures of her and the guy laying in bed, he seems pretty happy to me. She is attractive. This is no way the same as a guy forcing themselves on women, because the reality is when it comes to sex men and woman are different. It does seem the kid was looking for money with his claim (I can be wrong without knowing specifics) because I found it hard to believe he would bring up sexual harassment charges for having sex with an attractive actress.

As I said, I could be wrong but this story doesn't smell right

Click to expand...


The age of consent in California is 18. He was 17. That's statutory rape no matter how happy he looks.
 
ecofarm said:
That's a strawman and bogged in the petty victim narrative pushed by "double standard". Now you're gonna tell us about how life is so unfair for men and blah blah tissue please. Spare me.
Click to expand...

No, ecofarm, I have not done that. Let us not telescope the discussion to the end just because you have had a thousand similar conversations with people who use instances of women behaving badly as justification to dismiss allegations of men behaving badly. That is not what I am getting at. I want to discuss a basic question of principle with you, because I would like to think you are someone who actually thinks about these issues even though we may disagree on the ultimate conclusion. And the principle I want to discuss is whether individuals be held to the same standards of sexual conduct, regardless of their sex? And if not, why not?
 
Felis Leo said:
No, ecofarm, I have not done that. Let us not telescope the discussion to the end just because you have had a thousand similar conversations with people who use instances of women behaving badly as justification to dismiss allegations of men behaving badly. That is not what I am getting at. I want to discuss a basic question of principle with you, because I would like to think you are someone who actually thinks about these issues even though we may disagree on the ultimate conclusion. And the principle I want to discuss is whether individuals be held to the same standards of sexual conduct, regardless of their sex? And if not, why not?
Click to expand...

You're talking to a guy who thinks its not racism if the target is a white person. Of course he will hold the same sexist double standards when it comes to men.
 
TheGoverness said:
Article Here.



For those who don't already know, Asia Argento, a prominent voice in the #MeToo movement, was revealed to have paid off an sexual harassment victim due to an incident way back in 2013 with a young actor (who was 17 years old at the time). There is substantial evidence against her, and the pictures that TMZ acquired were released today.

Now, this incident is pretty interesting to me, for one seeing a prominent #MeToo accuser having the tables turned on her, and the double standard quite a few people have been pointing out. Some other notable #MeToo accusers, have responded to the NYT expose with a message to "be gentle". And some are pointing out the "convenient" timing that this story got released, suggesting that Harvey Weinstein was involved. In terms of how I personally feel about this, I really do see a double standard that's being played out here. It doesn't make sense to me to (rightfully) denounce people like Weinstein and Kevin Spacey for what they've done, and then give Asia Argento a slap on the wrist. Like, what sense does it make to defend her? She's just going to mar the image of the #MeToo movement, and make it look hypocritical. And how dumb is it to suggest that we should "be gentle" with her, when many of the men accused in the #MeToo wave were not given any such hesitance whatsoever? I agree that there should be levels of restraint before we make final judgement on the accused (basically wait for all the facts to come in), but it strikes me as extremely hypocritical coming from the same people that said we need to believe survivors of sexual assault. Why does that not apply to Ms. Argento? And others have pointed out that the reaction to this story would be vastly different had the genders been reversed in this situations. And for the most part, I agree with that. I think more people tend to dismiss or downplay male victims of sexual abuse, which is for a variety of reasons. But I think what the #MeToo movement needs to do now is do whatever they can to distance themselves from Asia. Show that no matter if you're a woman or a man: sexual harassment/assault will not be tolerated, justified, or downplayed.

But what are your thoughts? Do you think there is a double-standard in this situation?
Click to expand...

Addressed this last night:

https://www.debatepolitics.com/general-political-discussion/328553-asia-argento-me-too.html

Since then, and I see no mention in this thread, it's come out this was an ongoing affair for two or more years, not a one shot deal as Asia claimed, and e-mails she sent to "friends" bragged about "nailing a teenager."

I haven't seen the e-mails so don't ask me to verify them.

As far as being "gentle" with her, she deserves a hard boot in the butt. Not for doing a young stud, but for being a hypocrite. J'accuse. You all need to learn where that French phrase gained fame. A moment in time called "The Dreyfus Affair."
 
TheGoverness said:
Article Here.



For those who don't already know, Asia Argento, a prominent voice in the #MeToo movement, was revealed to have paid off an sexual harassment victim due to an incident way back in 2013 with a young actor (who was 17 years old at the time). There is substantial evidence against her, and the pictures that TMZ acquired were released today.

Now, this incident is pretty interesting to me, for one seeing a prominent #MeToo accuser having the tables turned on her, and the double standard quite a few people have been pointing out. Some other notable #MeToo accusers, have responded to the NYT expose with a message to "be gentle". And some are pointing out the "convenient" timing that this story got released, suggesting that Harvey Weinstein was involved. In terms of how I personally feel about this, I really do see a double standard that's being played out here. It doesn't make sense to me to (rightfully) denounce people like Weinstein and Kevin Spacey for what they've done, and then give Asia Argento a slap on the wrist. Like, what sense does it make to defend her? She's just going to mar the image of the #MeToo movement, and make it look hypocritical. And how dumb is it to suggest that we should "be gentle" with her, when many of the men accused in the #MeToo wave were not given any such hesitance whatsoever? I agree that there should be levels of restraint before we make final judgement on the accused (basically wait for all the facts to come in), but it strikes me as extremely hypocritical coming from the same people that said we need to believe survivors of sexual assault. Why does that not apply to Ms. Argento? And others have pointed out that the reaction to this story would be vastly different had the genders been reversed in this situations. And for the most part, I agree with that. I think more people tend to dismiss or downplay male victims of sexual abuse, which is for a variety of reasons. But I think what the #MeToo movement needs to do now is do whatever they can to distance themselves from Asia. Show that no matter if you're a woman or a man: sexual harassment/assault will not be tolerated, justified, or downplayed.

But what are your thoughts? Do you think there is a double-standard in this situation?
Click to expand...

I have a standard when it comes to accusations against public figures.. and that is 'unless there are 3 or more, it doesn't go beyond hearsay. The photos show that there was relation and contact. Since he was 17, what was the age of consent where they had the contact? If he was of the age of consent, how much consent was there??

I need more information to make a judgement. She should not be treated any differently than any body in that situation. Of course, I would ask the same questions if the genders were reversed too.
 
Gaius46 said:
The age of consent in California is 18. He was 17. That's statutory rape no matter how happy he looks.
Click to expand...

Was the encounter in California?

If so, throw the book at her.
 
Gaius46 said:
Yes. Los Angeles.
Click to expand...

It looks like that in California, since he was 16 or older, it is a misdemeanor offense, rather than a felony. If he was below 16, it would have been a felony.
 
RAMOSS said:
It looks like that in California, since he was 16 or older, it is a misdemeanor offense, rather than a felony. If he was below 16, it would have been a felony.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I didn’t look past what the age of consent is.
 
TheGoverness said:
Article Here.



For those who don't already know, Asia Argento, a prominent voice in the #MeToo movement, was revealed to have paid off an sexual harassment victim due to an incident way back in 2013 with a young actor (who was 17 years old at the time). There is substantial evidence against her, and the pictures that TMZ acquired were released today.

Now, this incident is pretty interesting to me, for one seeing a prominent #MeToo accuser having the tables turned on her, and the double standard quite a few people have been pointing out. Some other notable #MeToo accusers, have responded to the NYT expose with a message to "be gentle". And some are pointing out the "convenient" timing that this story got released, suggesting that Harvey Weinstein was involved. In terms of how I personally feel about this, I really do see a double standard that's being played out here. It doesn't make sense to me to (rightfully) denounce people like Weinstein and Kevin Spacey for what they've done, and then give Asia Argento a slap on the wrist. Like, what sense does it make to defend her? She's just going to mar the image of the #MeToo movement, and make it look hypocritical. And how dumb is it to suggest that we should "be gentle" with her, when many of the men accused in the #MeToo wave were not given any such hesitance whatsoever? I agree that there should be levels of restraint before we make final judgement on the accused (basically wait for all the facts to come in), but it strikes me as extremely hypocritical coming from the same people that said we need to believe survivors of sexual assault. Why does that not apply to Ms. Argento? And others have pointed out that the reaction to this story would be vastly different had the genders been reversed in this situations. And for the most part, I agree with that. I think more people tend to dismiss or downplay male victims of sexual abuse, which is for a variety of reasons. But I think what the #MeToo movement needs to do now is do whatever they can to distance themselves from Asia. Show that no matter if you're a woman or a man: sexual harassment/assault will not be tolerated, justified, or downplayed.

But what are your thoughts? Do you think there is a double-standard in this situation?
Click to expand...

If it's true, she is a tremendous ****ing asshole. I mean, it would be pretty wild to take someone to task for sexual harassment (which is good) when you yourself have engaged in some pretty strong sexual harassment yourself.

In terms of the response though, this is kind of what I've come to expect from a large sector of online feminists. There's a lot to talk about in terms of the good and the bad that the modern, online social justice movement has brought with it, but it's also created a very insular in-group/out-group dynamic and a reflexive "protect your own" response. I think the talking heads of the Twitter will be torn between going after her and protecting her, and I think that everyone else will agree that if she really did do this, she's a tremendous asshole and should be treated as such.

I think if anything this could be an instructive moment for the leaders of political movements, if nothing else than to remind them that they have to follow the rules of human decency, too.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom