Why is Donald Trump homophobic?

Absentglare said:

Honestly there's some merit to both of your sides here.

On the one hand, becoming familiar with a minority is a way to reduce prejudice toward that group.

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I would see in most cases it is the best way. Generally speaking prejudices are based on biases. Biases for the most part are based on misconceptions. That sometimes takes a long time but with the right people such prejudices will eventually be undone.

On the other hand, having friends who are black doesn't isn't real proof of not harboring racial prejudice.

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of course you can be racist against white people or Asians.

It's a bit like saying someone who is jogging or exercising at the gym can't be fat: they obviously still can be, but the behavior can work against the condition.

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I disagree it's kind of like saying someone who is skinny can't be fat.

MateoMtnClimber said:

How do either of you support a statement like that? As far as I know, the homophobic label is always (I'll say almost always to be safe) used in a context related to homosexuality. Religious people like to argue that they are not homophobic just because they are opposed to same sex marriage, but that is the definition of homophobia. To say, "I have gay friends and neighbors," makes a person no less homophobic than a racist person who has black friends and coworkers.

Anyway, my point is that he said the word means nothing nowadays. I assure you both that it means exactly what I said it means even if the occasional idiot uses words improperly.

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I think the disconnect is that there is a difference between disliking someone's lifestyle and disliking someone or being prejudice against a person for that lifestyle.

For instance, Ben Shapiro is religious and does not approve of homosexuality due to religious reasons. However, he and Dave Rubin seem to be good friends because Ben Shapiro does not use his beliefs to prejudge or automatically dislike him simply due to him being gay. If he hid behind his beliefs in order to not associate with purely due to his homosexuality then that would be homophobic.

Nap said:

I think the disconnect is that there is a difference between disliking someone's lifestyle and disliking someone or being prejudice against a person for that lifestyle.

For instance, Ben Shapiro is religious and does not approve of homosexuality due to religious reasons. However, he and Dave Rubin seem to be good friends because Ben Shapiro does not use his beliefs to prejudge or automatically dislike him simply due to him being gay. If he hid behind his beliefs in order to not associate with purely due to his homosexuality then that would be homophobic.

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Being gay is not a lifestyle. Yachting is a lifestyle. I understand your point about Shapiro, but he matches the definition of homophobic even if he occassionally interacts with homosexuals.

MateoMtnClimber said:

Being gay is not a lifestyle. Yachting is a lifestyle. I understand your point about Shapiro, but he matches the definition of homophobic even if he occassionally interacts with homosexuals.

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This is the very definition you posted in this thread:

MateoMtnClimber said:

It means, "having or showing a dislike of or prejudice against homosexual people."

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Notice the definition you provided indicates "homosexual people" and not homosexuality itself.

You are conflating the 2 and there is a distinct difference. I'm sure if Ben Shapiro didn't treat Dave Rubin with respect and kindness they wouldn't be friends. There is more to a person's character then just sexuality, race, religion, or political ideology. It is when you ignore all aspects of an individual other than his sexuality and dislike or show prejudice to that person that it becomes homophobic.

As a straight male, I find the image of 2 men having sex disgusting. However I could care less what a person does as long as it doesn't effect me and treat any gay man just the same as I treat any other person I meet. It is no different for many religious people that although they do not like the way that person lives they treat them the same as anyone else. Yes, there is a disturbing amount of homophobic people within religious communities and I find that repulsive and against the teachings of Christ.

DebateChallenge said:

Lots of the Trump haters like to say that Donald Trump is homophobic, well just what do they base that claim on? Trump did say that with gay marriage that the Supreme Court has declared it legal and so its a done deal so I don't see why you would call him homophobic after he said that.

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Trump’s not homophobic... he expresses scorn for all minorities more or less equally. See his delightful comments today. Being a homophobe is just part of his toxic stew: “Make America Hate Again.”

DebateChallenge said:

Lots of the Trump haters like to say that Donald Trump is homophobic, well just what do they base that claim on? Trump did say that with gay marriage that the Supreme Court has declared it legal and so its a done deal so I don't see why you would call him homophobic after he said that.

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Trump’s not homophobic... he expresses scorn for all minorities more or less equally. See his delightful comments today. Being a homophobe or appealing to that bias is just part of his toxic stew: “Make America Hate Again.”

CLAX1911 said:

I would see in most cases it is the best way. Generally speaking prejudices are based on biases. Biases for the most part are based on misconceptions. That sometimes takes a long time but with the right people such prejudices will eventually be undone.

of course you can be racist against white people or Asians.


I disagree it's kind of like saying someone who is skinny can't be fat.

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Having friends of a demographic isn't a direct measurement of prejudice about that demographic. Your version of the analogy is flawed.

Let's go to the inverse. If someone never met a black person, so they don't have any black friends, does that make them racist? Clearly not. It does mean that whatever impressions they have of blacks are from TV/movies/etc. and so they are therefore more likely to have those impressions built on stereotypes than someone with many black friends, but how they were raised to act on that lack of information is important.

Correspondingly, you could have lots of black friends and still harbor racial stereotypes against blacks. You could write off any friends who violate the stereotypes as 'exceptions', and keep applying the 'rule' to new black people.

It's not a cut and dry method. Using the "i have black friends, therefore i'm not a racist" defense is ultimately weak.

Absentglare said:

Having friends of a demographic isn't a direct measurement of prejudice about that demographic. Your version of the analogy is flawed.

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I never said it was a direct measurement but if you have Hindu friends you probably don't hate Hindus. And I disagree I believe my analogy was apt.

Let's go to the inverse. If someone never met a black person, so they don't have any black friends, does that make them racist? Clearly not.

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of course not but that's not really the inverse the inverse is you live in a society like we do and you don't have friends of a certain race or group. There may be a lot of variables for that I don't have any friends that are transgender because there's not that many of those people. I don't have any friends from Nepal because there's not a huge an immigrant group from Nepal.

It does mean that whatever impressions they have of blacks are from TV/movies/etc. and so they are therefore more likely to have those impressions built on stereotypes than someone with many black friends, but how they were raised to act on that lack of information is important.

Correspondingly, you could have lots of black friends and still harbor racial stereotypes against blacks. You could write off any friends who violate the stereotypes as 'exceptions', and keep applying the 'rule' to new black people.

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I don't think that harboring stereotypes is necessarily racist. It can be, but if you are unwilling to recognize that stereotypes are generality and don't really apply to the individual is say you are the Absolute opposite of a racist person.

It's not a cut and dry method. Using the "i have black friends, therefore i'm not a racist" defense is ultimately weak.

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when in the discussion and telling somebody that absolutely I agree with you 100%. But if I measure my friends on the personality and their relationship to me and not by the race religion sexuality whatever I can know that I for myself and not prejudiced against those things.