• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

No Survivors After Ukrainian Airplane With 176 Aboard Crashes in Iran

Rogue Valley

Lead or get out of the way
DP Veteran
Joined
Apr 18, 2013
Messages
94,039
Reaction score
82,282
Location
Barsoom
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
No Survivors After Ukrainian Airplane With 176 Aboard Crashes in Iran

ENvzatpWoAAQoWy.png

Part of the tail from the stricken airplane.

1/8/19
A Ukrainian airliner crashed shortly after take-off from Tehran early on Wednesday, bursting into flames and killing all 176 people on board. Debris and smoldering engine parts from the Boeing 737, which carrier Ukraine International Airlines said was last serviced two days ago, were strewn across a field southwest of the Iranian capital where rescue workers in face masks laid out scores of body bags. Among the victims were 82 Iranians, 63 Canadians, 11 Ukrainians, 10 Swedes, three Germans and three Britons, Ukrainian Foreign Minister Vadym Prystaiko said. Most passengers were in transit, the airline said. The accident occurred as confrontation between Iran and the United States threatens to trigger a wider conflict in the Middle East, and officials cautioned that speculation about what happened was premature. It was the Kiev-based carrier's first fatal crash, and it said it was doing everything possible to establish the cause. Under international rules, responsibility for investigating the crash lies with Iran, and Iranian state television said both of the plane's black box voice and data recorders had been found. The semi-official Mehr news agency quoted the head of Iran's civil aviation organization as saying it was not clear which country Iran would send the black boxes to analyze the data, but it would not give them to Boeing.

Safety experts say airliner accidents are rarely triggered by a single cause and that it typically takes months of investigation to understand all the factors behind them. In Paris, the maker of the plane's engines, French-U.S. firm CFM - co-owned by General Electric and France’s Safran - said speculation regarding the cause was premature. Iranian TV said the crash was due to unspecified technical problems, and Iranian media quoted a local aviation official as saying the pilot did not declare an emergency. The plane that crashed was a three-year-old Boeing 737-800NG en route to Kiev. Its last scheduled maintenance was on Jan. 6, the airline said. The 737-800 is one of the world’s most-flown models with a good safety record and does not have the software feature implicated in crashes of the 737 MAX. Modern aircraft are designed and certified to cope with an engine failure shortly after take-off and to fly for extended periods on one engine. However, an uncontained engine failure releasing shrapnel can cause damage to other aircraft systems. Under international rules, Ukraine would be party to the investigation, and the United States would usually be accredited as the country where the jet was designed and built. France, where engine maker CFM has half its activities, may also be involved. There was no immediate word on whether the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board would be involved. The NTSB usually invites Boeing to give technical advice in such investigations.

Terrible news. My deep condolences to the families of all the deceased. Whatever occurred happened very fast, no more than two minutes after takeoff.

I've flown this carrier (Ukraine International Airlines) and this airplane model many times with never a problem. I recall that these UIA airliner models use bio-fuel.

According to UIA, this was a brand-new airliner purchased directly from Boeing in 2016 and last service-tested on January 6.

Related: Ukrainian Plane Crashes In Iran, Killing All 176 People Aboard
 
No Survivors After Ukrainian Airplane With 176 Aboard Crashes in Iran
...
Terrible news. My deep condolences to the families of all the deceased. Whatever occurred happened very fast, no more than two minutes after takeoff.
I've flown this carrier (Ukraine International Airlines) and this airplane model many times with never a problem. I recall that these UIA airliner models use bio-fuel.
According to UIA, this was a brand-new airliner purchased directly from Boeing in 2016 and last service-tested on January 6.
Related: Ukrainian Plane Crashes In Iran, Killing All 176 People Aboard


We will not give the black boxes to the manufacturer (Boeing) and the Americans,” Iran Civil Aviation Organization head Ali Abedzadeh was quoted by the Mehr News Agency as saying.

... “The two black boxes of the Ukranian 737 aeroplane that crashed this morning have been found,” said the civil aviation authority’s spokesman, Reza Jafarzadeh, according to semi-official news agency ISNA. ..."


Iran won't hand over black boxes from Ukraine airliner that crashed, killing 176 | The Times of Israel


https://www.debatepolitics.com/brea...senger-jet-crashes-iran-9.html#post1071149808
 
We will not give the black boxes to the manufacturer (Boeing) and the Americans,” Iran Civil Aviation Organization head Ali Abedzadeh was quoted by the Mehr News Agency as saying.

... “The two black boxes of the Ukranian 737 aeroplane that crashed this morning have been found,” said the civil aviation authority’s spokesman, Reza Jafarzadeh, according to semi-official news agency ISNA. ..."


Iran won't hand over black boxes from Ukraine airliner that crashed, killing 176 | The Times of Israel


https://www.debatepolitics.com/brea...senger-jet-crashes-iran-9.html#post1071149808

Iran will probably hand them over to either France (engine manufacturer) or Ukraine (airliner owner). Boeing will indeed receive the black-boxes data.
 
My condolences to our Canadian brothers and sisters who lost loved ones in the attack.
 
Was this an attack?

I don't know. It's possible Iranian air defenses accidentally shot down the flight during the chaotic scene last night. Or maybe it was an accident. I didn't intend my words to be an affirmation towards either, but it's too late to edit the post.
 
Shot down by mistake by Iran not the first time a civilian plane got wasted like this. My bet is on twitchy Iranian air defense forces lighting up a plane they thought was the American counterattack.
 
No Survivors After Ukrainian Airplane With 176 Aboard Crashes in Iran

ENvzatpWoAAQoWy.png

Part of the tail from the stricken airplane.



Terrible news. My deep condolences to the families of all the deceased. Whatever occurred happened very fast, no more than two minutes after takeoff.

I've flown this carrier (Ukraine International Airlines) and this airplane model many times with never a problem. I recall that these UIA airliner models use bio-fuel.

According to UIA, this was a brand-new airliner purchased directly from Boeing in 2016 and last service-tested on January 6.

Related: Ukrainian Plane Crashes In Iran, Killing All 176 People Aboard

My condolences as well to the families and friends of those who lost loved ones in this crash. I do not want to pour fuel on the flames of conspiracy theory, but if this was indeed a newer well-maintained plane as you say, I find it unlikely that its crash was due to technical malfunction. As many here have stated and I speculated before on another thread, I think the Iranian Air Defense Force must have been on high alert yesterday and readied for an American counterattack after they launched their ballistic missiles. That they might have fired a SAM at the jet by accident in the fog of war is not outside the realm of possibility.
 
My condolences as well to the families and friends of those who lost loved ones in this crash. I do not want to pour fuel on the flames of conspiracy theory, but if this was indeed a newer well-maintained plane as you say, I find it unlikely that its crash was due to technical malfunction. As many here have stated and I speculated before on another thread, I think the Iranian Air Defense Force must have been on high alert yesterday and readied for an American counterattack after they launched their ballistic missiles. That they might have fired a SAM at the jet by accident in the fog of war is not outside the realm of possibility.

I also have considered this possibility. Witnesses say and a video shows that the plane was already on fire as it descended.

Pilots and planes are quite able to keep flying if an engine goes out. But if something explodes and the shrapnel severs electronic/hydraulic lines, that is oftentimes fatal.

The pilot never even had time to signal an emergency. Something here went wrong very very quickly.
 
NzIweDQ0Mi9jX2MvdV8xL2NjXzY5ZjVhL3AvMjAyMC8wMS8wOC85NjcvNjM2L2I2OGRhYWI2OWI5NjRhN2FiZDk0MmQ0NjZjODlhMmI0LmpwZWc=.jpeg

The Boeing 737-800NG (Next Generation) aircraft model of Ukraine International Airlines that crashed in Iran.

Boeing 737-800 that crashed in Tehran 'most popular model in skies'

1/8/20
The Boeing 737-800 model used by Ukraine International Airlines (UIA) that crashed in Tehran on Wednesday is the most popular aircraft in the sky, used by airlines from Ryanair to American Airlines. Boeing’s short-haul workhorse is the predecessor to the 737 Max, the model that was grounded after two fatal crashes in 2018 and 2019. The 737-800, a single-aisle aircraft that can carry 189 passengers, was launched in September 1994 as part of the 737 Next Generation (737 NG) lineup. As of February 2019 more than 4,900 had been delivered, although it has been superseded by the 737 Max, the US manufacturer’s fastest-selling model. More recently some Boeing 737-800 planes have had safety issues, with groundings caused by cracks between the wing and fuselage in the so-called “pickle fork” structure. (This UIA craft underwent a thorough examination/test on 1/6/20 - Me) The UIA plane had taken off from Imam Khomeini international airport in the Iranian capital when a fire struck one of its engines, said Qassem Biniaz, a spokesman for Iran’s road and transportation ministry. The pilot of the aircraft then lost control of the plane, sending it crashing to the ground, Biniaz was quoted as saying by the state-run Irna news agency. (This individual can't possibly know what went wrong at this early date - Me)

However, Ukraine’s embassy in Iran dropped an initial reference to engine failure as the cause of a Ukrainian plane crash outside Tehran on Wednesday. It said in a second statement that the causes had not been disclosed and that any previous comments were not official. All Boeing 737 NG planes use CFM56 engines manufactured by CFM, a joint venture between the US manufacturer General Electric and the French manufacturer Safran. The engines are also used on Airbus planes, including the A320. There are more than 8,000 CFM56 engines in service on 737 aircraft worldwide, making it the most popular engine-aircraft combination in commercial aviation, according to the joint venture’s website. Last month CFM said the engines had completed a billion flight hours, the first engine family to do so.

This Boeing is the most popular and widely flown passenger airliner in the history of aviation.

Ukraine International Airlines Crew of Flight PS752;

UIA Chief Pilot Volodymyr Gaponenko graduated from the Flight School of Civil Aviation in Kropyvnytskiy which is currently a part of the Kyiv-based National Aviation University. Gaponenko piloted Boeing 737 planes for more than 11,600 hours during his career, according to UIA.

UIA Pilot Oleksiy Naumkin had more than 12,000 hours of experience as a pilot of Boeing 737 planes.

UIA First Officer Serhiy Khomenko spent 7,600 hours in the sky with Boeing 737 aircraft.

Kateryna Statnik - Fight Attendant
Ihor Matkov - Flight Attendant
Maria Mykytiuk - Flight Attendant
Denys Lykhno - Flight Attendant
Valeria Ovcharuk - Flight Attendant
Yulia Sologub - Flight Attendant
 
My condolences as well to the families and friends of those who lost loved ones in this crash. I do not want to pour fuel on the flames of conspiracy theory, but if this was indeed a newer well-maintained plane as you say, I find it unlikely that its crash was due to technical malfunction. As many here have stated and I speculated before on another thread, I think the Iranian Air Defense Force must have been on high alert yesterday and readied for an American counterattack after they launched their ballistic missiles. That they might have fired a SAM at the jet by accident in the fog of war is not outside the realm of possibility.

Felis Leo et al.:

The investigations are underway and eventually we will learn what happened. In the meantime, let the professionals do their work undisturbed and uninfluenced by the storm of politics surrounding this crash.

RIP to those who lost their lives and deepest sympathies to those who have survived these departed loved ones.

V/R.
Evilroddy.
 
5e16cff96c779.jpeg


I don't believe in a coincidence and apparently neither does Ukraine. A jumbo cargo plane departed for Iran with Search and Rescue (SAR) teams, Boeing 737-800NG maintenance specialists, forensic crash experts, and military personnel familiar with Iranian/Russian anti-air weapon systems.
 
Shot down by mistake by Iran not the first time a civilian plane got wasted like this. My bet is on twitchy Iranian air defense forces lighting up a plane they thought was the American counterattack.

You don’t shoot down civilian planes by mistake.
Iran is not that stupid. The plane was leaving Iran. The military knows which commercial planes are entering and leaving the country. Unlikely the plane was damaged by a missile.
 
You don’t shoot down civilian planes by mistake.

Says who?

The US shot down Iran Air Flight 655 on 3 July 1988 killing all 290 on board.

A Russian Buk missile crew shot down Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 over Ukraine on 17 July 2014 killing all 298 on board.
 
You don’t shoot down civilian planes by mistake.
Iran is not that stupid. The plane was leaving Iran. The military knows which commercial planes are entering and leaving the country. Unlikely the plane was damaged by a missile.

Part of TOR M1 missile found near Ukrainian airliner crash site.

miss.jpg

Article
 
Back
Top Bottom