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More on the homeless Jesus statue

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it's just me

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I have been thinking about this since it first came up.

Someone commented that the money would have been better used to feed and clothe the homeless, or something to that effect. I sort of agree. Boy, what I could have done with the money they spent on that statue! But then it would have been gone, this statue will be around for a long time, and everybody who sees it will be reminded that Jesus had no home, and he says so in Luke 9:58 and Matthew 8:20. The statue also reminds me that whatever you do for the least of these you have also done for him. I don't know if the people I knew at St. Alban's are still there, but I know at least three of them were active in prison ministry, a cause near and dear to my heart. In any case, God has apperently used the gift they offered in ways we could not have expected - people are touched by the sculpture, people who have never been to St. Alban's or Davidson, N.C.

I caught myself thinking of my own response to one of the comments about the money spent. in Matt 26:11 Jesus says this about the woman who annointed him at the home of Simon the leper:

For you always have the poor with you; but you do not always have Me. For when she poured this perfume on My body, she did it to prepare Me for burial. Truly I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what this woman has done will also be spoken of in memory of her.”
Click to expand...

The message has outlasted any offering that could have been purchased with the money the ointment would have sold for. The sculpture is larger and has reached more people than the money they spent on it. Maybe they didn't plan it that way, maybe they did. But God appears to be using it.
 
it's just me said:
I have been thinking about this since it first came up.

Someone commented that the money would have been better used to feed and clothe the homeless, or something to that effect. I sort of agree. Boy, what I could have done with the money they spent on that statue! But then it would have been gone, this statue will be around for a long time, and everybody who sees it will be reminded that Jesus had no home, and he says so in Luke 9:58 and Matthew 8:20. The statue also reminds me that whatever you do for the least of these you have also done for him. I don't know if the people I knew at St. Alban's are still there, but I know at least three of them were active in prison ministry, a cause near and dear to my heart. In any case, God has apperently used the gift they offered in ways we could not have expected - people are touched by the sculpture, people who have never been to St. Alban's or Davidson, N.C.

I caught myself thinking of my own response to one of the comments about the money spent. in Matt 26:11 Jesus says this about the woman who annointed him at the home of Simon the leper:

The message has outlasted any offering that could have been purchased with the money the ointment would have sold for. The sculpture is larger and has reached more people than the money they spent on it. Maybe they didn't plan it that way, maybe they did. But God appears to be using it.
Click to expand...

Homelessness is something I think the Church needs to focus on more, not just bandaiding it, but systemically addressing it.
 
RGacky3 said:
Homelessness is something I think the Church needs to focus on more, not just bandaiding it, but systemically addressing it.
Click to expand...

Faith communities do a lot to help people to keep them from ending up homeless in the first place. One can see society's failure much easier than its success when it comes to preventative efforts.
 
RGacky3 said:
Homelessness is something I think the Church needs to focus on more, not just bandaiding it, but systemically addressing it.
Click to expand...

It's never enough. There will always be more and more homeless and not enough people to do the work. People will happily vote away their paychecks in the form of taxes and they give us a pittance to do this kind of work. Think we get a 10% tithe? Forget it. We get people's pocket change. Not that I'm complaining but the people who want us to do more need to step up to the plate. Then there are always the people who think we need to pay taxes on the pittance we get.

Not trying to be snarky, these are just the facts. A couple of winters ago I tried to get a coat drive going when I noticed the homeless walking around in the dead of winter without adequate protection from the cold. Think I could arouse any interest with my co-workers? Nope, they put all the burden on the downtown Mission. Of course, if the Mission had the resources the homeless wouldn't have been walking around without coats.

It's always somebody else's responsibility. Want to do something about homelessness? Next time you see a homeless person take him to Wal-Mart and buy him a coat. It's not much but it's a start and that's one less coat I will have to worry about.
 
It's similar to the conundrum with mission trips. The trend of Christians going on short term mission trips doesn't make a whole lot of economic sense. People spend thousands of dollars travelling to remote regions to do things they could have hired local laborers to do for a tiny fraction of that cost. You can send a team of 15 people to a remote region to build a well at a cost of $75,000 or you can just send that money to a missionary or pastor living in that region and they can hire laborers to build 10 or 15 wells for that amount. It makes no sense to waste that kind of money sending people to do things locals could do. But that's only because we aren't taking the human psyche into account. After those people return from their $5,000 mission trip, they return with a renewed sense of purpose, a passion to help the needy, and a love for the region they served at; many of them will begin to contribute regularly towards the long term projects and ongoing needs in that region. Some of those who go on such trips will even spread the word about the work being done in that region and will get others to give or to sign up to go next time. Having names and faces to go with the people they are helping boosts the giving tremendously. That wasteful $5,000 mission trip often turns into a lifetime of financial support for the region.

I can see the same occurring with a statue like tihs one. It may seem like a waste of money, but the inspiration it provides for people may wind up having a bigger and longer lasting impact than if that money had been spent directly on the homeless.
 
CrabCake said:
It's similar to the conundrum with mission trips. The trend of Christians going on short term mission trips doesn't make a whole lot of economic sense. People spend thousands of dollars travelling to remote regions to do things they could have hired local laborers to do for a tiny fraction of that cost. You can send a team of 15 people to a remote region to build a well at a cost of $75,000 or you can just send that money to a missionary or pastor living in that region and they can hire laborers to build 10 or 15 wells for that amount. It makes no sense to waste that kind of money sending people to do things locals could do. But that's only because we aren't taking the human psyche into account. After those people return from their $5,000 mission trip, they return with a renewed sense of purpose, a passion to help the needy, and a love for the region they served at; many of them will begin to contribute regularly towards the long term projects and ongoing needs in that region. Some of those who go on such trips will even spread the word about the work being done in that region and will get others to give or to sign up to go next time. Having names and faces to go with the people they are helping boosts the giving tremendously. That wasteful $5,000 mission trip often turns into a lifetime of financial support for the region.

I can see the same occurring with a statue like tihs one. It may seem like a waste of money, but the inspiration it provides for people may wind up having a bigger and longer lasting impact than if that money had been spent directly on the homeless.
Click to expand...

We normally do the latter in our mission efforts, because of the favorable exchange rate we can get a lot more accomplished with less money. If we had the money to do in person missions, we could certainly see the value in in person missions, as it is, we have no vocational missionaries because we are all missionaries, and we usually send someone once or twice a year to see how we can help out. It is hard to minimize the value of personal experience, though.
 
Ive thought more about this, one of the arguments people use is that they want to see jesus as helping others, as helping the homeless himself rather than being in need of help. This was the complaint of Cindy Castano Swannack who called the police on the statue.

If you look through the bible, you see often people helping Jesus. They wash his feet in wine, they give him their last money for a burial cloth. Literally this man is helpless but that he can cast demons out of pigs and walk on water.

And Jesus said to him, “Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay his head.”
 
Its also interesting the cultural perspective of calling the police on someone sleeping in public. When I lived in istanbul Turkey, the defining thing was being laid back for Turks. If you were a gardener in Turkey and wanted to take a nap, it was perfectly okay to lay right down on your back in the dirt even if a few feet away a busy sidewalk had pedestrians. Also, being supine on a park bench was extremely common. If a Turk was sitting down and felt like taking a nap, this was culturally okay. Here we see police being called in the USA.

It also seems that Jesus means different things culturally. Americans favor dictatorship and total subjugation as a tool for controlling the populace. So in the USA Jesus is a dictator; hence, he must never be down with eyes closed. A dictator must always be upright. In Latin America maybe the concept of jesus is different. The Latin American pope these days approved of this statue and goes out amongst the poor dressed like them.

'Jesus the Homeless' sculpture may find home in Rome

20131213nw24.jpg
 
michijo said:
If you look through the bible, you see often people helping Jesus. They wash his feet in wine, they give him their last money for a burial cloth. Literally this man is helpless but that he can cast demons out of pigs and walk on water.
Click to expand...

At least once a week someone makes a claim that makes me want to say "What Bible are you reading?"
 
it's just me said:
I have been thinking about this since it first came up.

Someone commented that the money would have been better used to feed and clothe the homeless, or something to that effect. I sort of agree. Boy, what I could have done with the money they spent on that statue! But then it would have been gone, this statue will be around for a long time, and everybody who sees it will be reminded that Jesus had no home, and he says so in Luke 9:58 and Matthew 8:20. The statue also reminds me that whatever you do for the least of these you have also done for him. I don't know if the people I knew at St. Alban's are still there, but I know at least three of them were active in prison ministry, a cause near and dear to my heart. In any case, God has apperently used the gift they offered in ways we could not have expected - people are touched by the sculpture, people who have never been to St. Alban's or Davidson, N.C.

I caught myself thinking of my own response to one of the comments about the money spent. in Matt 26:11 Jesus says this about the woman who annointed him at the home of Simon the leper:

For you always have the poor with you; but you do not always have Me. For when she poured this perfume on My body, she did it to prepare Me for burial. Truly I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what this woman has done will also be spoken of in memory of her.”

The message has outlasted any offering that could have been purchased with the money the ointment would have sold for. The sculpture is larger and has reached more people than the money they spent on it. Maybe they didn't plan it that way, maybe they did. But God appears to be using it.
Click to expand...

I also thought of Matthew 26:11. The sculpture is beautiful and provocative, and you're right: You cannot put a price on the changing of just one human heart.
 
nota bene said:
I also thought of Matthew 26:11. The sculpture is beautiful and provocative, and you're right: You cannot put a price on the changing of just one human heart.
Click to expand...

I have two or three wall crosses around here, but my favorite is a replica of the San Damiano cross:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/San_Damiano-Interior.JPG

It depicts the Lord as standing triumphantly, arms raised, head up, surrounded by a great cloud of witnesses. That's the way some of the citizens of Davidson prefer to see him, and I am very sympathetic to that point of view. I wouldn't fault anybody for that. But at the same time I can also imagine him camped out along the road somewhere with his followers sleeping on the ground just the way you see it in the sculpture. Nobody can relate to crucifixion, but if you have ever lost your home or had to leave in the middle of the night because of natural disaster or fire, you can relate to this.
 
Christians are pretty self righteous when it comes to helping the homeless or giving food to the needy. Its hard to understand, but these whitebread Americans believe only they are the true benefactors of the needy, and that if a Krishna or Buddhist feeds the poor, then they are not doing it right, because they are not somehow doing it for the Christian God, which to me sounds like they are doing it for some kind of fringe benefits in heaven rather than feeling sorry for the poor, even though Hare Krishnas have a vast international network that feeds the poor and those pushed down by military strife.

Hare Krishna Food for Life - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
michijo said:
Christians are pretty self righteous when it comes to helping the homeless or giving food to the needy. Its hard to understand, but these whitebread Americans believe only they are the true benefactors of the needy, and that if a Krishna or Buddhist feeds the poor, then they are not doing it right, because they are not somehow doing it for the Christian God, which to me sounds like they are doing it for some kind of fringe benefits in heaven rather than feeling sorry for the poor, even though Hare Krishnas have a vast international network that feeds the poor and those pushed down by military strife.

Hare Krishna Food for Life - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Click to expand...

I think you need to speak for yourself, son, don't come in here wrecking this thread with your racist screed.
 
michijo said:
Christians are pretty self righteous when it comes to helping the homeless or giving food to the needy. Its hard to understand, but these whitebread Americans believe only they are the true benefactors of the needy, and that if a Krishna or Buddhist feeds the poor, then they are not doing it right, because they are not somehow doing it for the Christian God, which to me sounds like they are doing it for some kind of fringe benefits in heaven rather than feeling sorry for the poor, even though Hare Krishnas have a vast international network that feeds the poor and those pushed down by military strife.

Hare Krishna Food for Life - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Click to expand...



Moderator's Warning:
Wrong venue for this kind of baiting, and it will not be tolerated here.
 
RGacky3 said:
Homelessness is something I think the Church needs to focus on more, not just bandaiding it, but systemically addressing it.
Click to expand...

Homelessness is very tricky. Have you ever tried to think of a solution for it? You could build a million houses and give them away to the homeless but many non-homeless people will end up with these free houses. I was reading a thread somewhere in here about Utah having a successful strategy for combatting homelessness but I can't remember what it was.
 
RGacky3 said:
Homelessness is something I think the Church needs to focus on more, not just bandaiding it, but systemically addressing it.
Click to expand...


And as I have shown--a single teaching from Jesus would solve manys problems--but teachers of darkness refuse to teach it--

Matt 6:33--Therefore, keep on seeking first the kingdom and his( Jehovah) righteousness, and all these other things will be added.( matt 6-Sustenance, covering, spirituality)==this is a promise from Jesus that his Father( Jehovah) would provide all 3 things daily if needed if they applied that single teaching) and its 100% truth--but they will not teach it.
Its as Jesus taught---- You do not know the one who sent me( Father=Jehovah)
Jesus as well called the one who sent him( Father) THE ONLY TRUE GOD( John 17:1-6,26--verse 6=Jehovah, 26=Jehovah)--- they refuse to believe Jesus over schooled mens dogmas.
This is the true God--John 4:22-24

they are pulling in billions to hide the true God to tickle ears with--you are saved or born again--yet not one of them has seen a single name written in the book of life, nor can they read anothers true heart, nor do they have a clue who can endure till the end( death or Har-mageddon)Matt 10:22---- from these I say---RUN.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
Homelessness is very tricky. Have you ever tried to think of a solution for it? You could build a million houses and give them away to the homeless but many non-homeless people will end up with these free houses. I was reading a thread somewhere in here about Utah having a successful strategy for combatting homelessness but I can't remember what it was.
Click to expand...

basically they are giving them a place to live. giving them a job coordinator to help get them trained in some kind of skill and they are helping them actually get jobs.
all for less than what they would spend on them still living on the street.

they have a lot of un-rented houses and apartments. of course they have to follow the guidelines or they lose it, but it appears to be working.
 
kjw47 said:
And as I have shown--a single teaching from Jesus would solve manys problems--but teachers of darkness refuse to teach it--

Matt 6:33--Therefore, keep on seeking first the kingdom and his( Jehovah) righteousness, and all these other things will be added.( matt 6-Sustenance, covering, spirituality)==this is a promise from Jesus that his Father( Jehovah) would provide all 3 things daily if needed if they applied that single teaching) and its 100% truth--but they will not teach it.
Its as Jesus taught---- You do not know the one who sent me( Father=Jehovah)
Jesus as well called the one who sent him( Father) THE ONLY TRUE GOD( John 17:1-6,26--verse 6=Jehovah, 26=Jehovah)--- they refuse to believe Jesus over schooled mens dogmas.
This is the true God--John 4:22-24

they are pulling in billions to hide the true God to tickle ears with--you are saved or born again--yet not one of them has seen a single name written in the book of life, nor can they read anothers true heart, nor do they have a clue who can endure till the end( death or Har-mageddon)Matt 10:22---- from these I say---RUN.
Click to expand...

not really. only the people that want help will get it. those that don't won't.
you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.
 
RGacky3 said:
Homelessness is something I think the Church needs to focus on more, not just bandaiding it, but systemically addressing it.
Click to expand...

in order to fix homelessness you have to fix people and that is not an easy thing to do.
 
Deuteronomy 27:15
 
ludin said:
not really. only the people that want help will get it. those that don't won't.
you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.
Click to expand...


I Agree-- and God gave every mortal living the best avenue--- This is my son the beloved, in whom I am well pleased---LISTEN TO HIM. Most will not. It interferes with the seeking of $ and pleasures. 2Timothy 3
So the whole reason for all the hatred, starvation, homelessness, greed, lusts, drunkenness, homosexuality, spiritism, etc,etc,etc all the way down the line--they refuse to do as God told them to do.. If they listened to Jesus--love would be their motive in everything. So whose fault is it? by their own free will they choose the path they walk.
But as well govts and false religions--divide humans--Jesus brings them together as one, united under Jehovah and him.
 
it's just me said:
I have been thinking about this since it first came up.

Someone commented that the money would have been better used to feed and clothe the homeless, or something to that effect. I sort of agree. Boy, what I could have done with the money they spent on that statue! But then it would have been gone, this statue will be around for a long time, and everybody who sees it will be reminded that Jesus had no home, and he says so in Luke 9:58 and Matthew 8:20. The statue also reminds me that whatever you do for the least of these you have also done for him. I don't know if the people I knew at St. Alban's are still there, but I know at least three of them were active in prison ministry, a cause near and dear to my heart. In any case, God has apperently used the gift they offered in ways we could not have expected - people are touched by the sculpture, people who have never been to St. Alban's or Davidson, N.C.

I caught myself thinking of my own response to one of the comments about the money spent. in Matt 26:11 Jesus says this about the woman who annointed him at the home of Simon the leper:



The message has outlasted any offering that could have been purchased with the money the ointment would have sold for. The sculpture is larger and has reached more people than the money they spent on it. Maybe they didn't plan it that way, maybe they did. But God appears to be using it.
Click to expand...

Interesting.

With all due respect - I don't understand why you need a statue to remind yourself of any of that since you're a believer. Throughout religious history a lot of religious sculptures, effigies, and reliefs were never to give more support to the followers, but to witness to non-believers and send a deeper message.

If Christ was on earth and we asked him 'do we use this money to erect a statue to you? Or this money to feed the homeless?' what do you think he'd say? I don't think he'd really be too concerned about yet another idol to himself.

When it comes to money and religion - having been raised by a religious family - I always found it offensive that people would give us things like free dental care and discounts on store bought goods because my father was a minister. I saw it as my father taking advantage of people even though, I'm sure, they did it willingly on their own to show appreciation and gratitude. Still - it always rubbed me raw. I favored charity - helping others, not us.
 
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Aunt Spiker said:
Interesting.

With all due respect - I don't understand why you need a statue to remind yourself of any of that since you're a believer. Throughout religious history a lot of religious sculptures, effigies, and reliefs were never to give more support to the followers, but to witness to non-believers and send a deeper message.

If Christ was on earth and we asked him 'do we use this money to erect a statue to you? Or this money to feed the homeless?' what do you think he'd say? I don't think he'd really be too concerned about yet another idol to himself.

When it comes to money and religion - having been raised by a religious family - I always found it offensive that people would give us things like free dental care and discounts on store bought goods because my father was a minister. I saw it as my father taking advantage of people even though, I'm sure, they did it willingly on their own to show appreciation and gratitude. Still - it always rubbed me raw. I favored charity - helping others, not us.
Click to expand...

Not my monkeys, not my circus, St. A's is not my church, I just happened to attend a few times, which makes me more qualified to speak on what they were doing than someone who had never heard of the place prior to the "Homeless Jesus" statue.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Throughout religious history a lot of religious sculptures, effigies, and reliefs were never to give more support to the followers, but to witness to non-believers and send a deeper message.
Click to expand...

Can you give some examples?
 
vasuderatorrent said:
Homelessness is very tricky. Have you ever tried to think of a solution for it? You could build a million houses and give them away to the homeless but many non-homeless people will end up with these free houses. I was reading a thread somewhere in here about Utah having a successful strategy for combatting homelessness but I can't remember what it was.
Click to expand...

It Depends on the cause, I say deal With the cause first, and then have some Public housing for those that need it .

For example, having state banks, would put a HUGE check and Balance on banks screwing People on Mortgages, having help for the unemployed to get back on their feet would help a lot.

Drug adiction and alcohol addiction treatment centres.

Centres for abused children and spouces ... and so on.

It's not a full solution, but moving in that direction helps.
 
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