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"144,000 will go to heaven", according to JW.

kjw47 said:
All living will help turn the earth into a paradise--
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So, no cheap 3rd world labor?
Pretty pricey project.
We better do a cost-benefit analysis......what price paradise?
the righteous will reside upon it forever.
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Okay....and I'm not mocking your beliefs.
How does one define righteous?
Clearly, Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot are goners.
But what about the typical semi-righteous humans?
Not perfect, but not monstrous.
Do the semi-righteous have to live in a place like Reno, while the totally righteous get beachfront property?
 
In a revelation from the Lord give to Joseph Smith found in the Doctrine of Covenants, Joseph asks about the 144,000:

D&C 77:
11 Q. "What are we to understand by sealing the one hundred and forty-four thousand, out of all the tribes of Israel—twelve thousand out of every tribe?"

A. "We are to understand that those who are sealed are high priests, ordained unto the holy order of God, to administer the everlasting gospel; for they are they who are ordained out of every nation, kindred, tongue, and people, by the angels to whom is given power over the nations of the earth, to bring as many as will come to the church of the Firstborn."
 
The Jehovah's Witness teaching on the 144,000 strikes me as more biblical than traditional evangelical views. The story of the bible seems to be one of God restoring the world, not of God abandoning it and taking us away to heaven. Repeatedly, the bible talks about certain people "inheriting the Earth", about God making all things new, about God reconciling all things to himself, etc. The bible teaching about our hope seems to be, not that we would abandon this place, but rather that God will make everything right on Earth. I find the JW teaching on this issue more consistent with the biblical narrative than modern evangelical teachings on heaven.

Having said all of that, I don't subscribe to the JW teaching either. Eschatology is not of much interest to me, so it isn't something I have fully explored and come to any conclusions about. So, all I'm saying is that at first glance, the view on the 144,000 that JWs have seems to be consistent with the biblical narrative, more so than the evangelical view that God is going to give up on the world he created and snatch all the righteous out of it to be with him in heaven.


Edit: I just want to add one more thing. There is a lot of theology wrapped up in that JW view. I haven't studied JW theology, but I know from having had friends who were either practicing JW or former JWs that they have certain teachings about the holyness of these 144,000 and how different they are from everyone else; to the point that they teach that unless you are one of the 144,000 you should not participate in communion. In almost every JW service, the communion plate is passed around and none of the elements are consumed, for few people dare proclaim that they are one of the 144,000. A former JW friend of mine recounted the story about how in his congregation there was once a married couple who partook of communion; the elders of the church eventually had a meeting where they concluded that the married couple were not among the 144,000 and should be excommunicated, so they were. Obviously, I don't mean to say that all of the JW teaching on the 144,000 and who they are is more consistent with the bible than evangelical thought is. I am only referring to the teaching that only the 144,000 spend eternity in heaven and everyone else inherits the Earth.
 
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GBFAN said:
Damn!! My number is 144,432
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You think that's bad my ticket says 144,001. Maybe I should change my username to "The Nearly Man"
 
Dragonfly said:
Pretty sure that can be said about ALL "translators". Just sayin'. ;)
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IIRC in Hitchens " God is not Great " he claims that the old Arabic translations for the word virgin might actually of meant currant instead. I would love to see the faces when they see 72 currants lying on the bed :doh
 
oneworld2 said:
IIRC in Hitchens " God is not Great " he claims that the old Arabic translations for the word virgin might actually of meant currant instead. I would love to see the faces when they see 72 currants lying on the bed :doh
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actually it is more like this
 
The Baron said:
Yea, it always seemed to me that if you were a Jehovah Witness that once the church reached 144,000 members they would have been, "Whoa! Holed up a minute. Maybe now would be a good time to stop recruiting."
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:lol:

That's a good question to ask the JWs that knock on the door.
 
tosca1 said:
:lol:

That's a good question to ask the JWs that knock on the door.
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I will be more than happy to live in Gods kingdom on a paradise earth.--no fear--no war--no hatred--no diseases--no pain,mourning nor outcrys--even death will be no more. Plenty of food for all, the wolf will eat alongside the lamb( harmony) ---Gods kingdom will rule all of creation at that point. Every motive of mortal man out of a loving heart.
Jesus made this promise to the great crowd of other sheep, which no man can number---- Blessed( happy) are the meek( mild tempered) for they will inherit the earth.
 
kjw47 said:
I will be more than happy to live in Gods kingdom on a paradise earth.--no fear--no war--no hatred--no diseases--no pain,mourning nor outcrys--even death will be no more. Plenty of food for all, the wolf will eat alongside the lamb( harmony) ---Gods kingdom will rule all of creation at that point. Every motive of mortal man out of a loving heart.
Jesus made this promise to the great crowd of other sheep, which no man can number---- Blessed( happy) are the meek( mild tempered) for they will inherit the earth.
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I don't doubt for a minute that you'd want to be with the Lord, and I think everyone would honestly want to spend eternity in paradise - don't we settle for a glorious day of sun vocally expressing that we won't complain if this last forever, and that's just because of the sunny day!

But the question that I'm talking about will be about the 144,000 which JWs believe to be the exact number that will go to heaven - no more, no less.


As of August 2013, Jehovah's Witnesses report an average membership of approximately 7.69 million actively involved in preaching, with a peak of 7.96 million.

Demographics of Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


First of all:

Based on the belief of JW....obviously there are millions of FALSE PREACHERS among JWs (who of course, would've been taught by FALSE TEACHERS)....that's why most of these preachers will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven. :mrgreen:

Second, why do they still recruit when they know that they've already passed the mark?
 
tosca1 said:
I don't doubt for a minute that you'd want to be with the Lord, and I think everyone would honestly want to spend eternity in paradise - don't we settle for a glorious day of sun vocally expressing that we won't complain if this last forever, and that's just because of the sunny day!

But the question that I'm talking about will be about the 144,000 which JWs believe to be the exact number that will go to heaven - no more, no less.


As of August 2013, Jehovah's Witnesses report an average membership of approximately 7.69 million actively involved in preaching, with a peak of 7.96 million.

Demographics of Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


First of all:

Based on the belief of JW....obviously there are millions of FALSE PREACHERS among JWs (who of course, would've been taught by FALSE TEACHERS)....that's why most of these preachers will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven. :mrgreen:

Second, why do they still recruit when they know that they've already passed the mark?
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There aren't millions of false teachers amongst JW,s--what are you talking about? A JW is taught to learn and live by every utterance from God. Jesus started the work--it doesn't stop until the end.
 
lizzie said:
It's a Baptist thing too, or at least it was when I was a kid, but it was only the Jews who were included in that number, for some reason. I have no idea where it came from- I just remember hearing along the way as a child. God only knows sometimes, where different people get these ideas, but you can be sure that someone, somewhere in history, found a logical (to them) reason for believing it, so it got passed on through the years. It's probably some obscure symbolic passage somewhere, hidden from normal view. :lol:
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Baptists believe only 144,000 Jews will go to heaven? I've never heard that, and I know some devout Baptists. I think you may be not remembering something right.
 
countryboy said:
Baptists believe only 144,000 Jews will go to heaven? I've never heard that, and I know some devout Baptists. I think you may be not remembering something right.
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That is what I remember, but I will ask my mom zbout it, as I was just a child.
 
laska said:
In a revelation from the Lord give to Joseph Smith found in the Doctrine of Covenants, Joseph asks about the 144,000:

D&C 77:
11 Q. "What are we to understand by sealing the one hundred and forty-four thousand, out of all the tribes of Israel—twelve thousand out of every tribe?"

A. "We are to understand that those who are sealed are high priests, ordained unto the holy order of God, to administer the everlasting gospel; for they are they who are ordained out of every nation, kindred, tongue, and people, by the angels to whom is given power over the nations of the earth, to bring as many as will come to the church of the Firstborn."
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Joe Smith was the founder of the Mormons, not the JW's.
 
lizzie said:
That is what I remember, but I will ask my mom zbout it, as I was just a child.
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Thanks. I wasn't being critical, just curious about what you were taught. :)
 
countryboy said:
Joe Smith was the founder of the Mormons, not the JW's.
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You mean Joesph Smith, and who said he was JW.

D&C 77:
11 Q. "What are we to understand by sealing the one hundred and forty-four thousand, out of all the tribes of Israel—twelve thousand out of every tribe?"

A. "We are to understand that those who are sealed are high priests, ordained unto the holy order of God, to administer the everlasting gospel; for they are they who are ordained out of every nation, kindred, tongue, and people, by the angels to whom is given power over the nations of the earth, to bring as many as will come to the church of the Firstborn."

It looks to me like the 144,000 are going to be LDS missionaries. In the Melchizadech priesthood there are two levels, Elder, which faithful male members of the Church are eligible at the age of 18, along with adult new converts. And then there is the high priest. The age requirement is only that you have to have been an elder for one year, but usually the bishop only calls more mature, very faithful members. To be a bishop or stake president, or hold any higher authority in the Church, you have to be a high priest. Members receive a patriarchal blessing, usually in their youth. This blessing, the same type of blessing that Jacob gave his 12 sons, also declares what lineage in the House of Israel a member is. For example my patriarchal blessing declared my lineage from Ephraim. Most members have been from Ephraim and the tribe of Joseph. A lot of Manasseh also. But since the gospel has grown to many nations, there are likely members from all twelve tribes in the Church. And this will just grow more in the future. The missionary program is gathering scattered Israel into the Church of the First Born. Currently there are about 80,000 full time LDS missionaries, most who are elders and not high priests. It looks like in the future, likely just prior to the Second Coming, there will be 144,000 high priests of The Church of Jesus Christ pf Latter Day Saints, 12,000 from each of the twelve tribes, who will try and share the gospel with the world.
 
laska said:
You mean Joesph Smith, and who said he was JW.

D&C 77:
11 Q. "What are we to understand by sealing the one hundred and forty-four thousand, out of all the tribes of Israel—twelve thousand out of every tribe?"

A. "We are to understand that those who are sealed are high priests, ordained unto the holy order of God, to administer the everlasting gospel; for they are they who are ordained out of every nation, kindred, tongue, and people, by the angels to whom is given power over the nations of the earth, to bring as many as will come to the church of the Firstborn."

It looks to me like the 144,000 are going to be LDS missionaries. In the Melchizadech priesthood there are two levels, Elder, which faithful male members of the Church are eligible at the age of 18, along with adult new converts. And then there is the high priest. The age requirement is only that you have to have been an elder for one year, but usually the bishop only calls more mature, very faithful members. To be a bishop or stake president, or hold any higher authority in the Church, you have to be a high priest. Members receive a patriarchal blessing, usually in their youth. This blessing, the same type of blessing that Jacob gave his 12 sons, also declares what lineage in the House of Israel a member is. For example my patriarchal blessing declared my lineage from Ephraim. Most members have been from Ephraim and the tribe of Joseph. A lot of Manasseh also. But since the gospel has grown to many nations, there are likely members from all twelve tribes in the Church. And this will just grow more in the future. The missionary program is gathering scattered Israel into the Church of the First Born. Currently there are about 80,000 full time LDS missionaries, most who are elders and not high priests. It looks like in the future, likely just prior to the Second Coming, there will be 144,000 high priests of The Church of Jesus Christ pf Latter Day Saints, 12,000 from each of the twelve tribes, who will try and share the gospel with the world.
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The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints are the Mormons. Joseph smith founded the Mormon church. Charles Taze Russell founded the JW church. You are mistaken. :)
 
CRUE CAB said:
Good way to get the dogs sent on you.
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"For example, a sister missionary recently wrote to me: “My companion and I saw a man sitting on a bench in the town square eating his lunch. As we drew near, he looked up and saw our missionary name tags. With a terrible look in his eye, he jumped up and raised his hand to hit me. I ducked just in time, only to have him spit his food all over me and start swearing the most horrible things at us. We walked away saying nothing. I tried to wipe the food off of my face, only to feel a clump of mashed potato hit me in the back of the head. Sometimes it is hard being a missionary because right then I wanted to go back, grab that little man, and say, ‘EXCUSE ME!’ But I didn’t.”

To this devoted missionary I say, dear child, you have in your own humble way stepped into a circle of very distinguished women and men who have, as the Book of Mormon prophet Jacob said, “view[ed Christ’s] death, and suffer[ed] his cross and [borne] the shame of the world.” https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2014/04/the-cost-and-blessings-of-discipleship?lang=eng
 
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