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The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments [W:218]

Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

1. detach yourself from Your possessions, so what? It basically means detach yourself from being ruled by them, so you can act more efficiently in the market Place, I don't want People to be detached, I want People to be Attached, they should KNOW and be involved With where their material posessions come from, how they came about and so on
Well, there's one of your fundamental philosophical differences between Buddhism and many other belief systems. Buddhism teaches that suffering is caused by our attachment to ephemeral and/or material things and that it is this attachment that keeps us within the self-perpetuating cycle of Samsara.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

1. detach yourself from Your possessions, so what? It basically means detach yourself from being ruled by them, so you can act more efficiently in the market Place, I don't want People to be detached, I want People to be Attached, they should KNOW and be involved With where their material posessions come from, how they came about and so on .... I suggest you read Slavoj Zizeks writings on Christianity and Buddhism.

I don't think Siddhartha was referring to the market place...

2. What? Based on what?

Well, for example, the fact that God tries different methods of eliminating sin without success. The fact that God becomes more liberal over time. The fact that he didn't foresee slavery going out of style. I'm sure you could find a valid example on every other page of the Bible. God reads as a linear being, who reacts to offences (requiring a passage of time) as just as any other linear being.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

What Makes it good is whether or not it coincides With Goodness, whether or not it is morally good, whether or not it's a virtue, and whether or not it's inline With Gods will.

Goodness is a value for it's own sake.

ok but what exactly is goodness and virtue then and why should any one care about them

or about gods will

why should any one values what they don't value and how dose the idea of an independent value actually work? the definition for value seems to be desirability or being useful and helpful but without your own desires that doesn't apply to anything so I don't get the conept



if your god said you should were socks on your hands this is good

what dose that men other then a description of what the god says is good and wants? what value should you give that and why?
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

It's good because then People will be more accountable for their actions, moral good requires that someone know the consequences of their actions and are accountable.

and why should they be more accountable?

why dose it matter if something is morally good or not?
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

and why should they be more accountable?

why dose it matter if something is morally good or not?

Well, it matters if you care about morality.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

It's good because then People will be more accountable for their actions, moral good requires that someone know the consequences of their actions and are accountable.

ok but what's the point? so far iv got its good to do something that's required to be Morally good

but that doesn't give a reason to value non desire based goods even if you name it moral good and say its independent of yourself that doesn't explain why people should be good or bother to think about good at all

it just reads off like a list of rules and descriptions with no value other then this alien independent value which is itself and nothing else

which seems to be empty of meaning
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Well, it matters if you care about morality.

and why should you?

and if that's why it matters isn't your desire still the base for what's good then?
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Religious leanings aside, which of set spiritual ethics / morals do you prefer?

The eight-fold path is more reasonable, and therefore preferable to the 10 Commandments. Says an atheist. But I wouldn't present the eight-fold path as you have, rather:

1. Right view
2. Right intention
3. Right speech
4. Right action
5. Right livelihood
6. Right effort
7. Right mindfulness
8. Right concentration

And one must meditate to determine what is "right".
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Christianity does not concern itself with mind at all. That's God's job. You're not supposed to do anything but obey. You'll see this with American Christians who refuse to meditate. Underlying their resistance is a total fear that if they somehow let their mind go, the devil will get in. There is nothing in the Bible or Christiandom that encourages people to question the nature of their own thoughts or the nature of Emptiness.

If Christians actually meditated as a practice, the Church would lose all validity. When you quiet the mind and realize what peace there is within, it makes all the middle men seem pointless.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

When you quiet the mind and realize what peace there is within, it makes all the middle men seem pointless.

Precisely, Christians don't follow any God, they read their Bible, or have someone read it to them, and there are too many differing translations, besides the Bible being contradictory. Usually, they follow someone who tells them what God says.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Precisely, Christians don't follow any God, they read their Bible, or have someone read it to them, and there are too many differing translations, besides the Bible being contradictory. Usually, they follow someone who tells them what God says.

This must be how unbelievers make themselves feel better, by plunking the whole Christian lot into this weird little box.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Buddhism is indifferent on the subject of gods, even though it derives from Hinduism. Buddhism says that whether or not gods exist, you cannot depend on them for help. You can only depend on yourself. Thus paying homage to a deity would be pointless, although it is entirely your choice.

It sounds a bit like a lie to me. Christ said the opposite. Don't rely on yourself. Rely on God.
I studied Buddhism a bit in my youth and I remember the lack of something when I felt I had understood it's point. I know that missing piece now as God. Buddhism lacked God.
If God exists, that is a serious truth problem. If he does not exist, then really, what matters at all?
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

This must be how unbelievers make themselves feel better, by plunking the whole Christian lot into this weird little box.

What wierd little box? It's impossible to generalize Christianity, given there are between 33k and 41k Christian denominations, each with their own interpretations, proving the Bible is not perspicacious material.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

If he does not exist, then really, what matters at all?

Don't take this the wrong way, but I feel really sad for the faithful when they say this. I don't want to take the notion of God away from you if you depend on him to give your existence meaning. I don't mean that in a cruel or sarcastic way.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

What wierd little box? It's impossible to generalize Christianity, given there are between 33k and 41k Christian denominations, each with their own interpretations, proving the Bible is not perspicacious material.

Your statement is specious at best. But the fact remains, the box was small.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

If you like Buddhism but need your God fix, there's always Hinduism.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Don't take this the wrong way, but I feel really sad for the faithful when they say this. I don't want to take the notion of God away from you if you depend on him to give your existence meaning. I don't mean that in a cruel or sarcastic way.

I don't take offense. Please speak freely. :)
The way I see it, this world will be dead some day, along with it's sun and all suns. Without God, how does life matter, in the long run. Sure, it's nice to eat an apple pie and say howdy neighbor. But dead and gone is dead and gone. It all makes so little sense without God.
You can't take my "notion" of God away, now can you?
I was an atheist when I studied Buddhism. I wasn't trying to make it fit my God picture. It just didn't fit my understanding of life. In the end it was empty of absolute truth.
Christ on the other hand just made so much sense. Even as an atheist I couldn't deny his wisdom. I could never make him out to be a liar or a thief, so if his message wasn't the truth, then I could find no reason for it at all.

I always think of the Woman at the Well when I think of Buddhism and Taoism and the other forms I studied in my youth: "You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews."

No offense taken, and none meant in return. Just the truth of my own journey.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Your statement is specious at best. But the fact remains, the box was small.

Specious...So you're denying that most Christians follow a certain preacher or a denomination's version of what the Bible means, vs. going alone and being a "denomination of one". My statement, which you interpreted as a small box, in no way precluded the numerous Christian denominations which I mentioned when asked for clarification.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

I think I like you.

My view is the opposite of yours, however. If there is a God, then life is ultimately pointless. When we die, we get rewarded or punished for eternity. And then what? What is the game plan? What is the point of God, if not to perpetuate an infinity of stagnation?
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Specious...So you're denying that most Christians follow a certain preacher or a denomination's version of what the Bible means, vs. going alone and being a "denomination of one". My statement, which you interpreted as a small box, in no way precluded the numerous Christian denominations which I mentioned when asked for clarification.

We don't need to go alone to get it right. In fact, the church is made up of believers. I mean Christ's church, not the building down the street. My brothers in Asia and Africa understand what I understand about Christ, even though I've never met them.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

I think I like you.

My view is the opposite of yours, however. If there is a God, then life is ultimately pointless. When we die, we get rewarded or punished for eternity. And then what? What is the game plan? What is the point of God, if not to perpetuate an infinity of stagnation?

Life is stagnation?
I grow daily in understanding and in faith. The absolute goodness and truth of God are so far beyond what I believe I understand today. I have no way of knowing the wonder of actually being with God. But I believe the goodness of it will be beyond our imaginations.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

My brothers in Asia and Africa understand what I understand about Christ, even though I've never met them.

You seem to be ignoring denominational differences. Just here, on this forum, we have Christians disagreeing over Jesus' godhood/divinity, a throwback to the Arian controversy which gave rise to the First Council of Nicaea.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/religious-discussions/195347-do-jesus-teachers-teach-jesus-truths.html
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

Life is stagnation?
I grow daily in understanding and in faith. The absolute goodness and truth of God are so far beyond what I believe I understand today. I have no way of knowing the wonder of actually being with God. But I believe the goodness of it will be beyond our imaginations.

If there is no death, there is no evolution of the species. There is no growth, since there is no need to grow. And there is no need to learn if you have all the answers (from being with God). This is stagnation, and it will never end because God won't let it. That is my version of Hell.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

If there is no death, there is no evolution of the species. There is no growth, since there is no need to grow. And there is no need to learn if you have all the answers (from being with God). This is stagnation, and it will never end because God won't let it. That is my version of Hell.

Why would there be no need to grow? I am not sure we would not grow being with God. It may be the case, but I just don't know.
But the struggles of this life, and the ignorance of it all. It will be a real pleasure to be rid of this mess. It seems there are greater things waiting in the wings.
We don't and can't know exactly what it will be like to be with God. I hope you'll consider this before you name it hell.
 
Re: The Noble Eightfold Path vs. The Ten Commandments

You seem to be ignoring denominational differences. Just here, on this forum, we have Christians disagreeing over Jesus' godhood/divinity, a throwback to the Arian controversy which gave rise to the First Council of Nicaea.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/religious-discussions/195347-do-jesus-teachers-teach-jesus-truths.html

Perhaps I just misunderstood your post. Did you mean that there is truth in Christ, and that many folks walking around just don't see the message right? Did you mean there is no right message?
If I missed the point I'll do my best to pick it up as you intended.
 
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