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Matthew 4:8-11

What do these verses of scripture imply?

  • Satan ruled the world and offered it to Jesus.

    Votes: 3 100.0%

  • Satan didn't rule the world. He tricked Jesus into believing that he did.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Satan still rules the world since Jesus didn't take him up on the offer.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Beats me.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    3
  • Poll closed .
vasuderatorrent

vasuderatorrent

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Matthew 4:8-11 said:
8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

11 Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.
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What does these verses of scripture imply?
 
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lizzie said:
That Jesus had infinitely more self-control than the average human.
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That depends. Was it a real offer? If Satan didn't rule the world, there was no real offer.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
That depends. Was it a real offer? If Satan didn't rule the world, there was no real offer.
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As the story itself is presented, yes, it demonstrates his self-control. It doesn't matter if it's "real" or not, as it relates to your op question.
 
lizzie said:
As the story itself is presented, yes, it demonstrates his self-control. It doesn't matter if it's "real" or not, as it relates to your op question.
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I understand the practical application of the story. We are to resist every opportunity for power. This is an extreme example of turning down an opportunity for power. It's an example that we should follow to obtain a more rewarding life. Power can lead to many heartaches, criticisms and self-destruction.

I suppose my question doesn't offer very much intrigue for non-believers or moderate Christians. For Fundamentalist this is a very difficult thing to explain. Although it isn't a very hard sale to suggest that Satan rules all the governments of the world.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
What does these verses of scripture imply?
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That someone owns a King James Bible...

I would also argue its a strong argument for the proposition that Jesus was not God, but the son of God. Satan certainly would not / could not tempt God, but he could tempt the son of God, as we was successful with the previous son of God.
 
upsideguy said:
That someone owns a King James Bible...

I would also argue its a strong argument for the proposition that Jesus was not God, but the son of God. Satan certainly would not / could not tempt God, but he could tempt the son of God, as we was successful with the previous son of God.
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Almost all other translations are copyrighted. The King James was the safest translation that I was able to access.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
What does these verses of scripture imply?
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In the Bible, things that are worldly or "of this world" are often at odds with the spiritual. To be too much in the world is to have all your focus on storing up worldly treasures not eternal heavenly ones. Satan, indeed, has control (temporarily) of those worldly things that separate us from God (because God does not want separation). Now many of those wordly things are very pleasurable, it's what makes them so difficult to resist. Satan offered Jesus all those worldy pleasures, but, though tempted, Jesus refused them because;

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 1 John 3:9

There are repeated references to His believers not being of this world or being despised by the world but that's ok because "He that is in us is greater that he that is in the world" (1 John 4:4).
 
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I think Satan has influence everywhere. Satan was an favored angel and was given power equal that of God. So I was told. Yet he obsesses of defeating God which makes no sense.

And, God has influence everywhere.

And this is the problem I have with the God described in the Old Testament, but I do love the person of Jesus. God has all of this power, and all of this forsight, why is it this way?

The answers given by various Pastors are lame.

And so it is in my personal belief that God created a perfectly evolving system, initiated it, and is in wonders and learning from the system He created.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
What does these verses of scripture imply?
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None of the offered choices are correct.

Satan has no power. Satan does not own the world nor anything in it. What Satan was purporting to offer, was not his to give.

As someone else stated, Satan's only hope of defeating Jesus was to corrupt him. In Jesus' weakened and starved state, Satan hoped that perhaps he could trick Jesus, and tempt Jesus, in a manner that he would have no hope of doing were Jesus in a less vulnerable state. Satan hoped, and Satan tried, in vain. Even in Jesus' weakened and hungry state, he saw through Satan's lies, and resisted Satan's temptations.
 
cpwill said:
:roll: Because Satan would never lie.
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Because Jesus would know if Satan lied .... I think the implication IS that Satan has rulership over the powers of the world. That is also confirmed elsewhere in scripture.

1 John 5:
19 We know that we are God’s children, and that the whole world lies under the power of the evil one.

Revelation also talks about the whore of Bablylon being with the Kings and Merchants of the world.
 
Bob Blaylock said:
None of the offered choices are correct.

Satan has no power. Satan does not own the world nor anything in it. What Satan was purporting to offer, was not his to give.

As someone else stated, Satan's only hope of defeating Jesus was to corrupt him. In Jesus' weakened and starved state, Satan hoped that perhaps he could trick Jesus, and tempt Jesus, in a manner that he would have no hope of doing were Jesus in a less vulnerable state. Satan hoped, and Satan tried, in vain. Even in Jesus' weakened and hungry state, he saw through Satan's lies, and resisted Satan's temptations.
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Very well put.

God allows Satan a certain amount of freedom / free will to make his case before man that he (Satan) is where man should place his allegiance. We see the amount of free will that God allows Satan in Job chapter 2, subject to God's stipulation:

The Lord said to Satan, “Very well, then, he is in your hands; but you must spare his life.”

Satan has his limits.

In the end, in the Book of Revelation, Satan and his demons are cast into the Lake of Fire.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
I suppose my question doesn't offer very much intrigue for non-believers or moderate Christians. For Fundamentalist this is a very difficult thing to explain. Although it isn't a very hard sale to suggest that Satan rules all the governments of the world.
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Well, whether you are a "believer", or as I, you just think that man has a higher nature, which is a challenge to express consistently, or a lower nature which is very hard to resist, the meaning of the story is the same.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
Almost all other translations are copyrighted. The King James was the safest translation that I was able to access.
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True, but all one need do in quoting another [copyrighted] translation is include it - e.g. Matthew 4:8-11 (ESV) or (NASB), etc.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
I understand the practical application of the story. We are to resist every opportunity for power. This is an extreme example of turning down an opportunity for power. It's an example that we should follow to obtain a more rewarding life. Power can lead to many heartaches, criticisms and self-destruction.

I suppose my question doesn't offer very much intrigue for non-believers or moderate Christians. For Fundamentalist this is a very difficult thing to explain. Although it isn't a very hard sale to suggest that Satan rules all the governments of the world.
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I can't entirely agree with the bolded statement. For one thing, that is a very generalized interpretation of a very specific event.

I will grant that power is a perilous thing to possess, spiritually. It is a two-edged sword... on the one hand, with power one can right wrongs, protect the innocent, and administer wise justice. On the other hand, one is accountable to God for how one wields that power, and the wisdom of any person is a limited thing... and power brings many temptations.

Certainly, to caution believers about seeking or accepting power is wise... to advocate always refusing it is, however, in my carefully considered opinion, an excessive generalization and too much an absolute to be extrapolated from this passage.

Indeed, in his refusal Jesus says nothing about the perils of power, but simply that none should worship any but God.

Consider the position of Pastor.... is this not a position of power? Certainly it is... perhaps not "hard power", as in "obey or die", but certainly a position of leadership and "soft power" or strong influence over many. It should be undertaken only with the most serious mind and great care, but not refused if one is called.

Contrast the verses of Romans 13, speaking of the magistrate, "who does not bear the sword in vain", but is a revenger of evil... and is spoken of respectfully in that context, not as something to be avoided... but surely a position of power.

Like wine and wealth, power should be avoided if you can't handle it in a Godly manner....
 
Goshin said:
Consider the position of Pastor.... is this not a position of power? Certainly it is...
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One of the great paradoxes of Christianity. This is accounted for in the scripture in 1 Corinthians 1:21

1 Corinthians 1:21 said:
21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
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In the Buddhist tradition a pastor would be recognized as a Bodhisattva.

It's hillarious that a pastor would be required to refuse the opportunity to boldly proclaim the gospel if he truly practiced humility. The Bible does account for this but I think the Buddhist tradition can help pastors understand their unique position. In Christianity it remains a puzzle because paradoxes are often avoided.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
It's hillarious that a pastor would be required to refuse the opportunity to boldly proclaim the gospel if he truly practiced humility. The Bible does account for this but I think the Buddhist tradition can help pastors understand their unique position. In Christianity it remains a puzzle because paradoxes are often avoided.
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I think you may be confusing humility with cowardice. One does not need to be quiet and retiring in order to be humble; only to realize one's worth in the big scheme of things, and to understand proper perspective.
 
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