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What's wrong with birth control? [W:452]

Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Born with a sinful nature, not with sins they didn't commit.

Back to birth control though... The Catholic church is wrong, their stance is based on ideology and not so much on Biblical theology. They have the right to not use contraceptives, Catholic institutions have the right to not dispense them. But their argument is wrong and unfounded.
Does everyone realize that its not just birth control pills that fall into the contraception category ?
Emergency contraceptives, or "morning-after pills", are drugs that disrupt ovulation or fertilization in order to prevent pregnancy taken after sexual intercourse.
Now I maybe wrong, but I think the Catholic Church believes that after fertilization its abortion. Has anyone considered that the biggest church stance is not over prevention but the controversial Plan-B agenda of the 0bama administration...
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

The Catholic church views sex as a spiritual act and feel that birth control cheapens and perverts it. The reasoning being that if you have no fear of consequences that you will engage in sex simply for the pleasure of it and ignore the "love" and bonding of it. That's not to say that the pleasure of sex is condemned in anyway, but that it's meant to be balanced by the other aspects of the act.

My personal view on Catholics that use birth control (in this day an age) is that it's a necessary "evil" in some cases. Many that I know that do use contraceptives ask for forgiveness for it during confession.

That's sad - that really is. That people feel they've done something wrong for using it and yet they still cling to the religion that makes them feel wrong to begin with.

with all that is going on in the world and in America I think its sad that this is the biggest news talking point.

It's not the biggest news talking point - why do you think it is? :shrug:

But - and I might be wrong - but I guess that maybe some people take a violation of their constitutional rights very seriously - especially when it's the government that's trying to violate them.

Perhaps it's evidence of a much bigger issue and you're being sideline by the Catholic-religious aspect and you're overlooking that if our own President is willing to try to violate one constitutional right - then he would be willing to violate others as well.

Just because it's catholic/birth control doesn't give him a pass on the basics of what he's tried to do here.
 
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Re: What's wrong with birth control?

That's sad - that really is. That people feel they've done something wrong for using it and yet they still cling to the religion that makes them feel wrong to begin with.

Completely 100% agree.

Perhaps it's evidence of a much bigger issue and you're being sideline by the Catholic-religious aspect and you're overlooking that if our own President is willing to try to violate one constitutional right - then he would be willing to violate others as well.

What constitutional right is being violated?

No right to religion is being compromised here.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Completely 100% agree.



What constitutional right is being violated?

No right to religion is being compromised here.

That wasn't in regard to religions and their views of birth control as being a violation of a constitutional right: that was in regard to the government dictating the health coverage of religious groups: that is a violation actually - because government is expressly forbidden to do so (which is straying from the topic of this thread a little - but it came up so I responded to it)
 
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Re: What's wrong with birth control?

That's sad - that really is. That people feel they've done something wrong for using it and yet they still cling to the religion that makes them feel wrong to begin with.

That's one way of looking at it. Another is that Catholics know that it is hard to do the right thing all the time (it not being in our nature and all), and then when they don't do the right thing, the seek forgiveness for it. Whether or not they are made to feel that way or not is conjecture.

The goal of the church is to lessen excessive promiscuity, which, despite all our tendencies to promote "free love", we know can lead to a very harmful lifestyle.
 
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Re: What's wrong with birth control?

That's one way of looking at it. Another is that Catholics know that it is hard to do the right thing all the time (it not being in our nature and all), and then when they don't do the right thing, the seek forgiveness for it. Whether or not they are made to feel that way or not is conjecture.

The goal of the church is to lessen excessive promiscuity, which, despite all our tendencies to promote "free love", we know can lead to a very harmful lifestyle.

Whether it's right or not is also conjecture.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Whether it's right or not is also conjecture.

I agree, and I think that the stance overlooks a lot of other things. The motive is good intentioned, but I believe counterproductive in preventing a greater "sin". I don't personally use birth control, but I don't fault and even encourage others to use it that are going to engage in sexual activity but are unwilling to support a child.

I've mentored a lot of kids, many non-Catholic, and when asked, I tell them that engaging in sex carries a great deal of responsibility, if they are going to do it, do it as responsibly as possible.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

That wasn't in regard to religions and their views of birth control as being a violation of a constitutional right: that was in regard to the government dictating the health coverage of religious groups: that is a violation actually - because government is expressly forbidden to do so (which is straying from the topic of this thread a little - but it came up so I responded to it)

Nobody is forcing anyone to take birth control, or forcing anyone to adhere to a specific religious principle.

Choice. That word is key. if you don't believe in taking/using birth control the chose not to.

Offering the health coverage of such to those who might want/need it is quite a different scenario.

That in no way means people have to use it.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Nobody is forcing anyone to take birth control, or forcing anyone to adhere to a specific religious principle.

Choice. That word is key. if you don't believe in taking/using birth control the chose not to.

Offering the health coverage of such to those who might want/need it is quite a different scenario.

That in no way means people have to use it.

The Obama administration is attempting to force religious organizations to include birth control coverage in their health plans for employees in direct opposition to their religious views. This is a direct violation of the separation of Church and State.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

The Obama administration is attempting to force religious organizations to include birth control coverage in their health plans for employees in direct opposition to their religious views. This is a direct violation of the separation of Church and State.

No - no churches are required to do this. It was non-profit organizations that might be affiliated with religious organizations.

Big difference.

Again - it's health coverage. Not a requirement to take a pill. People use birth control for things other than preventing pregnancy.

It does NOT require people of faith to make any changes to their personal life.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

The Obama administration is attempting to force religious organizations to include birth control coverage in their health plans for employees in direct opposition to their religious views. This is a direct violation of the separation of Church and State.

Then it must follow that they only employ other Catholics..................
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

No - no churches are required to do this. It was non-profit organizations that might be affiliated with religious organizations.

No, it's religious non-profits...like Catholic hospitals.

Big difference.

No, it's not.

Again - it's health coverage. Not a requirement to take a pill. People use birth control for things other than preventing pregnancy.

It does NOT require people of faith to make any changes to their personal life.

It requires a Religious organization to provided something they feel is a direct contradiction to their beliefs.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Then it must follow that they only employ other Catholics..................

No it doesn't. Would you say it's ok for you to provide alcohol to minors that are not your kids? (or vice versa). This is not a completely accurate analogy, but the only thing that came to mind.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

No, it's religious non-profits...like Catholic hospitals.



No, it's not.



It requires a Religious organization to provided something they feel is a direct contradiction to their beliefs.


Catholic non profits do what all other non profit hospitals do.. They contract with groups who are generally FOR PROFIT and owned by the hospital.. Its all about accounting.... and its common practice.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Catholic non profits do what all other non profit hospitals do.. They contract with groups who are generally FOR PROFIT and owned by the hospital.. Its all about accounting.... and its common practice.

Those non-religious for-profit contractors have their own insurance. They are not at issue.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

No it doesn't. Would you say it's ok for you to provide alcohol to minors that are not your kids? (or vice versa). This is not a completely accurate analogy, but the only thing that came to mind.

The two don't connect at all............. not on any level.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

just let workers at religious oriented institutions who want birth control, purchase an optional-rider for their health insurance that covers birth control, IUD, abortions, etc etc.

......and yet, something tells me that still wouldn't be enough. Religious institutions don't want to be forced to have employees that engage in behavior that violate their religiously motivated "ethics".
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

It requires a Religious organization to provided something they feel is a direct contradiction to their beliefs.

I would think non-profit organizations regardless of their affiliation would want to proved the best, most comprehensive HEALTH coverage possible.

My health coverage covers all kinds of medications that I don't use. I have no need for prescription allergy medication, although I'm sure a trip to my doctor could produce something like that if I requested it.

Making some medications available to those who don't follow the same religious beliefs, but still work for the organization, sure seems like the "christian" thing to do.

Why should some catholic church care if a non-catholic employee takes birth control?

The non-catholic employee is certainly aware of the churches position on the matter, but this in no way effects the church.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

The two don't connect at all............. not on any level.

Yes they do. Do yo think that just because they aren't yours, should you treat them differently in terms of what is right and wrong to give them?
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

I would think non-profit organizations regardless of their affiliation would want to proved the best, most comprehensive HEALTH coverage possible.

My health coverage covers all kinds of medications that I don't use. I have no need for prescription allergy medication, although I'm sure a trip to my doctor could produce something like that if I requested it.

Making some medications available to those who don't follow the same religious beliefs, but still work for the organization, sure seems like the "christian" thing to do.

Why should some catholic church care if a non-catholic employee takes birth control?

The non-catholic employee is certainly aware of the churches position on the matter, but this in no way effects the church.

Because if the Catholic church is supplying non-Catholics with birth control then it is in direct violation of it's own teachings. Whether or not the taker is Catholic is inconsequential. Besides, there is a definite difference in terms of "health care" between allergy medications and birth control.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Yes they do. Do yo think that just because they aren't yours, should you treat them differently in terms of what is right and wrong to give them?

How does breaking the law by selling booze to minors equate to birth control?
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Isn't it in the Catholic Churches "best interest" to have as many babies being born into Catholic families as possible?

More Catholic babies = more Catholics.

Seems relatively simple from a strictly business/power/money point of view.

I agree. You have to understand that back in the day, the Catholic Church was a huge political entity. Kings had to answer to the church. And if you've ever been to a Catholic church you know they have tons of money rolling in. This was all achieved by having lots and lots and lots of babies.
 
Re: What's wrong with birth control?

Where does the Bible say anything about birth control?

Come to think of it, it doesn't say anything about airplanes, televisions, or computers either. Now, why would that be?
 
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