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Thread: Sex and Convergent Evolution

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    Sex and Convergent Evolution

    It is a big Universe out there. Someday we might encounter an intelligent alien species that looks very human-like, despite very different origins (for a well-known fictional example, see Superman's homeworld of Krypton). Such a thing is very possible, thanks to a known phenomenon called "convergent evolution". On Earth, quite a few species of marsupials in Australia look quite similar to various placental-mammals (dingoes and dogs, for example). The thing I want to point out here is that while superficially similar, two such species can still be very different genetically, with no chance of yielding offspring, should they happen to sexually interact.

    We have evidence that no matter how ugly Neanderthals might have appeared to be, when viewed by Homo Sapiens, that didn't stop Homo Sapiens from both sexually interacting and interbreeding with Neanderthals. We can be quite sure that should we someday meet highly humanoid aliens, sexual interactions will take place. But as mentioned above, due to different genetics, we cannot expect any offspring to result.

    Relevant to this Forum is the fact that for quite a few centuries, various Churches on Earth have severely frowned-upon any sort of sexual activity that could not yield offspring. I would not be a bit surprised if they idiotically denounced human/alien sexual interactions, simply because offspring could not result, no matter how human the appearance (or the humane-ness, or the intelligence) of those aliens. The purpose of this Thread is to discuss that aspect of religious idiocy. Have fun!

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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    From the evolutionary coign of vantage (following the OP here), what is the point, purpose, reason, etc, behind sexual activity?

    Since we all know the answer to this question, the real question is why is the selfsame belief considered enlightened science when espoused by an atheist, but "religious idiocy" when espoused by a churchman? If the religious attitude here is in accordance with the scientific view, why is it called "idiocy"?

    Is there a double standard at work here? Or just the absence of critical thought?
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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    From the evolutionary coign of vantage (following the OP here), what is the point, purpose, reason, etc, behind sexual activity?

    Since we all know the answer to this question, the real question is why is the selfsame belief considered enlightened science when espoused by an atheist, but "religious idiocy" when espoused by a churchman? If the religious attitude here is in accordance with the scientific view, why is it called "idiocy"?

    Is there a double standard at work here? Or just the absence of critical thought?
    Because, many people believe that we don't fully understand the imperative for our sexuality in Evolutionary terms. Many of our primate relatives use sex as a means of social interaction and not just for sexual reproduction. Deconstructing sexuality to simply be a means of exchanging genetic material for preservation of genes does not appear to be the complete story, even if it is the primary purpose for evolving the mechanical reproductive systems. You are simply assuming that anything beyond that is without justification in order to whine about people not being on board with prejudice and bigotry about what is abnormal sexuality from a politicised religious point of view, rather than adopting a truly spiritual one but hey, I figured that you were posting politicised religion under a thin veil some time ago. Busted.

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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by William Rea View Post
    Because, many people believe that we don't fully understand the imperative for our sexuality in Evolutionary terms. Many of our primate relatives use sex as a means of social interaction and not just for sexual reproduction. Deconstructing sexuality to simply be a means of exchanging genetic material for preservation of genes does not appear to be the complete story, even if it is the primary purpose for evolving the mechanical reproductive systems. You are simply assuming that anything beyond that is without justification in order to whine about people not being on board with prejudice and bigotry about what is abnormal sexuality from a politicised religious point of view, rather than adopting a truly spiritual one but hey, I figured that you were posting politicised religion under a thin veil some time ago. Busted.
    So in your apologetics ToE does not adequately account for sexual activity, yes? And your mind-meld with "our primate relatives" seems transparently special pleading. no?

    As for your usual personal polemics, the same could be said of your "politicized" view of ToE. Look to it.
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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    So in your apologetics ToE does not adequately account for sexual activity, yes? And your mind-meld with "our primate relatives" seems transparently special pleading. no?

    As for your usual personal polemics, the same could be said of your "politicized" view of ToE. Look to it.
    I'm not aware of any holes in ToE for adequately accounting for sexual activity. What are they?

    Also, some suggested reading:

    The Red Queen: Sex and the Evolution of Human Nature


    https://www.amazon.com/Red-Queen-Evo...red+queen+matt

    Covers pretty much everything, altho the 2 half of the book is easier reading for those not as interested in the foundation science.

    Stuff written *for the layman* by Richard Dawkins and Desmond Morris are helpful too.
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    So in your apologetics ToE does not adequately account for sexual activity, yes? And your mind-meld with "our primate relatives" seems transparently special pleading. no?

    As for your usual personal polemics, the same could be said of your "politicized" view of ToE. Look to it.
    Cry me a river.

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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    I'm not aware of any holes in ToE for adequately accounting for sexual activity. What are they?
    ...
    I don't suggest holes, Lursa. Another poster has suggested holes. I'm suggesting that according to ToE reproduction is behind sexual activity.
    I haven't read his book, but based on the reviews posted below, reproduction is Mr Ridley's starting point as well.

    “There are few features of the human psyche and nature that can be understood without reference to reproduction.”
    https://theartofcharm.com/podcast-ep...ridley-review/

    The Birds, the Bees and the Coolidges
    The Birds, the Bees and the Coolidges - NYTimes.com

    Thanks for the recommendation. I'll surely take a look at it.
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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    I'm not aware of any holes in ToE for adequately accounting for sexual activity. What are they?

    Also, some suggested reading:

    The Red Queen: Sex and the Evolution of Human Nature


    https://www.amazon.com/Red-Queen-Evo...red+queen+matt

    Covers pretty much everything, altho the 2 half of the book is easier reading for those not as interested in the foundation science.

    Stuff written *for the layman* by Richard Dawkins and Desmond Morris are helpful too.
    Here's what I said...

    https://www.debatepolitics.com/relig...post1067971766 (Sex and Convergent Evolution)

    If you want to have a conversation about it, please respond.

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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    I don't suggest holes, Lursa. Another poster has suggested holes. I'm suggesting that according to ToE reproduction is behind sexual activity.
    I haven't read his book, but based on the reviews posted below, reproduction is Mr Ridley's starting point as well.

    “There are few features of the human psyche and nature that can be understood without reference to reproduction.”
    https://theartofcharm.com/podcast-ep...ridley-review/

    The Birds, the Bees and the Coolidges
    The Birds, the Bees and the Coolidges - NYTimes.com

    Thanks for the recommendation. I'll surely take a look at it.
    It's an excellent read. If you get bogged down in the first half, just go to the second half, it provides references as needed.

    When I got the link I saw that I've got it on my Kindle now too, so I just may re-read it.
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Sex and Convergent Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by William Rea View Post
    Here's what I said...

    https://www.debatepolitics.com/relig...post1067971766 (Sex and Convergent Evolution)

    If you want to have a conversation about it, please respond.
    I didnt really have any issues with your post.
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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