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Religion was never meant to be dominated by fanatics or conservatives.

In my experience, the opposite is true. Back in the day--say, the 1970's--religion rarely entered into the political discussion, and very few people wore their beliefs on their sleeve like they do today. Outside of certain areas like maybe the Deep South or traditional bible belt areas, you could go weeks without hearing a single word about Jesus, God or being saved. Likewise, you could walk the streets of any big city in America for weeks and not hear a word from the atheists criticizing religions.

Today, the opposite is true. Almost no day goes by where someone doesn't feel the need to proselytize. I certainly feel I am being bombarded with religious speech and imagery: constantly being asked if I've been saved, seeing huge billboards reminding us that we need to be saved, crosses on hilltops, huge statues of Jesus alongside our highways, etc. So, perhaps what some call the "War on Christmas" is nothing more than atheists simply holding a line which they believe has been crossed by Evangelicals.

Well, I don't know what 70's timeline you were in, but in my 70's timeline "Jesus Christ Superstar" and "Godspell" came out, Norman Greenbaum recorded Spirit In The Sky", and the crew of Apollo 8 read Genesis 1 while circling the moon. There was also a whole new hippie type movement called "Jesus Freaks".
 
Well, I don't know what 70's timeline you were in, but in my 70's timeline "Jesus Christ Superstar" and "Godspell" came out, Norman Greenbaum recorded Spirit In The Sky", and the crew of Apollo 8 read Genesis 1 while circling the moon. There was also a whole new hippie type movement called "Jesus Freaks".

Harmless stuff. Today's mantra is, "repent and accept or burn in hell."
 
I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints. :mrgreen:

:peace

Well, as long as we're borrowing, "He who laughs last laughs best."
 
Well, I am sure they appreciate your subjective judgement. I, on the other hand, am a minister working in a mostly atheist workplace, and I can't report the same experience.

I'm going to go out on a limb and posit that it has nothing to do with religion.
 
"Religion" is meant for control. It is meant to be dominated by fanatics. It is not the way God intended us to live, but He didn't ever start a religion either.

Muslims certainly believe he did. In fact, he dictated 6,236 verses to Mohamed and called it Islam. He explicitly says so in verse 5:3.

"This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion".
 
Muslims certainly believe he did. In fact, he dictated 6,236 verses to Mohamed and called it Islam. He explicitly says so in verse 5:3.

"This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion".

Well, i'm not a Muslim.
 
Well, i'm not a Muslim.

??????? Who the hell said you were?

You said God never started a religion. I showed you that Muslims believe he authored every single word in the Qur'an and called it Islam. Is the linearity of that not the bleedin obvious to you?
 
??????? Who the hell said you were?

You said God never started a religion. I showed you that Muslims believe he authored every single word in the Qur'an and called it Islam. Is the linearity of that not the bleedin obvious to you?

I'm just saying that I am not one who believes that God ever started a religion. I'm sure you can find many Catholics to tell you that Jesus started their religion.

Religion, or at least organized religion, is a very human endeavor. As such, it is chock full of all the failings of humanity. I believe very firmly in God, and spent two years preparing to be a priest and member of the Franciscan order. However, I have come to the conclusion that I don't believe in religion.
 
I'm just saying that I am not one who believes that God ever started a religion. I'm sure you can find many Catholics to tell you that Jesus started their religion.

Religion, or at least organized religion, is a very human endeavor. As such, it is chock full of all the failings of humanity. I believe very firmly in God, and spent two years preparing to be a priest and member of the Franciscan order. However, I have come to the conclusion that I don't believe in religion.

Ok, but none of that changes the validity of my original response to you. And to expand on my point, the fact that Muslims believe the Qur'an to be a verbatim sermon from God is the reason Islam is much harder, if not impossible, to reform. To you, ISIS etal are fanatics, but to them they're merely strictly adherent Muslims who honestly believe they're doing God's work as demonstrated by Mohamed. How's that for a scary thought?
 
It's really very simply in my opinion. My faith and religion is mine. That's it. Neither of them have to be anybody else's and as long as I'm allowed to have and practice my faith and religion (within reason) I'm good. My neighbors should also be able to do the same. Those that seek control over others are the issue, those that want to force their beliefs on others are the issue. There's plenty in this country that does not line up with my faith or beliefs but since I love my country, respect its concepts (rights and freedoms) I don't wish to change things based on my faith and force it on others. Many social issues are prime examples of that. In the end though I thank god that a christian like myself lives in a country where I have the right and freedom to practice my religion and I'm not under attack like many others in many other countries including this one.
 
We can never again allow the wall between church and state come down. We can never let Jesus freaks and sack jobs have so much say. Look how screwed up and backward the bible belt and the south is. Social conservative have the right to think whatever they want but should never get there way on anything involving social issues. It takes a lot of balls for conservative states to ban Sharia law when there own redneck laws are not much better. Remember Jesus could not stand fanatics either. He told the Pharisees to go hide in a closet to pray and spare us all the show.

Got a clue for you, sport - Jesus was a fanatic. He warned people to repent or perish, cast the sexually immoral on a bed of suffering if they did not repent; overturned the tables of the corrupt money changers while brandishing a whip, and as God gave out the law against gay sex, adultery, fornication, etc., etc.

And by the way, when you say "We can never allow..." who do you think you are? You going to put together a gang of feral snowflakes and go busting down doors? LOL. Reminds me of what was said in the movie "Taken" - 'Good luck.'

Nineteenth century writer H.L. Hastings once forcibly illustrated the unique way in which the Bible has withstood the attacks of skepticism:

“Infidels of eighteen hundred years have been refuting and overthrowing this book, and yet it stands today as solid rock. Its circulation increases, and it is more loved and cherished and read today than ever before. Infidels, with all their assaults, make about as much impression on this book as a man with a tack hammer would on the Pyramids of Egypt.

“When the French monarch proposed the persecution of Christians in his dominion, an old statesman and warrior said to him, ‘Sire, the church of God is an anvil that has worn out many hammers.’ So the hammers of infidels have been pecking away at this book for ages, but the hammers are worn out, and the anvil still endures. If this book had not been the book of God, men would have destroyed it long ago. Emperors and popes, kings and priests, princes and rulers have all tried their hand at it; they die and the book still lives.”

“No other book has been so chopped, knived, sifted, scrutinized, and vilified. What book on philosophy or religion or psychology or belles lettres of classical or modern times has been subject to such a mass attack as the Bible? With such venom and skepticism? With such thoroughness and erudition? Upon every chapter, line and tenet? The Bible is still loved by millions, and studied by millions.
 
Got a clue for you, sport - Jesus was a fanatic. He warned people to repent or perish, cast the sexually immoral on a bed of suffering if they did not repent; overturned the tables of the corrupt money changers while brandishing a whip, and as God gave out the law against gay sex, adultery, fornication, etc., etc.

And by the way, when you say "We can never allow..." who do you think you are? You going to put together a gang of feral snowflakes and go busting down doors? LOL. Reminds me of what was said in the movie "Taken" - 'Good luck.'

Nineteenth century writer H.L. Hastings once forcibly illustrated the unique way in which the Bible has withstood the attacks of skepticism:

“Infidels of eighteen hundred years have been refuting and overthrowing this book, and yet it stands today as solid rock. Its circulation increases, and it is more loved and cherished and read today than ever before. Infidels, with all their assaults, make about as much impression on this book as a man with a tack hammer would on the Pyramids of Egypt.

“When the French monarch proposed the persecution of Christians in his dominion, an old statesman and warrior said to him, ‘Sire, the church of God is an anvil that has worn out many hammers.’ So the hammers of infidels have been pecking away at this book for ages, but the hammers are worn out, and the anvil still endures. If this book had not been the book of God, men would have destroyed it long ago. Emperors and popes, kings and priests, princes and rulers have all tried their hand at it; they die and the book still lives.”

“No other book has been so chopped, knived, sifted, scrutinized, and vilified. What book on philosophy or religion or psychology or belles lettres of classical or modern times has been subject to such a mass attack as the Bible? With such venom and skepticism? With such thoroughness and erudition? Upon every chapter, line and tenet? The Bible is still loved by millions, and studied by millions.

What a quaint delusion to harbor, that the bible has somehow, magically withstood attacks.

"Loved by millions" doesn't equate to "Not having been thoroughly dismantled and debunked".

You should consider actually reading it one day. You'll see what I mean.
 
I hope they don't pretend to be what they're actually not, like some of the posters here.

No, they're genuine pricks, like some of the posters here.
 
What a quaint delusion to harbor, that the bible has somehow, magically withstood attacks.

"Loved by millions" doesn't equate to "Not having been thoroughly dismantled and debunked".

You should consider actually reading it one day. You'll see what I mean.

Not magically but miraculously...there is a difference...not everyone understands it so of course they find it full of contradictions and falsehoods...just goes to show what they know...and what they lack...
 
Got a clue for you, sport - Jesus was a fanatic. He warned people to repent or perish, cast the sexually immoral on a bed of suffering if they did not repent; overturned the tables of the corrupt money changers while brandishing a whip, and as God gave out the law against gay sex, adultery, fornication, etc., etc.

And by the way, when you say "We can never allow..." who do you think you are? You going to put together a gang of feral snowflakes and go busting down doors? LOL. Reminds me of what was said in the movie "Taken" - 'Good luck.'

Nineteenth century writer H.L. Hastings once forcibly illustrated the unique way in which the Bible has withstood the attacks of skepticism:

“Infidels of eighteen hundred years have been refuting and overthrowing this book, and yet it stands today as solid rock. Its circulation increases, and it is more loved and cherished and read today than ever before. Infidels, with all their assaults, make about as much impression on this book as a man with a tack hammer would on the Pyramids of Egypt.

“When the French monarch proposed the persecution of Christians in his dominion, an old statesman and warrior said to him, ‘Sire, the church of God is an anvil that has worn out many hammers.’ So the hammers of infidels have been pecking away at this book for ages, but the hammers are worn out, and the anvil still endures. If this book had not been the book of God, men would have destroyed it long ago. Emperors and popes, kings and priests, princes and rulers have all tried their hand at it; they die and the book still lives.”

“No other book has been so chopped, knived, sifted, scrutinized, and vilified. What book on philosophy or religion or psychology or belles lettres of classical or modern times has been subject to such a mass attack as the Bible? With such venom and skepticism? With such thoroughness and erudition? Upon every chapter, line and tenet? The Bible is still loved by millions, and studied by millions.

Perhaps it was the genocide and slavery the bible was used to sanction.
 
Not magically but miraculously...there is a difference...not everyone understands it so of course they find it full of contradictions and falsehoods...just goes to show what they know...and what they lack...

No, there is no substantive difference between magic and miracles.

Any intellectually honest adult can read it and see the falsehood and contradictions.

You shoudl try it sometime.
 
No, there is no substantive difference between magic and miracles.

Any intellectually honest adult can read it and see the falsehood and contradictions.

You shoudl try it sometime.

Sure there is...magic, especially black magic is from the Devil...miracles are from God, through His holy spirit...and no, there are no falsehoods or contradictions...
 
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