• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Family Outraged After North Miami Beach Police Use Mug Shots as Shooting Targets

Somerville

Somerville

DP Veteran
Joined
Apr 29, 2012
Messages
17,860
Reaction score
8,338
Location
On an island. Not that one!
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Socialist
Family Outraged After North Miami Beach Police Use Mug Shots as Shooting Targets

It was an ordinary Saturday morning last month when Sgt. Valerie Deant arrived at the shooting range in Medley, or so she thought. Deant, who plays clarinet with the Florida Army National Guard’s 13th Army Band, and her fellow soldiers were at the shooting range for their annual weapons qualifications training.

What the soldiers discovered when they entered the range made them angry: mug shots of African American men apparently used as targets by North Miami Beach Police snipers, who had used the range before the guardsmen.

Even more startling for Deant, one of the images was her brother. It was Woody Deant’s mug shot that taken 15 years ago
Click to expand...
Gee, I wonder why they used photos of actual humans for target practice
(North Miami Beach Police Chief J. Scott)Dennis defended the department’s use of actual photographs and says the technique is widely used and the pictures are vital for facial recognition drills.
Click to expand...
but when other law enforcement agencies were asked about this "widely used practice", they failed to corroborate Chief Dennis statement
NBC 6 Investigators spoke with sources at federal and state law enforcement agencies and five local police departments that have SWAT and sniper teams in an attempt to find out if this is a common practice. All law enforcement agencies said they only use commercially produced targets, not photos of human beings for target practice.
Click to expand...
 
It's important for cops to get used to shooting Blacks.
 
Somerville said:
Gee, I wonder why they used photos of actual humans for target practice
but when other law enforcement agencies were asked about this "widely used practice", they failed to corroborate Chief Dennis statement
Click to expand...

Um, because their job may require them to shoot humans, or at least leftist facsimiles of humans. Possibly even some of the criminals in the photos they used. Makes sense to me. Know your target.

They should also use pictures of well known socialist/liberals, I find it helpful during target practice. Hanoi Jane targets used to be a popular sale at gun ranges.
 
This was just plain stupid, no way there will be a good defense for this practice.

North Miami Beach Police Chief J. Scott Dennis admitted that his officers could have used better judgment, but denies any racial profiling.

He noted that the sniper team includes minority officers. Dennis defended the department’s use of actual photographs and says the technique is widely used and the pictures are vital for facial recognition drills. But the Deant family questions why officers were firing targets with images of real people, in this case African-Americans, especially at a time when relations between minority communities and law enforcement are so tense.
Click to expand...

But Woody Deant, who did four years in prison after his 2000 arrest, expressed outrage.

“Now I’m being used as a target?” said Woody Deant. “I’m not even living that life according to how they portrayed me as. I’m a father. I’m a husband. I’m a career man. I work 9-to-5.”

The Deants contacted Attorney Andell Brown. He said he finds the use of human images for target practice extremely disturbing.

“This can create a very dangerous situation,” Brown said. “And it has been ingrained in your subconscious what does that mean when someone [police] comes across Woody or another person on the street and their decision-making process on using deadly force or not.”
Click to expand...

Florida police caught using mug shots of black men for target practice | MSNBC
 
Last edited:
Somerville said:
Gee, I wonder why they used photos of actual humans for target practice
but when other law enforcement agencies were asked about this "widely used practice", they failed to corroborate Chief Dennis statement
Click to expand...



In the old cowboy shows, a recurring theme was the sharp shooter who had never "killed a man".

The sensitivity of the non-lethal sharp shooter kept him from pulling the trigger when the target was a person and the plot usually revolved around his moral struggle to allow his talent to be used to save the good by killing the bad.

De-sensitizing the recruits seems to be a major part of military training. This might be the thing that was being attempted here.
 
code1211 said:
De-sensitizing the recruits seems to be a major part of military training. This might be the thing that was being attempted here.
Click to expand...
That's definitely the case here. The cops need to be used to seeing Blacks as targets and not people. When an unarmed black child is sleeping on a couch a cop shouldn't think twice about shooting her in the head.
 
reinoe said:
That's definitely the case here. The cops need to be used to seeing Blacks as targets and not people. When an unarmed black child is sleeping on a couch a cop shouldn't think twice about shooting her in the head.
Click to expand...



That's not the message.

In many shooting between the civilians, the eventual victim is the one who first produced the gun.

The original target disarmed the gun owner and used the gun.

The hesitation based on the sensitivity of the gun owner created the opening.

HCSO: Minister shot & killed with his own gun during home invasion | News - Home

If you point a boxing glove at someone, your intent should be to hurt him. If you point a gun at someone, your intent should be to kill him.

Most Americans raised as we are are taught to value life. Hesitation can be fatal in a situation of life and death.

I'm sorry. I read past the part of the racial identifier. I only took in the part about the mug shots.
 
code1211 said:
In the old cowboy shows, a recurring theme was the sharp shooter who had never "killed a man".

The sensitivity of the non-lethal sharp shooter kept him from pulling the trigger when the target was a person and the plot usually revolved around his moral struggle to allow his talent to be used to save the good by killing the bad.

De-sensitizing the recruits seems to be a major part of military training. This might be the thing that was being attempted here.
Click to expand...

If you really want to de-sensitize a shooter so that he can perform like a programmed machine then perhaps they should use targets with pictures of grade school kids. If one can blast a bullet in the target with a 10 year old girl then I would say he is definitely de-sensitized.
 
I don't know about that. I wouldn't have any problem shooting at a paper target that had a photo rather than a human shape on it. None. It's a piece of paper, and the rare times that I've fired a weapon were under tightly controlled circumstances that were nothing like a real-life situation that required a gun.
 
People get all riled up about the lamest things.
 
Somerville said:
Gee, I wonder why they used photos of actual humans for target practice
but when other law enforcement agencies were asked about this "widely used practice", they failed to corroborate Chief Dennis statement
Click to expand...

1. If they're only using African American male mugshots, that may be an issue to discuss. If they are using mug shots of all races and genders, I see nothing wrong with it.

2. Sgt. Deant should be more concerned about her wayward brother and perhaps she's been keeping that a secret and was embarrassed by seeing his pic. It would be interesting to know if Sgt. Deant's brother was convicted of a felony and if he's still serving time from 15 years ago.
 
Crosscheck said:
If you really want to de-sensitize a shooter so that he can perform like a programmed machine then perhaps they should use targets with pictures of grade school kids. If one can blast a bullet in the target with a 10 year old girl then I would say he is definitely de-sensitized.
Click to expand...



I do not know all of the circumstances involved in whatever situation you seem consumed by. Do you?

What were the surrounding events and causes that put that policeman in that situation? What was the resulting investigation's opinion on the matter?

How did a child end up in the line of fire?

Can you link to the news report of the entire incident?
 
CanadaJohn said:
1. If they're only using African American male mugshots, that may be an issue to discuss. If they are using mug shots of all races and genders, I see nothing wrong with it.

2. Sgt. Deant should be more concerned about her wayward brother and perhaps she's been keeping that a secret and was embarrassed by seeing his pic. It would be interesting to know if Sgt. Deant's brother was convicted of a felony and if he's still serving time from 15 years ago.
Click to expand...

#2 is evidence you didn't bother to read the link - it always helps commenters if they have a bit of knowledge regarding the topic under discussion
 
Somerville said:
#2 is evidence you didn't bother to read the link - it always helps commenters if they have a bit of knowledge regarding the topic under discussion
Click to expand...

I generally don't click on links that I'm unfamiliar with and the topic didn't interest me enough to research it separately. Nothing lost.
 
I don't see a valid reason for doing this, but just for the sake of conversation let's say there is a valid reason. Or, at least let's say it doesn't hurt anything.

What the hell kind of unaware moron doesn't know this won't go well if publicized? You're in a position of authority, and are supposed to be educated and responsible and better aware of the nuances of the world than the average schmuck, and it never occurs to you that this will not spin well should the media and the public find out? Seriously.
 
Unless I'm wrong, the same political mentality that I would typically identify as conservative are the same people (generally speaking) that most frequently shout the most about government tyranny. Yet these are also the same people who are quickest to defend police actions that create a picture of civilians as enemy of the state. I'm trying to reconcile these two ideas and am coming up short. Maybe there's some nuance I'm missing here.
 
Cardinal said:
Unless I'm wrong, the same political mentality that I would typically identify as conservative are the same people (generally speaking) that most frequently shout the most about government tyranny. Yet these are also the same people who are quickest to defend police actions that create a picture of civilians as enemy of the state. I'm trying to reconcile these two ideas and am coming up short. Maybe there's some nuance I'm missing here.
Click to expand...
I couldn't argue against this point even if I wanted to.
 
DVSentinel said:
Um, because their job may require them to shoot humans, or at least leftist facsimiles of humans. Possibly even some of the criminals in the photos they used. Makes sense to me. Know your target.

They should also use pictures of well known socialist/liberals, I find it helpful during target practice. Hanoi Jane targets used to be a popular sale at gun ranges.
Click to expand...

Yes, I think shooting at 'human' targets by way of pictures is an old practice. I remember wearing for years a T shirt with Gaddafi's picture on it, overlaid with a crosshairs centered on him. :)
 
Not sure with Miami Beach PD but many cops purchase rounds and targets themselves. Wager this started with the motivating factor being a cheap alternative to buying targets. The target was a printout from a normal printer (8.5 X 11). Likely just morphed into something stupid. Claiming this is some "desensitizing" conspiracy is just....stupid.

Human+Targets+Investigation.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom