Will you vote for Herman Cain in the primary?

liblady said:

uh-huh. he may be smart, but why did he answer a question about which he knew absolutely nothing? he doesn't tell it like it is......he fakes it.

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he had a deer in the head lights moment and blew it.
Doesn't mean he should be thrown under the bus.
Got your radio on? maybe you can pick him a part some more.

Barbbtx said:

he had a deer in the head lights moment and blew it.
Doesn't mean he should be thrown under the bus.
Got your radio on? maybe you can pick him a part some more.

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i'm just trying to figure out why you are so enamored with him.

liblady said:

i'm just trying to figure out why you are so enamored with him.

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he is preaching a conservative hope and change message.

all style, no substance. some people love that method. others don't, but recognize it wins elections.

ARealConservative said:

you keep up this bs, and I'm going door to door politicking against Cain.

You want enemies, keep pulling this blame America first bull****.

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Good. Maybe that will get you out of your Mom's basement and out of your jammies.
Ron Paul, whose side are you on?

Barbbtx said:

Good. Maybe that will get you out of your Mom's basement and out of your jammies.
Ron Paul, whose side are you on?

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I will almost certainly be a delegate again at the Republican National Convention.

The way you are trying to divide conservatives this early makes me not like your candidate at all. Is that your intention?

I find it interesting how the Republican field has responded. Most of them are to scared to run against Obama as they don't want to be labeled as either A) The guy that got beat by Obama or B) Not be able to magically fix the economy in a few months like most people think is possible.

Another reason why I don't think we have a strong front runner at least in polling, is that this varied play field gives no easy choice. Much of the Republican base may think a woman shouldn't be president. Much of the Republican base thinks a black man shouldn't be president, then much of the Republican base is against the Paul Ryan plan, then much of the Republican base is in the tea party thing, then much of the Republican base thinks the Republican candidates aren't somehow conservative enough, so you get this sideshow we've been having the past few months. The media doesn't help anything. Let's be serious though, every Republican here knows in the end their candidate will be a boring white man.

JohnWOlin said:

I find it interesting how the Republican field has responded. Most of them are to scared to run against Obama as they don't want to be labeled as either A) The guy that got beat by Obama or B) Not be able to magically fix the economy in a few months like most people think is possible.

Another reason why I don't think we have a strong front runner at least in polling, is that this varied play field gives no easy choice. Much of the Republican base may think a woman shouldn't be president. Much of the Republican base thinks a black man shouldn't be president, then much of the Republican base is against the Paul Ryan plan, then much of the Republican base is in the tea party thing, then much of the Republican base thinks the Republican candidates aren't somehow conservative enough, so you get this sideshow we've been having the past few months. The media doesn't help anything. Let's be serious though, every Republican here knows in the end their candidate will be a boring white man.

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the conservative movement is massively fractured right now, and I don't see any real end in sight. I've seen this for decades in the libertarian movement. We call it herding angry cats.

the progressive movement seems fractured as well, but unlike conservatives, they are more tightly unified along their hate of conservative ideas, so they tend to put differences aside.

ARealConservative said:

the conservative movement is massively fractured right now, and I don't see any real end in sight. I've seen this for decades in the libertarian movement. We call it herding angry cats.

the progressive movement seems fractured as well, but unlike conservatives, they are more tightly unified along their hate of conservative ideas, so they tend to put differences aside.

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This is very true. I dunno, I personally think it has to do with strong leadership and right now the strongest leadership on the Republican side has a very polarizing plan.

I think as for Herman Cain he has no chance in Hell of winning a primary anywhere. Even watching him on Chris Wallace and Hannity the guy has no substance, was caught off guard by questions he should have known, and still had a very basic "I just read a Newsweek in the green room" idea of foreign policy and suggests that being president is so easy that not only could he do it, but anyone could.

liblady said:

i'm just trying to figure out why you are so enamored with him.

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What conservative wouldn't be?
He has all the conservative values and love of the country that I hold dear. He believes in the American people and he's lived the American dream. He wants the same thing for our children and grandchildren.
That won't be possible if we continue down this road of being willing to settle for second best. The road of dependency on the government for our needs and wants, is the wrong road.
I'm ready for a president who wants all of us to be prosperous, and knows that we are an exceptional country.
One who will secure our southern border and empower the states to defend themselves. One who wants to make it easier(less red tape) for immigrants to become legal, but is absolutely against any kind of amnesty.
One who knows what it will take to get people willing to invest in America and bring money back here by not double taxing it. (zero tax on repatriated money)
I also love the idea of the fair tax. Though he reinterated again that he would not cram it down our throats. He would spend the first two years educating us on it and trying to win our support for it.
Hmmmm...imagine that...a president who wants to involve us in his decision making.
The man is awesome.
Am I enamored with him? You betcha!

ARealConservative said:

he is preaching a conservative hope and change message.

all style, no substance. some people love that method. others don't, but recognize it wins elections.

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What's some things Ron Paul would do to grow the economy?

Barbbtx said:

What conservative wouldn't be?

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plenty of conservatives won't be enamored with him. For being the so called outsider, he has political speak down pat. He doesn't actually say anything tangible. Identify the problem, surround himself with knowledgeable people, etc, etc.

But my biggest fear with Cain is he is hiding his social conservative side for political expedience. He has said some things in the past that truly give me pause.

ARealConservative said:

I will almost certainly be a delegate again at the Republican National Convention.

The way you are trying to divide conservatives this early makes me not like your candidate at all. Is that your intention?

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I guess you haven't been checking out what the Ron Paul supporters are doing. They are eating their own and they don't care, as long as they can get enough people against Cain to make Paul look good. They don't seem to care if Obama gets re-elected or we end up with Romney.
If "I" or any one person can make you not like a candidate, that doesn't say much for thinking for yourself and making an informed decision.

Barbbtx said:

What's some things Ron Paul would do to grow the economy?

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the most important thing, get government out of the way of the economy.

But I'm more of a Gary Johnson guy this time around. Ron Paul has done a fantastic job of re-framing the debate, but he will always remain an education candidate first and foremost.

Barbbtx said:

I guess you haven't been checking out what the Ron Paul supporters are doing. They are eating their own and they don't care, as long as they can get enough people against Cain to make Paul look good. They don't seem to care if Obama gets re-elected or we end up with Romney.
If "I" or any one person can make you not like a candidate, that doesn't say much for thinking for yourself and making an informed decision.

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Ron Paul's supporters are his greatest asset, and worst enemy. Don't follow in their footsteps.

Barbbtx said:

I'm ready for a president who wants all of us to be prosperous, and knows that we are an exceptional country.

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Do you honestly think that Obama wants everyone to be poor and thinks the country that he is president of sucks?

ARealConservative said:

plenty of conservatives won't be enamored with him. For being the so called outsider, he has political speak down pat. He doesn't actually say anything tangible. Identify the problem, surround himself with knowledgeable people, etc, etc.

But my biggest fear with Cain is he is hiding his social conservative side for political expedience. He has said some things in the past that truly give me pause.

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I think Cain has said plenty that was tangible in interviews. In speeches, maybe not so much, but who does?
What are the others like Romney and Pawlenty saying that is tangible? What did Obama EVER say that was tangible? He was voted in before we found out what his change meant and what he meant by fundamentally transforming America.
Cain hiding his social conservative side? It's hanging out there for all to see. He is socially conservative. He's pro-life and anti-gay marriage.

roughdraft274 said:

Do you honestly think that Obama wants everyone to be poor and thinks the country that he is president of sucks?

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It doesn't matter if that's what he wants. His policies will cause that to happen.
He doesn't think our country is exceptional. The closest he came to that was yes, it is exceptional but everyone think their country is exceptional.

ARealConservative said:

the most important thing, get government out of the way of the economy.

But I'm more of a Gary Johnson guy this time around. Ron Paul has done a fantastic job of re-framing the debate, but he will always remain an education candidate first and foremost.

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Yes, getting government out of the way is exactly what we need to do. But just like everyone else, there is no specifics in that answer.
I'd like to have a beer with Gary Johnson, if I was still a drinker. Cain has my vote though.

Barbbtx said:

I think Cain has said plenty that was tangible in interviews. In speeches, maybe not so much, but who does?
What are the others like Romney and Pawlenty saying that is tangible? What did Obama EVER say that was tangible? He was voted in before we found out what his change meant and what he meant by fundamentally transforming America.
Cain hiding his social conservative side? It's hanging out there for all to see. He is socially conservative. He's pro-life and anti-gay marriage.

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I am only familiar with him from the last debate, and he offered nothing substantial to my ears.

If his positions are just a 180 from progressives, where he wants a one size fits all federal policy to handle his views on social policy, then I'll look elsewhere. Social conservatives that embolden federal powers instead of reimplementing state powers scare me.

Anyway, now is the time to keep an open mind, and I am trying to do that. It is human nature to get turned off my the people one is surrounded by. Ron Paul supporters never learned that fact.

roughdraft274 said:

Do you honestly think that Obama wants everyone to be poor and thinks the country that he is president of sucks?

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If Obama doesn't want everyone to be poor, he is not doing a good job of it, the unemployment still remains at 9%, as far as him thinking that our country is exceptional, I don't think so, he has said that our country is a mean country and apologized in Egypt.
Do I want him again for 4 more years.... NO.

Barbbtx said:

You'd vote for "blame America first" and "I wouldn't have killed Bin laden like that" Ron Paul, before you'd vote for Herman Cain?

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You are distorting Paul's views. I don't blame you; the entire media does. In 2008 I bought into it too; I never bothered actually listening and doing research on my own. He does not "blame America" for the actions of other countries. He is only trying to get us to look at our interventionist foreign policy and its unintended consequences, just as government economic intervention has unintended consequences. He is consistent; what makes us think that government can be highly effective abroad but not at home?

But let's face it. Anyone can draw the logical conclusion that when a government bombs people for multiple years those policies will create enemies that want to hurt American citizens. This is exactly what Thomas Jefferson warned about. Paul does not blame the US for 9/11, and he has consistently and vehemently attacked those who committed the deed. He in no way calls it justfied. But he takes the time to see why such people were motivated for such an attack. It is not simply Islam. We need to be honest with ourselves.

As for Bin Laden, Paul did argue that what Obama did was far better than invading countries and engaging in nation building. Listen to this speech by Paul to see what he is really trying to say. He is simply saying we don't have the money to engage in so much wars (he is right) and that president's have abused power by invading countries to nation build without the consent of Congress.
Campaign For Liberty — Congressman Ron Paul on Bin Laden

I believed in 2008 that Paul was dead wrong on foreign policy. I still called myself a conservative. But I was wrong, and I admit it. How can we honestly say that our actions in the middle east have no repurcussions? If the US were continually bombed by other countries, killing civilians despite the intentions of the bombers, we too would be upset. Yet anyone who suggests such is called unpatriotic. I find engaging in such wars to be unpatriotic because they raise the national debt, break the constitution, kill American lives, and break the traditions of the first patriots of this nation: the founding fathers.

With that said, even if Paul had a foreign policy I disagreed with 100%, I would still vote for Paul because Cain wont even say what his is. Plus, this election my key issue is the economy. Paul is the strongest on that issue. Hermain Cain said his plan won't work now...which makes little sense. I honestly don't think he knows what he is talking about, and I question his motives.

Yeah I will agree with the other guys if I had to choose Paul or Cain I would say Paul 100%. He is the only Republican I can think of that I 100% agree with on some things such as war on drugs, foreign policy, auditing the fed (although dismantling it not so much). However I don't agree with most of his social values, education, and how he views the economy overall. If the Tea Party had never been hijacked by Fox News and sorts like that, he would be their leader, then again the Tea Party also would have never gained such prominence either....

ARealConservative said:

I am only familiar with him from the last debate, and he offered nothing substantial to my ears.

If his positions are just a 180 from progressives, where he wants a one size fits all federal policy to handle his views on social policy, then I'll look elsewhere. Social conservatives that embolden federal powers instead of reimplementing state powers scare me.

Anyway, now is the time to keep an open mind, and I am trying to do that. It is human nature to get turned off my the people one is surrounded by. Ron Paul supporters never learned that fact.

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I've been following Cain since 2009 waiting for the day he would run. I think you could say, it's a pretty good bet, he'll get my vote.

I believe in foreign intervention if necessary to our national security interests. I am against nation building because it is a form of international welfare and doesn't help us. Might sound like I only care about us, and thats about right.

Ron Paul, with regards to the Middle East and the "blame america first" label, suffers the same issue as people who suggest women should avoid dark alleys, going out alone, and wearing extremely revealing clothing if they get raped and spend 99% of the time talking about all the bad decisions the women made and 1% of the time talking about the guy that actually DID the raping.

Even if his intent is honest and correct, which it is, like so many things with Ron Paul he blows at attempting to explain it to a lay person. Its his absolute, without a doubt, biggest issue and why he's never going to be a viable Presidential candidate.

That said, I actually agree with ARC for once. One of Paul's greatest assets and worst vices at the same time were his supporters. Its no where near as bad with Cain fans at the moment, but if it starts going down that path its going to be bad news for Cain.