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Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

Should the Young be allowed to Escape Paying In when they will never Draw Out?


  • Total voters
    33
ever hear of the great depression?

So then there must be some pictorial or statistical evidence of all these piles of emaciated senior citizens lining the sidewalks during the Depression?

Evidence, please. Any evidence at all?

Didn't think so.

Seniors were not starving in the streets. Did they suffer through the depression? Yes, but everyone else did, too.
 
So then there must be some pictorial or statistical evidence of all these piles of emaciated senior citizens lining the sidewalks during the Depression?

Evidence, please. Any evidence at all?

Didn't think so.

Seniors were not starving in the streets. Did they suffer through the depression? Yes, but everyone else did, too.

"starving in the streets" is not meant to be literal. as we moved away from a farm economy, nuclear families became more the norm. and yes, seniors DID suffer. you don't know much about our history, do you?
 
I say this poll is silly and I will keep paying in. I am 25 and I might need it someday. I do think that there needs to be changes made to it however.
 
"starving in the streets" is not meant to be literal.

Great. Then you confess there was no holocaust of poverty stricken seniors failing to have their basic needs met before social security. So it stands to reason that without it, that's not a given.

Thank you. Now was dropping the emotional extortion so hard?

as we moved away from a farm economy, nuclear families became more the norm. and yes, seniors DID suffer.

So did everyone else at times.

you don't know much about our history, do you?

I knew enough to call you on your bull**** so don't get too smug just yet.
 
"starving in the streets" is not meant to be literal.

excellent. do you then agree that those who use that kind of hyperbolic language are lying? or are at least destroying the possibility of rational political discourse?


and if not, then i have to ask - why do you want Al Quada to kill American children?
 
Yes, the young should be allowed to escape the Ponzi Scheme.

That being said, the burden is so huge it can't be escaped by anyone now alive. But the Ponzi Scheme should be killed, with a ash stake through it's heart, with its head cut off and stuffed with garlic and salt, and buried in the crossroads at midnight, and the body buried in a coffin stuffed with wild white roses.

And there should be something equivalent to the Holocaust Musuem, with the words "Never Again" over the doorway. "Don't Be So Stupid" can be engraved in the marble foyer.
 
I have a question for all those against SS and Medicare and Medicaid.

Do away with all of them ok...then what happens to the MILLIONS of people who get to old to work that never made enough to save for a pension and health benefits, please dont try and say thats their own fault unless you work in walmart full time and are able to live today and save a bundle for tomorrow. We are talking MILLIONS of people.
 
I have a question for all those against SS and Medicare and Medicaid.

Do away with all of them ok...then what happens to the MILLIONS of people who get to old to work that never made enough to save for a pension and health benefits, please dont try and say thats their own fault unless you work in walmart full time and are able to live today and save a bundle for tomorrow. We are talking MILLIONS of people.

Everyone makes enough to save a little. Social Security was never meant to be what you live on. Just because people made it so doesn't mean they're doing the right thing. It's supposed to be supplemental to your own retirement funds.

In any case, phasing it out would most likely have to be done in intervals.
 
I have a question for all those against SS and Medicare and Medicaid.

Do away with all of them ok...then what happens to the MILLIONS of people who get to old to work that never made enough to save for a pension and health benefits, please dont try and say thats their own fault unless you work in walmart full time and are able to live today and save a bundle for tomorrow. We are talking MILLIONS of people.

You'd see a return to stronger family support for their elderly. As it should be. The government should not be doing what people should be doing for themselves and their own.
 
You'd see a return to stronger family support for their elderly. As it should be. The government should not be doing what people should be doing for themselves and their own.

families used to be much larger. today, it's perfectly normal for people to be childless. what you say will happen, won't.
 
families used to be much larger. today, it's perfectly normal for people to be childless. what you say will happen, won't.

Sort of like your bull**** fairy tale about seniors dying in the street?

Look, I understand that you've lived your life on the selfish promise made to you by your own generation or maybe the one before that you will get to live out your retirement as a second childhood snowbirding it back and forth to florida or in an RV or on some sailboat at the tax payers' expense. I get that.

But it's not my problem nor is it the treasury's problem. If you have to eat catfood into your 80's because you didn't make any other plan save to collect the dole from the government, that's your own problem. I am sure there are programs (and will continue to be programs) to assist lazy, thoughtless, ambitionless adults who coast into their senior years without a plan.

Get on one of those. Or work as a greeter at Walmart. Just stop driving the country deeper into debt with your selfishness.
 
I am 21 and currently a full time student. Last year I was a full time student and working 30 hours a week at 9 dollars an hour. The MAJORITY of taxes taken out of my paycheck was SS. I will not see a penny of that money in my future. If I was given that money in my paycheck, I might have had money to save. But when you are already taking out a large percentage of my check and putting it somewhere I wont get it, you don't leave any room left for me to save on my own. My dad is currently supporting me, if it wasn't for him, I couldn't afford school, medicine, maybe even rent working full time. I look at how expensive things are and then look at my paycheck and wonder how people are supposed to make ends meet without the help of others. I think things need to DRASTICALLY change for those of us who are young will be able to live in the future. I do not need the government to help me retire, just give me my money so I can spend it as I need. If a person doesn't save let them live on the street. It is there fault.
 
I don't particularly like the wording in this poll. I think soc should be fixed, and I don't think the young should be allowed to opt out. The reason is because if the young opt out and blow all their money, they'll just end up wanting government assistance down the road anyway. Everybody might as well pay in, and the government might as ****ing well manage soc funds responsibly.
 
I am 21 and currently a full time student. Last year I was a full time student and working 30 hours a week at 9 dollars an hour. The MAJORITY of taxes taken out of my paycheck was SS. I will not see a penny of that money in my future. If I was given that money in my paycheck, I might have had money to save. But when you are already taking out a large percentage of my check and putting it somewhere I wont get it, you don't leave any room left for me to save on my own. My dad is currently supporting me, if it wasn't for him, I couldn't afford school, medicine, maybe even rent working full time. I look at how expensive things are and then look at my paycheck and wonder how people are supposed to make ends meet without the help of others. I think things need to DRASTICALLY change for those of us who are young will be able to live in the future. I do not need the government to help me retire, just give me my money so I can spend it as I need. If a person doesn't save let them live on the street. It is there fault.

I feel your pain, but I am not going to let the government rob me. You have already decided that you won't see the money in the future... I consider that money a debt that the government has to repay me. The citizens can't have a lay down and take attitude like you have. I am not willing to let either party rob me. I'll demand to be repaid, and if neither party agrees with me, then neither party should be in power.
 
Allowing people to opt-out is a sure way to kill SS and you will NEVER get paid what you put in.
 
Sort of like your bull**** fairy tale about seniors dying in the street?

Look, I understand that you've lived your life on the selfish promise made to you by your own generation or maybe the one before that you will get to live out your retirement as a second childhood snowbirding it back and forth to florida or in an RV or on some sailboat at the tax payers' expense. I get that.

But it's not my problem nor is it the treasury's problem. If you have to eat catfood into your 80's because you didn't make any other plan save to collect the dole from the government, that's your own problem. I am sure there are programs (and will continue to be programs) to assist lazy, thoughtless, ambitionless adults who coast into their senior years without a plan.

Get on one of those. Or work as a greeter at Walmart. Just stop driving the country deeper into debt with your selfishness.

A massive population of impoverished people piling up bad debt in the economy and defaulting on their debts will be your problem...
 
You'd see a return to stronger family support for their elderly. As it should be. The government should not be doing what people should be doing for themselves and their own.

Stronger family support... **** that. It shouldn't only be on the backs of one's family. It should be community concern, and a humanitarian concern. I am not arguing that government enforce people to care, but your attitude of "I don't care if you're 80 and eating cat food" is exactly why people look to the government for help, because they can't look to their fellow man. Maybe if you fixed your own damn attitude, and everybody gave a **** about their neighbor, we wouldn't be having this debate in the first place.
 
If the majority of young people want to opt out of SS, that in itself demonstrates how little faith there was to begin with.
 
Everyone makes enough to save a little. Social Security was never meant to be what you live on. Just because people made it so doesn't mean they're doing the right thing. It's supposed to be supplemental to your own retirement funds.

In any case, phasing it out would most likely have to be done in intervals.

It really isn't enough to live on... My grandparents have ss, medicare, and retirement, but their in their 80s and both handicapped. They have both had major surgeries and dependent on medication, and my grandfather's pension and investments wouldn't be enough to cover the medical costs alone. Prices have drastically increased since we was in his 20s and 30s. My grandfather pretty much refused to spend his money when he was younger and he was a hard worker. When he retired he traveled, but now the medical costs between him and gran are probably over 10,000 a year. They also buy a lot of their medication in foreign countries to save money...

It's fundamental, common knowledge in economics that present value of money is worth more than money earned in the past, due to inflation and price increases... so for that reason, I think having some funds paid out and adjusted for present value is very important.

Time Value of Money (TVM) Definition

It's nearly impossible for somebody to save enough money in their lifetime and live comfortably and financially independent, especially after retirement, unless they are filthy rich or incredibly healthy...
 
I feel your pain, but I am not going to let the government rob me. You have already decided that you won't see the money in the future... I consider that money a debt that the government has to repay me. The citizens can't have a lay down and take attitude like you have. I am not willing to let either party rob me. I'll demand to be repaid, and if neither party agrees with me, then neither party should be in power.

The problem is that if you continue to pay in they will rob you! You will not get that money back and you won't see any benefit from it. You will not be able to demand to be repaid because you don't have any legal grounds to contest it.
I don't have the attitude of lay down and cry. I have the attitude that NOTHING is getting done in this country and the people that are going to suffer are the young. I took ONE semester of government in high school and that is all I had to take through out all of my school including college. No one is educated the youth of this nation on how to save money, how to be self-sufficient and how the government works. All you hear is go to the voting booth. You aren't taught or even told to find out as much as you can about a candidate. I waited for 6 hours in line for vote for president in 2008. I would say 80% of those people voted straight off of what their parents were voting. Note: This was on a college campus. I don't know how the whole nation isn't up in arms fighting against the complacency that is present today. Nothing changes. We all sit around here on DB arguing over the merits of several policies but the majority of us are not fully educated on what bills that are getting passed entail and none of us (or at least most of us) are doing anything to have ANY SORT OF CHANGE!!! That is the premise Obama ran on... Change! He can't do it on his own! Politicians are voted into power by the people but then they get there and go on their own way. I live in Florida and our current governor continually says I wasn't elected to be popular! YES YOU WERE!!! It is their job to do what WE want!!!! Why are we letting them give all our money to other people, the rich, the poor, companies, etc whatever you believe in LET THEM KNOW. Make them do it. Don't let your taxes line their pockets!!!

Sorry it became a rant... It just frustrates me to know that nothing is getting done.
 
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The problem is that if you continue to pay in they will rob you! You will not get that money back and you won't see any benefit from it. You will not be able to demand to be repaid because you don't have any legal grounds to contest it.
I don't have the attitude of lay down and cry. I have the attitude that NOTHING is getting done in this country.

"they" will only rob you if you let them get away with it. shewolf is right, you can't just lay down and take it.
 
The problem is that if you continue to pay in they will rob you! You will not get that money back and you won't see any benefit from it. You will not be able to demand to be repaid because you don't have any legal grounds to contest it.
I don't have the attitude of lay down and cry. I have the attitude that NOTHING is getting done in this country.

You have decided to let the government stream roll over you, and I haven't.... I will not settle on being robbed. It's unconstitutional for the government to remove your property, and if the government acquires your property for public use it has to pay you the FMV of your property. You have basically decided to let the government undermine your constitutional rights and you're not making a sound about it.
 
Sorry, but what you guys are quoting is not what I said. I hit the shift key and tab or something and it entered my post before I was done typing. Please read the whole post which is up not and revise you opinion on what my thought is. I am not laying down and dying... Please read. sorry for the mistake, but it would be wise to actually try find out what I believe before assuming as that is not what I think I conveyed in either of my posts.

In fact, considering I even said " I don't have the attitude of lay down and cry" yet you both said that I do after I said that is a little weird. Maybe you should read past the first few sentences of a post.
 
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A massive population of impoverished people piling up bad debt in the economy and defaulting on their debts will be your problem...

You make the assumption that this will happen. It wasn't happening before SS and there is no need to assume it will happen once SS goes away. Although, I am not really accounting for the greed, laziness, and consumption driven lack of morality of the baby boomers there either so you never know...
 
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