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Would you support means testing for Social Security Benefits?

Would you support means testing for Social Security Benefits?

  • Total voters
    29
haymarket said:
SILLY!!!!!???????

You are not here voluntarily?!?!?!?! Quick, try and post where you are being held against your will so we can dispatch some police to try and liberate you so you can depart for some foreign nation ASAP.
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more diversions. tell us Haymarket do you believe that american citizens should have the right to stop paying into the social security system

I do and I believe no one should be forced to pay anything into that ponzi scheme

how about you?
 
You live here of your own free will.

You claim to be highly educated so you should know better than most about the laws and policies of our nation. You rail against all sorts of things about America and its government , things that you ourtirght hate and loathe and have no trouble saying so.

But still you stay.

And that applies to anyone who does not want to pay into Social Security or any other American program. That is how you get out of it. Either that, or stop working. That also works.

So now its on you.

There is no Berlin Wall confining you. You are here of your own free will and each day you participate in this nation of your own free will. You can withdraw that participation at any time you want to. Its all up to you.
 
haymarket said:
You should continue to push that line of reasoning and so should your party. Trumpet it from the highest peaks and make it the centerpiece of the 2012 elections. tell the American people there is no contract for Social Security despite they having paid into it and fulfilled their end of hte bargain for their entire working lives.

I would love to see that.
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and that, ladies and gentlemen, is the state of todays politics. Democrats are hoping that the GOP has the courage to tell the American people the painful truth so that they can demogogue it for short term political gain, and screw the long term.
 
I think it is a good idea. I would want to know more details, but it looks like a reasonable plan to help keep it viable.
 
cpwill said:
and that, ladies and gentlemen, is the state of todays politics. Democrats are hoping that the GOP has the courage to tell the American people the painful truth so that they can demogogue it for short term political gain, and screw the long term.
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If the GOP truly believes it, then they should follow up on it. They have a moral obligation to do so and a patriotic obligation as well. To do otherwise would be an act of craven political cowardice.
 
cpwill said:
and that, ladies and gentlemen, is the state of todays politics. Democrats are hoping that the GOP has the courage to tell the American people the painful truth so that they can demogogue it for short term political gain, and screw the long term.
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winning elections at the cost of destroying America has been the Dem mantra since the 30's. Creating legions of entitlement addicted pawns was an effective way to gain votes. However, it has sapped ambition and created hordes of chirping little birds demanding mommy government feed them. People who might have soared with eagles are now never get out of the nest because of that strategy
 
Manc Skipper said:
A whizzkid legal eagle should be aware of the concept of implied consent. By cooperating with the system, you give permission.
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sadly for you you fail to comprehend that that theory is not accepted when there also is implied coercion. perhaps try an analogy over something I have not successfully litigated.
 
TurtleDude said:
winning elections at the cost of destroying America has been the Dem mantra since the 30's. Creating legions of entitlement addicted pawns was an effective way to gain votes. However, it has sapped ambition and created hordes of chirping little birds demanding mommy government feed them. People who might have soared with eagles are now never get out of the nest because of that strategy
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Yes, we get that you BELIVE that because you want to BELIEVE that and you use your BELIEF SYSTEM to support your claims. We all get that. But do you have any actual evidence that Democrats do this and are alone in doing this?
 
TurtleDude said:
sadly for you you fail to comprehend that that theory is not accepted when there also is implied coercion. perhaps try an analogy over something I have not successfully litigated.
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Manc Skipper is 100% right in telling you that you give your cooperation and consent every day you stay here under our system and laws. There is no Berlin Wall holding you here in the nation you seem to loathe with every fiber of your being.
 
haymarket said:
Yes, we get that you BELIVE that because you want to BELIEVE that and you use your BELIEF SYSTEM to support your claims. We all get that. But do you have any actual evidence that Democrats do this and are alone in doing this?
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that you spend so much time trying to convince yourself that I am wrong establishes that I am right

the GOP panders to people on other levels such as claiming they are for christian values (LOL) and they and they alone are for law and order. They also run on keeping the dems from taking more taxes from us who pay most of the federal taxes.
 
haymarket said:
Manc Skipper is 100% right in telling you that you give your cooperation and consent every day you stay here under our system and laws. There is no Berlin Wall holding you here in the nation you seem to loathe with every fiber of your being.
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Remind me of your law degree and what state you are licensed in: seizing property or forcing someone to leave the nation they were born in wipes out the implied consent argument.
 
haymarket said:
Manc Skipper is 100% right in telling you that you give your cooperation and consent every day you stay here under our system and laws. There is no Berlin Wall holding you here in the nation you seem to loathe with every fiber of your being.
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Just cause you want to live off the work of others doesn't mean TD loathes this nation.
 
TurtleDude said:
Remind me of your law degree and what state you are licensed in: seizing property or forcing someone to leave the nation they were born in wipes out the implied consent argument.
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You need a law degree to post here and give your opinion?!?!?!?!?!?

There goes the neighborhood.

Everyday you stay here you do so of your own free will. Is there someone who is keeping you prisoner? Is there a place where are you being held in American against your will? There is no Berlin wall here and you can leave at any time.
 
American said:
Just cause you want to live off the work of others doesn't mean TD loathes this nation.
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Sure he does. It comes across loud and clear in post after post after post in thread after thread after thread. He has gross contempt for our system of government, for the American people and for our elected government. He calls them mobs and wants to deny them such basic American rights as the right to vote. That is about as anti-American as you can be without being an enemy combatant.
 
haymarket said:
You need a law degree to post here and give your opinion?!?!?!?!?!?

There goes the neighborhood.

Everyday you stay here you do so of your own free will. Is there someone who is keeping you prisoner? Is there a place where are you being held in American against your will? There is no Berlin wall here and you can leave at any time.
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opinions are more valuable when a person has expertise. that is why doctors can provide opinion testimony in courts involving cases of medical malpractice and you could not
 
TurtleDude said:
that you spend so much time trying to convince yourself that I am wrong establishes that I am right

.
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that 'statement' makes no sense on any level.
 
To some degree. If they are really about to take sandwiches out of the mouths of disabled people I would say whatever it takes. Or poor old people.
 
haymarket said:
You need a law degree to post here and give your opinion?!?!?!?!?!?

There goes the neighborhood.

Everyday you stay here you do so of your own free will. Is there someone who is keeping you prisoner? Is there a place where are you being held in American against your will? There is no Berlin wall here and you can leave at any time.
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So, basically, you keep making an "America, love or leave it" type argument. I thought liberals hated that, and that "dissent is the greatest form of patriotism", blah, blah.:roll:
 
X Factor said:
So, basically, you keep making an "America, love or leave it" type argument. I thought liberals hated that, and that "dissent is the greatest form of patriotism", blah, blah.:roll:
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If those targeted for having more and more of their wealth taken by greedy dem politicians did leave the dem pawns would riot as the public teat ran dry
 
TurtleDude said:
If those targeted for having more and more of their wealth taken by greedy dem politicians did leave the dem pawns would riot as the public teat ran dry
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Turtle, respectfully you have been brainwashed by the rich same as many americans....Corporations pay SQUAT for taxs most are just like GE pay nothing or very little. The rich do not pay 35% if they and the corps paid a straight 35% the treasury would be brimming with cash.
My cousin is in the top tax bracket and has been for decades right from his mouth he has never paid a nickle over 10% and many years less.....I PAY 15%. This is all a conjob by the rich...the middle class carry most of the freight in this country
There are so many ways to cut this deficit and cut it fast without attacking middle class america but that is NOT the goal of the teaparty...theyre concern is not america as a whole their concern is the rich not paying any taxs
 
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lpast said:
Turtle, respectfully you have been brainwashed by the rich same as many americans....Corporations pay SQUAT for taxs most are just like GE pay nothing or very little. The rich do not pay 35% if they and the corps paid a straight 35% the treasury would be brimming with cash.
My cousin is in the top tax bracket and has been for decades right from his mouth he has never paid a nickle over 10% and many years less.....I PAY 15%. This is all a conjob by the rich...the middle class carry most of the freight in this country
There are so many ways to cut this deficit and cut it fast without attacking middle class america but that is NOT the goal of the teaparty...theyre concern is not america as a whole their concern is the rich not paying any taxs
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You make a lot of empirical statements with absolutely no supporting evidence. The TEA party is mostly middle class, btw.
 
No I do not support means testing for Social Security. Unlike other social programs (Medicare, Medicaid, food stamps etc) Social Security is tied directly to personal contributions and accounted for on that basis. This is not a program designed to provide aid to the needy, it is designed as a forced savings plan to supplement your income at retirement.

I would instead support an option for a portion of the individual's contributions to be directed toward selected investment options at the contributors direction. I could also support removing the cap on contributions (ie not cut off at $100K (I think that is the level) for a minimum on the employers portion, if not both employer and employee
 
snilloctjc said:
No I do not support means testing for Social Security. Unlike other social programs (Medicare, Medicaid, food stamps etc) Social Security is tied directly to personal contributions and accounted for on that basis. This is not a program designed to provide aid to the needy, it is designed as a forced savings plan to supplement your income at retirement.

I would instead support an option for a portion of the individual's contributions to be directed toward selected investment options at the contributors direction. I could also support removing the cap on contributions (ie not cut off at $100K (I think that is the level) for a minimum on the employers portion, if not both employer and employee
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The teaparty does not want to fix social security and medicare....ultimately their goal is to get rid of it entirely.
 
lpast said:
Turtle, respectfully you have been brainwashed by the rich same as many americans....Corporations pay SQUAT for taxs most are just like GE pay nothing or very little. The rich do not pay 35% if they and the corps paid a straight 35% the treasury would be brimming with cash.
My cousin is in the top tax bracket and has been for decades right from his mouth he has never paid a nickle over 10% and many years less.....I PAY 15%. This is all a conjob by the rich...the middle class carry most of the freight in this country
There are so many ways to cut this deficit and cut it fast without attacking middle class america but that is NOT the goal of the teaparty...theyre concern is not america as a whole their concern is the rich not paying any taxs
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I love it when people who aren't paying top rates and don't own corporations try to extrapolate their own lack of knowledge to me

your rants about GE are wrong-here is a post from Old Reliable that might set you straight



oldreliable67 said:
You can read about GE's taxes here.

Read the cite for the details, but GE's 2010 tax situation was impacted by:

1. Significant losses at GE Capital

2. Resolution of prior year's tax disputes with the IRs

3. GE paid almost $2.7 billion in cash taxes in 2010 on a consolidated basis (almost 19% of pretax income from continuing operations).
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you only pay 15%? LOL

and you are lying about the middle class carrying most of the freight

the top one percent paid 40% of the FIT and almost all the death tax
the top 5% pay more federal income taxes and death taxes than the rest of the country combined



the rich pay too many taxes and the evil of that is not merely unfairness but by them paying too much too many people have no interest in holding down spending because the rich subsidize them. The rich are forced to give -through the political process where ten slackers can out vote one productive taxpayer-the masses a credit card that the rich have to pay the bills on

if we want to get rid of the deficit we have to do more than raise revenues-which the rich cannot and will not do on their own. we have to stop politicians winning elections by spending spending spending. that works now because most voters don't think they will have to pay for that spending due to the progressive income tax
 
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