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Do Mexicans want their Land Back?

Do Mexicans want their Land Back?

  • Yes! Most all of Mexicans want to take back their land

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Yes! Some mexicans still want back the land they lost

    Votes: 7 25.9%

  • No! Very few mexicans want back the land they lost

    Votes: 5 18.5%

  • No! None of them want the land they lost to the US back

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • OTHER / I dont know / Chimichanga

    Votes: 15 55.6%
  • Total voters
    27
Hatuey said:
Your post is the only straw man there is. You're saying that the one reason we're so anti-Mexican has anything to do with a fringe minority asking for some territory back or some perceived problem. The overwhelming majority of Mexicans aren't even in the Chicano movement or remotely interested in border politics. If anything Mexican immigration to this country allows it to exist. They do a hard day's work for 5 dollars an hour while millions of Americans would rather be on welfare. They clean floors for a pittance and accept that they'll be taxed for services they're not going to benefit from. Sorry, your 'Mexican problem' is the only straw man here.

And your comment on immigration laws is bull**** too. The US has a history of creating different immigration policies for different groups. As an example, republicans in the early 1900s tried passing anti-Italian immigration laws in addition to already existing laws. Irish Catholics during the 1830s were ostracized by our society whether they came here legally or not. ****, just look at Cubans and Haitians today. Cubans are allowed to get in due to the wet feet dry feet rule, Haitians are sent back. No ludahai, you have no idea what it is you're talking about. The arbitrary way in which this policy is drawn allows us to call some groups a problem while welcoming others.
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You tried that crap in another thread and it failed just as miserably there. People are not anti-mexican, nor ant-immigration. I posted the numbers showing ever increasing LEGAL immigration trends. No one is asking for that to cease or be reduced and you know it. The problem is not mexicans...the problem is ILLEGAL immigrants. We dont have to have 'special' laws for mexicans or Canadians...we simply need to enforce the ones in place. At present time, we dont appear to have 20-430 million illegal Canadians pouring over our borders.
 
Hatuey said:
What anti-immigration laws has the US created specifically against Canadians?
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The same ones that exist for Mexicans. Have you ever looked at Canada's immigration laws?

BTW, are there 30 million illegal Canadians in the US?
 
apdst said:
The same ones that exist for Mexicans. Have you ever looked at Canada's immigration laws?

BTW, are there 30 million illegal Canadians in the US?
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Are there even 30 million Canadians?
 
Here are some observations on the above:

30 million illegals? That's way over half the population of Mexico. There are a lot of illegals, but please, 30 million?

The US won the war with Mexico. The winners of wars always write the history books, so whatever we say goes.

What Mexico really needs and deserves from the US is a reasonable immigration policy and an end to the drug wars. What the US needs to have is a reasonable immigration policy and an end to the war on drugs. The two nations' needs are mutual.

The last thing the Mexican peasants want/need is an expansion of Mexican territory. Given the chance, most of them would come to the US, in which case we could actually have 30 million immigrants from that country, legal or not.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Here are some observations on the above:

30 million illegals? That's way over half the population of Mexico. There are a lot of illegals, but please, 30 million?

The US won the war with Mexico. The winners of wars always write the history books, so whatever we say goes.

What Mexico really needs and deserves from the US is a reasonable immigration policy and an end to the drug wars. What the US needs to have is a reasonable immigration policy and an end to the war on drugs. The two nations' needs are mutual.

The last thing the Mexican peasants want/need is an expansion of Mexican territory. Given the chance, most of them would come to the US, in which case we could actually have 30 million immigrants from that country, legal or not.
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the estimates range from 20-30 million illegal immigrants in America with the majority coming from mehico. mehico SHOOTS illegal immigrants crossing THEIR southern border and jails them when caught. Is that the kind of fair and equitable immigration you are talking about? We currently bring in many millions of immigrants annually. So just what is it that you consider fair and BTW...what the hell is 'fair' anyway? And hey...Im all for ending the illegality of marijuana...but that solves mhicos problems how exactly? Their country is a ****hole...by their own making. They have crap for an economy. Never have so many people been truly PROUD to be (away) FROM a single country.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Here are some observations on the above:

30 million illegals? That's way over half the population of Mexico. There are a lot of illegals, but please, 30 million?

The US won the war with Mexico. The winners of wars always write the history books, so whatever we say goes.

What Mexico really needs and deserves from the US is a reasonable immigration policy and an end to the drug wars. What the US needs to have is a reasonable immigration policy and an end to the war on drugs. The two nations' needs are mutual.

The last thing the Mexican peasants want/need is an expansion of Mexican territory. Given the chance, most of them would come to the US, in which case we could actually have 30 million immigrants from that country, legal or not.
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Most Mexican's are all talk and no substance. They would never go through with a revolution against the US. Any armed conflict would be easily lost by the Mexican's. Even the ones here will admit that the US is by far a better country than Mexico will ever be. We do need an immigration reform. I do seriously wonder the accuracy of those studies that show how much money it illegal aliens cost taxpayers. Because my mom works as a special education teacher in public schools attended by mostly Mexicans' whose parents are illegal or the whole family is. And really every winter, the kids have colds and are sick. Why? Because they live in trailer parks and heat is something hard to come by in a trailer park. So the cold gives them a hard time(we know their weakness, hehehe). And the majority of the kids wear clothing that is falling apart. My mother buys them clothing at times. Because most are too poor to afford clothing.

Basically what I am trying to say. Is that the illegal aliens are not the problem. They come here and live in squaler like back in their native country. But the majority would prefer to stay here because at least the young ones will have a chance to get out of poverty. I know many American's claim they are a law abiding people. Though the hypocripsy of the public is really disgusting and shameful. Just as shameful as the all talk no substance extremists of the Mexican population.
 
VanceMack said:
the estimates range from 20-30 million illegal immigrants in America with the majority coming from mehico. mehico SHOOTS illegal immigrants crossing THEIR southern border and jails them when caught. Is that the kind of fair and equitable immigration you are talking about? We currently bring in many millions of immigrants annually. So just what is it that you consider fair and BTW...what the hell is 'fair' anyway? And hey...Im all for ending the illegality of marijuana...but that solves mhicos problems how exactly? Their country is a ****hole...by their own making. They have crap for an economy. Never have so many people been truly PROUD to be (away) FROM a single country.
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The federal government estimates just under 12 million, and just over half of those coming from Mexico. Six or seven million is a much more plausible figure, but then, no one really knows.

As for that border war, so far 30,000 Mexicans have lost their lives due to the drug traffickers fighting over who gets to sell us drugs. Now, if that is not a problem affecting both nations, what is?

We need to start enforcing our current immigration laws, starting with fining employers of illegals. We need to have a better policy, allowing a limited number of workers from Mexico to come here legally and not have to live in the shadows. We have to have a policy in place to deal with the illegals already here, and not one that gives amnesty and therefore an incentive for more to come. We tried that back in the '80s, and already know the result. We also need to have a more effective and less destructive way of discouraging drug abuse.

Of course, none of that is likely to happen so long as the lobbyists for special interests keep working for the status quo.
 
Dittohead not! said:
The federal government estimates just under 12 million, and just over half of those coming from Mexico. Six or seven million is a much more plausible figure, but then, no one really knows.

As for that border war, so far 30,000 Mexicans have lost their lives due to the drug traffickers fighting over who gets to sell us drugs. Now, if that is not a problem affecting both nations, what is?

We need to start enforcing our current immigration laws, starting with fining employers of illegals. We need to have a better policy, allowing a limited number of workers from Mexico to come here legally and not have to live in the shadows. We have to have a policy in place to deal with the illegals already here, and not one that gives amnesty and therefore an incentive for more to come. We tried that back in the '80s, and already know the result. We also need to have a more effective and less destructive way of discouraging drug abuse.

Of course, none of that is likely to happen so long as the lobbyists for special interests keep working for the status quo.
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Its lunacy to think that we should change our drug laws so that the drug traffickers will stop killing each other and every other soul within range. Im for changing the drug laws regarding marijuana because I simply dont think it is a harmful drug (certainly no more so than alcohol). But mehico? To be blunt...**** them. They have had an ineffective corrupt government for so long and have turned their back on the drug trade that they are reaping what they have sown.

As to the exact numbers...no one knows. the figures and estimates you get all depend on who is trying to prove what. 5 million, 10 million, 20 million...how about we just settle on a whole friggin lot of them. Once you get past 100,000 or so...who's counting?
"Between 12 and 20 million illegal immigrants live in the United States, the exact number is unknown.
www.usimmigrationsupport.org/illegal-immigration.html"

I have said precisely the same thing with regard to employers and illegal immigration. im not anti hispanic nor anti-legal immigrant. And I recognize the great majority of those here illegaly are hard working people that have risked everything to be able to provide for their family. Id make a straight up trade...keep every illegal immigrant here and send mehico a like number of our crippled and dependent pets that wont work.
 
VanceMack said:
Its lunacy to think that we should change our drug laws so that the drug traffickers will stop killing each other and every other soul within range. Im for changing the drug laws regarding marijuana because I simply dont think it is a harmful drug (certainly no more so than alcohol). But mehico? To be blunt...**** them. They have had an ineffective corrupt government for so long and have turned their back on the drug trade that they are reaping what they have sown.

As to the exact numbers...no one knows. the figures and estimates you get all depend on who is trying to prove what. 5 million, 10 million, 20 million...how about we just settle on a whole friggin lot of them. Once you get past 100,000 or so...who's counting?
"Between 12 and 20 million illegal immigrants live in the United States, the exact number is unknown.
www.usimmigrationsupport.org/illegal-immigration.html"

I have said precisely the same thing with regard to employers and illegal immigration. im not anti hispanic nor anti-legal immigrant. And I recognize the great majority of those here illegaly are hard working people that have risked everything to be able to provide for their family. Id make a straight up trade...keep every illegal immigrant here and send mehico a like number of our crippled and dependent pets that wont work.
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How about fining the (bleep!) out of anyone who hires illegals, then making it possible for them to return home with a reasonable chance of being re admitted legally?

That way, we could keep the good, hard working people, while screening out the gang bangers and druggies, and not give the folks back in the old country an incentive to cross the border illegally.
 
Dittohead not! said:
How about fining the (bleep!) out of anyone who hires illegals, then making it possible for them to return home with a reasonable chance of being re admitted legally?

That way, we could keep the good, hard working people, while screening out the gang bangers and druggies, and not give the folks back in the old country an incentive to cross the border illegally.
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All for it and have said so myself. Id make it easier for businesses to ensure they were hiring legal immigrants and crucify them if they didnt follow reasonable procedures to verify status.
 
It's not their land to take back. Maybe they want it, but they aren't going to get nor should they try.
 
Dittohead not! said:
The federal government estimates just under 12 million, and just over half of those coming from Mexico. Six or seven million is a much more plausible figure, but then, no one really knows.
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If you check, you'll see that 12 million number has been used since the mid-90's and government figures also confirm that between 1 million and 1.5 million cross over into the USA annually. Even presuming some return to their country of origin, that still leaves an estimate of between 22 and 27 million here now. You're right, no one really knows, but the 12 million number is totally bogus. The estimated breakdown of illegals in the USA is that 60% are from Mexico, and another 24% are from Central America.

As for that border war, so far 30,000 Mexicans have lost their lives due to the drug traffickers fighting over who gets to sell us drugs. Now, if that is not a problem affecting both nations, what is?
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We should legalize drugs. The cartels would implode overnight. (yes, I'm serious)

We need to start enforcing our current immigration laws, starting with fining employers of illegals. We need to have a better policy, allowing a limited number of workers from Mexico to come here legally and not have to live in the shadows. We have to have a policy in place to deal with the illegals already here, and not one that gives amnesty and therefore an incentive for more to come. We tried that back in the '80s, and already know the result. We also need to have a more effective and less destructive way of discouraging drug abuse.
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I agree no more amnesty. That's what started the stampede in the first place. I also agree we need to enforce our laws and go after employers of illegals. I'm okay with increasing the number of legal immigrants from Mexico... however, we already allow more immigrants from Mexico than from any other country on the planet, more than twice as many as India, which is the second-highest number of legal immigrants.

Of course, none of that is likely to happen so long as the lobbyists for special interests keep working for the status quo.
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Exactly. That's the main reason I get so angry about the situation, because I know that both sides are being bribed by campaign money and promise of votes not to enforce immigration laws. That's a real betrayal of the American people and of the positions these people were elected to uphold.
 
DiAnna said:
We should legalize drugs. The cartels would implode overnight. (yes, I'm serious)
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Not that quick BUUUUUT you mentioned a MAJOR part of all of this. Speaking to my mexican friends the cartels and drug mafias are KILLING their land. Anyone..... and I mean ANYONE the opposes them dies. The US extended a hand to the Northern most area in mexico. The "governor" declined. Either HE would be beheaded or his family..... or his friends. :(
 
Who cares? The wrongs of the past are past and all we can do is treat people well now. What's next, the Native Americans? The Neanderthals?
 
Dittohead not! said:
Here are some observations on the above:

30 million illegals? That's way over half the population of Mexico. There are a lot of illegals, but please, 30 million?
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Last time I checked Mexico had perhaps the 10th largest population and it was almost 110 MILLION people, not 60.
 
Dittohead not! said:
It could also be argued that illegal aliens from Europe had a negative impact on the native Americans in what is now Mexico and the US as well.
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It could also be argued that the Indians stole the land from the animals that were here first. Since your argument has already gone ridiculous, what's left to say. The indians weren't a union; I mean are we going to try and find some ridiculous equivalence between the European settlers and those that already lived here, and apply it to the current situation? You aren't going to win the argument nor gain anyone's respect with it. Go back and see how often it's been used and failed.
 
DiAnna said:
If you check, you'll see that 12 million number has been used since the mid-90's and government figures also confirm that between 1 million and 1.5 million cross over into the USA annually. Even presuming some return to their country of origin, that still leaves an estimate of between 22 and 27 million here now. You're right, no one really knows, but the 12 million number is totally bogus. The estimated breakdown of illegals in the USA is that 60% are from Mexico, and another 24% are from Central America.
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The answer to the question is that no one knows exactly how many, but there are way too many for sure. Thirty million seems way high, as that is 10% of the entire population of the US. One in ten people living here are illegal immigrants? Let's hope that figure is as inflated as it sounds. Twelve is the official government figure, and therefore suspect.

How many? too many.

DiAnna said:
We should legalize drugs. The cartels would implode overnight. (yes, I'm serious)
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Seriously, that would solve more problems than it would create, and yes, the cartels would go the way of the bootlegger gangs of the '30s. We should start with the innocuous ones, like pot.

DiAnna said:
I agree no more amnesty. That's what started the stampede in the first place. I also agree we need to enforce our laws and go after employers of illegals. I'm okay with increasing the number of legal immigrants from Mexico... however, we already allow more immigrants from Mexico than from any other country on the planet, more than twice as many as India, which is the second-highest number of legal immigrants.
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Got that right. Legal immigrants can also be screened for gang bangers and druggies. I think we have enough of those already. Let's check and see.. Yes, we have all we need, and more.

DiAnna said:
Exactly. That's the main reason I get so angry about the situation, because I know that both sides are being bribed by campaign money and promise of votes not to enforce immigration laws. That's a real betrayal of the American people and of the positions these people were elected to uphold.
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Yep. It's called politics as usual, and it stinks as usual.

Me thinks you don't know how many people live in Mexico...
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You got me there. I was thinking around 45-50 million. The actual figure is over 112 million.

And what percent of them want to come to the US? I seem to remember reading around 40% or so, but then, I remembered 45 to 50 million so that may be a low figure too.:shock:
 
Bodhisattva said:
Mexicans wanting land back is racist? ummm what?
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Who exactly are these mehicans that you speak of? You mean, the Spaniards? That stole the land from the Mayans?
 
American said:
It could also be argued that the Indians stole the land from the animals that were here first. Since your argument has already gone ridiculous, what's left to say. The indians weren't a union; I mean are we going to try and find some ridiculous equivalence between the European settlers and those that already lived here, and apply it to the current situation? You aren't going to win the argument nor gain anyone's respect with it. Go back and see how often it's been used and failed.
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It might also be pointed out that the indians slaughtered and enslaved each other on a regular basis long before the Euro's ever stepped foot on NA soil. Conquest is what people do. They always have.
 
The Giant Noodle said:
After reading some responses on another forum regarding Arizona seceding from the Union (sorta) I stumbled upon one that was registered with a mexican IP addy that said:



So My question to you is do Mexicans STILL want back the areas we took from them?
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I grew up in arizona. The mexican nationals and quite a few mexican americans believe we stole the southwest from them. Yes, a hell of a lot of mexicans, american and mexican nationals want it back. Just why wouldn't they?
 
VanceMack said:
It might also be pointed out that the indians slaughtered and enslaved each other on a regular basis long before the Euro's ever stepped foot on NA soil. Conquest is what people do. They always have.
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We're supposed to feel guilty because our ancestors were better at it.
 
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