• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Who/What is at fault for the mass shooting in AZ? (choose all that apply)

It's the fault of....


  • Total voters
    42

Josie

*probably reading smut*
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
57,302
Reaction score
31,728
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Who/What do you believe is at fault for the shooting of Giffords and others in AZ this past Saturday? Please check all that you believe have a part in the blame.
 
The shooter is at fault.

The crap some at Fox, some at MSNBC, some on conservative talk radio, some at liberal print media, etc, throws around isn't against the law, I just find it to be f***** despicable... personally.
 
The shooter obviously, and the only other people that could be at blame would be his parents. They should have known he had bought a gun, and his mental problems, if he lived with them. If not, then they can't really be blamed.
 
He was 22, how could his parents possibly be responsible for his actions? Even were he 17 and able to acquire a firearm, it is questionable whether his parents would be responsible for his actions - according to the law they would have been, yet they weren't the ones who pulled the trigger.

It is claimed that he has mentally illness. If it is not of the sort that prevents distinguishing right from wrong, then he should not be prevented from owning a firearm. I myself am mentally ill, know right from wrong, am trained in the use of a firearm and have a concealed carry permit, although I do not currently own a firearm.

In that situation, I would be one either hiding or trying to stop the madman - never know quite how you will react until you are in such a situation. I'd like to think I would have the courage to attempt to stop it.

How could anything else possibly be responsible for his actions? It is said that he is a nihilist and a reader of Neitzsche and interested in fomenting chaos. It is said that he was an anarchist. Did this worldview contribute to his actions? Quite possibly. I do not think that the adoption of a worldview or opinion, that leads one to despicable behavior, implies that any other individual is responsible for the man's actions. I do think it could be said that that set of ideas promotes violence. Should we restrict such ideas? It seems to be a violation of the 1st amendment.
 
I tend to see things in terms of a formula with many variables. Take a schizophrenic person, give him a family unable to deal with his issues, expose him to a media that glorifies violence, make the access to weapons too little regulated, provide a psychological trigger that demonizes certain individuals or groups, and voila'. None of these factors are entirely responsible, and some are more responsible than others, but the lack of any particular one might make the difference with the particular person involved.

Everybody likes to simplify things, usually by creating mutually exclusive dichotomies reduced down to the level of "show me the direct relationship" , but you know -- life is not so simple as that, especially when considering people's behavior. Heck, none of us really know why WE act the way we do, so how can we expect to gain an understanding of others if we insist on creating these rigid, and often times politically motivated templates for evaluating them that discard all possibilities other than the one we have predetermined?
 
Last edited:
The fault of the shooter.And if Arizona allows you to have someone seek out a metal evaluation then it is also the fault of those people who claimed he was nuts but didn't do anything about it.
 
The American people, most of them. 50% not participating, not voting; another mass of people not speaking out on the Internet as the DB people do...
Overly wrapped in fear and ignorance...and worse yet, not caring.

If "privacy" can be removed and ones medical records used to protect society from nut-cases...
Yes, I watch MSNBC, this "privacy" fear is a problem that needs to be dealt with..
Had the right people seen his records, then , no gun.
Gun ownership must be reserved for the sane and responsible.
Charlatans/fear mongers such as Beck and Limbaugh do not help, Maddow is becoming almost as bad.
We need more PBS and NPR.
Less NRA.
 
The fault of the shooter.And if Arizona allows you to have someone seek out a metal evaluation then it is also the fault of those people who claimed he was nuts but didn't do anything about it.
Agree.
Present "privacy" laws protect the individual, but not really...the privacy laws must be overhauled, completely. Privacy prevents the police from knowing what they should know...
Who is responsible for this ?
 
There is only one person that can be charged with the crime and that's the shooter.
 
The second gunman on the grassy knoll. :mrgreen:

The shooter, obviously.
 
Who/What do you believe is at fault for the shooting of Giffords and others in AZ this past Saturday? Please check all that you believe have a part in the blame.

Unquestionably it is the shooters fault.

As to whether or not anyones at fault for not potentially stopping it before it happened, or for possibly having failed in some way to prevent it when its reasonable to suggest they should've, or whether someone was directly influential in leading him to doing it....all of that's going to be unknown until actual facts come out.

But whose at fault specifically for the murders and the killing...the shooter and the shooter alone.
 
Unquestionably it is the shooters fault.

As to whether or not anyones at fault for not potentially stopping it before it happened, or for possibly having failed in some way to prevent it when its reasonable to suggest they should've, or whether someone was directly influential in leading him to doing it....all of that's going to be unknown until actual facts come out.

But whose at fault specifically for the murders and the killing...the shooter and the shooter alone.


It's ultimatley the shooters fault, but many many many people dropped the ball on this one:


Rantings of creepy Arizona mass murder suspect Jared Lee Loughner: 'This is my genocide school'
 
I tend to see things in terms of a formula with many variables. Take a schizophrenic person, give him a family unable to deal with his issues, expose him to a media that glorifies violence, make the access to weapons too little regulated, provide a psychological trigger that demonizes certain individuals or groups, and voila'. None of these factors are entirely responsible, and some are more responsible than others, but the lack of any particular one might make the difference with the particular person involved.

Everybody likes to simplify things, usually by creating mutually exclusive dichotomies reduced down to the level of "show me the direct relationship" , but you know -- life is not so simple as that, especially when considering people's behavior. Heck, none of us really know why WE act the way we do, so how can we expect to gain an understanding of others if we insist on creating these rigid, and often times politically motivated templates for evaluating them that discard all possibilities other than the one we have predetermined?

All well and good about "these things".

have any thoughts about this SPECIFIC thing?
 
Who/What do you believe is at fault for the shooting of Giffords and others in AZ this past Saturday? Please check all that you believe have a part in the blame.

To think that it is anyone other than the shooters is idiotic. Personal agenda's does not change the reality that only the person pulling the trigger is the one that decides to pull that trigger. Or not pull the trigger.
 
I blame the shooter but I also blame a society that tolerates such easy access to semi-automatic handguns and high capacity magazines.
 
The American people, most of them. 50% not participating, not voting; another mass of people not speaking out on the Internet as the DB people do...
Overly wrapped in fear and ignorance...and worse yet, not caring.

If "privacy" can be removed and ones medical records used to protect society from nut-cases...
Yes, I watch MSNBC, this "privacy" fear is a problem that needs to be dealt with..
Had the right people seen his records, then , no gun.
Gun ownership must be reserved for the sane and responsible.
Charlatans/fear mongers such as Beck and Limbaugh do not help, Maddow is becoming almost as bad.
We need more PBS and NPR.
Less NRA.

wtf did the NRA do?
 
I blame the shooter but I also blame a society that tolerates such easy access to semi-automatic handguns and high capacity magazines.



I blame the shooter, and the failure of those around him. I don't believe in mythical powers of inanimate objects.
 
I blame the shooter but I also blame a society that tolerates such easy access to semi-automatic handguns and high capacity magazines.

that is psychobabble. people intent on mass murder are going to be able to do it even if your hoplophobic dreams were to come true. Tim McVeigh didn't need a gun nor did the guy who firebombed a Dominican night club in NYC years ago
 
Agree.
Present "privacy" laws protect the individual, but not really...the privacy laws must be overhauled, completely. Privacy prevents the police from knowing what they should know...
Who is responsible for this ?

a constitutional republic that realizes there is a balance between privacy rights, doctor-patient privilege and the state's need to know
 
And, if it turns out that the shooter is not responsible by reason of insanity, who/what is at fault for the mass shooting in AZ? It would appear that this was his first serious criminal act. It is hard to blame parents, schools, etc. when there was no serious incident to point at.

Or was it just inevitable. Mass shootings are just the price of American-style liberty. Oh, well, nothing to see here, just another pound of flesh that we must occasionally pony up for our freedom.

Rather, I think Americans have a huge blind spot in the shape of a handgun that we just won't come to terms with.
 
Back
Top Bottom