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Federation v Empire

In a war between the Federation and the Empire, who wins?

  • Total voters
    32
Jetboogieman said:
Not to mention the fact that the Empires relatively primitive "Lasers" were once sort of referenced in the show, A ship attacked the Enterprise with Lasers on board, much like the ones from Star Wars... and worfs exact words were "Lasers! That wouldn't even penetrate our navigation deflector".
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Despite being called turbolasers, SW weapons are clearly not lasers. They are visible, and propagate slower than light. This clearly precludes them being lasers.

If you allow expanded universe sources for Star Wars (which some people do and others don't in this kind of debate) they explain that SW beam weapons are plasma/particle beam weapons, and not lasers.

Then again, that doesn't fit what we see in the movies either (none of the beams are affected by gravity).
 
molten_dragon said:
Despite being called turbolasers, SW weapons are clearly not lasers. They are visible, and propagate slower than light. This clearly precludes them being lasers.

If you allow expanded universe sources for Star Wars (which some people do and others don't in this kind of debate) they explain that SW beam weapons are plasma/particle beam weapons, and not lasers.

Then again, that doesn't fit what we see in the movies either (none of the beams are affected by gravity).
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Dude, send a Star Destroyer up against a defiant class, that thing wouldn't last 10 seconds, one quantam torpedo down the hatch, wipe out that bridge in a heartbeat. And as I understand it, in the star wars galaxy, shields are refferred to as "deflectors"...
 
molten_dragon said:
Despite being called turbo lasers, SW weapons are clearly not lasers. They are visible, and propagate slower than light. This clearly precludes them being lasers.

If you allow expanded universe sources for Star Wars (which some people do and others don't in this kind of debate) they explain that SW beam weapons are plasma/particle beam weapons, and not lasers.

Then again, that doesn't fit what we see in the movies either (none of the beams are affected by gravity).
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I must be a nerd...I'm actually interested in this discussion.

Speaking of the Turbo-Lasers being plasma/particle beam weapons, not actual lasers, it would seem to me that, since ST ships actually use plasma to transfer power around the ship (plasma conduits, anyone?), instead of wires or some such, it wouldn't be too hard to defend against plasma weaponry...

But who knows?
 
Jetboogieman said:
Dude, send a Star Destroyer up against a defiant class, that thing wouldn't last 10 seconds, one quantam torpedo down the hatch, wipe out that bridge in a heartbeat. And as I understand it, in the star wars galaxy, shields are refferred to as "deflectors"...
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If by 'that thing' you mean the defiant class, then you sir, are quite correct.

The yield of a quantum torpedo is around 130 megatons. The shields of an ISD can take something on the order of 10,000 megatons before collapsing.

It would take FAR more than an single quantum torpedo to destroy an ISD, assuming that the ISD's shields actually protected against it (which is impossible to know, since it's never explained how quantum torpedoes work).
 
molten_dragon said:
If by 'that thing' you mean the defiant class, then you sir, are quite correct.

The yield of a quantum torpedo is around 130 megatons. The shields of an ISD can take something on the order of 10,000 megatons before collapsing.

It would take FAR more than an single quantum torpedo to destroy an ISD, assuming that the ISD's shields actually protected against it (which is impossible to know, since it's never explained how quantum torpedoes work).
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Upon my own research. It appears that on paper, Star Wars is not only more advanced in terms of Weaponry, but shielding too.

According to the numbers, PURELY based on the numbers from the technical manuals... a X Wing in theory, could sit stationary and blow a hole through the hull of the Enterprise D in a single shot, penetrating their shields.

As far as it appears, visually it appears that Star Trek has the better technology, but in theory, according purely to the numbers... The empire would obliterate the Federation (not to mention the fact Starfleet does not have any credible army to speak of...
 
Jetboogieman said:
Upon my own research. It appears that on paper, Star Wars is not only more advanced in terms of Weaponry, but shielding too.

According to the numbers, PURELY based on the numbers from the technical manuals... a X Wing in theory, could sit stationary and blow a hole through the hull of the Enterprise D in a single shot, penetrating their shields.

As far as it appears, visually it appears that Star Trek has the better technology, but in theory, according purely to the numbers... The empire would obliterate the Federation (not to mention the fact Starfleet does not have any credible army to speak of...
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NERD Alert.
 
Jetboogieman said:
actually if you type it into Youtube, Star Trek Vs. Star Wars, this guy wrote an entire paper on what I just said in University and was reading it out.

I merely borrowed from his nerdom.
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Gay. I was going to award you major points for that nerdom for I am a huge nerd.
 
soccerboy22 said:
Gay. I was going to award you major points for that nerdom for I am a huge nerd.
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I am a huge nerd too. And the real fact is, you'd have to be a huge Nerd to understand what the hell he's talking about.

My nerdom is pretty strong, to the point where I absolutely had to have a Star Trek uniform for Halloween, ended up with an TOS Monty Scott uniform, it'll work lol.
 
Jetboogieman said:
I am a huge nerd too. And the real fact is, you'd have to be a huge Nerd to understand what the hell he's talking about.

My nerdom is pretty strong, to the point where I absolutely had to have a Star Trek uniform for Halloween, ended up with an TOS Monty Scott uniform, it'll work lol.
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I dressed up as Anakin when Episode I came out and then again when Episode III did on opening night. Had lightsaber duels with people. It was legit nerd fun.
 
Jetboogieman said:
According to the numbers, PURELY based on the numbers from the technical manuals... a X Wing in theory, could sit stationary and blow a hole through the hull of the Enterprise D in a single shot, penetrating their shields.

.
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That's nice but it doesn't jibe with what you see in the movies and shows.

Blasters inflict relatively small wounds. Reference Princess Leia getting shot in front of the shield generator bunker in Episode 6.

Phasers are capable not merely of disintegrating an entire person, but worse. A hand-phaser in TNG could blow a gaping hole in the hull on full power. Reference Picard talking to the Earth woman in the movie where the Borg go to Earth back in time, when Z Cochrane is preparing to test his warp drive.

A hit from Darth Vader's TIE fighter on Luke's X-wing did some damage and disabled (but did not destroy!) R2D2, in Episode 4 at the Death Star battle. IIRC you saw the blaster bolt actually hit R2D2, but he was repairable. This would argue for something whose destructive power is more comparable to a machine gun.

I think this guy's figures are off.
 
soccerboy22 said:
I dressed up as Anakin when Episode I came out and then again when Episode III did on opening night. Had lightsaber duels with people. It was legit nerd fun.
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Yeah dude, I mean what else are you gonna do.

I'm the guy who went in a Star Trek T Shirt and starfleet academy dog tags to the newest movie.

Also the dumbass to goes to the movie invictus in a Springboks Rugby Jersey.
 
Blackdog said:
I have to go with the Empire on this one due to numbers and resources.
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Yeah, but... when your ability to project force it limited to how long it takes for a Federation ship to show up and blast you to smithereens, neither of those things means much for long.
 
The Mark said:
I think the greater tech levels of the ST universe would give an edge to the Federation's forces.
If my memory of the SW movies is accurate, the shielding tech of the SW universe (and thus, the Empire) is far behind that of the Federation.
SW shields seemed simply designed to deflect incoming fire, but could be overwhelmed by repeated strikes.
On the other hand, ST shields seem to be multi-purpose and very adaptable, so tuning them to simply be unaffected by laser fire seems very possible.
I note that ST energy weapons were adjustable, while SW energy weapons were much less so, at least judging from the movies.
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What no one here (except DocAR) considers is that Fed ships fight at FTL speeds; SW ships fight at sub-light. There's no evidence that SW ships can even SEE ships moving FTL, much less shoot at them with sub-light weapons.

So, in a fight, the Fed ships scoot around the arena at 2c, and lob weapons into an enemy that cannot shoot back - the fed ships dont even need to power their shields...

Doesn't tale long to figure out how long that lasts.
 
molten_dragon said:
The empire wins by a landslide. They have a huge edge in numbers, and a huge edge in weapons technology. The federation doesn't stand a chance.

As a note, here's a link to a site that does a very in-depth comparison of the two universes' technology.

Star Wars vs Star Trek Essays: Star Wars vs Star Trek in Five Minutes
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Read this before, good for a laugh.
Fire control - its all about fire control. If you can't get a firing solution, the power of your weapons doesn't matter.
 
Goshin said:
Warp Drive would be the deciding factor. ST ships can fight while traveling at superluminal velocities, and hitting targets.
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This man GETS IT.
:clap:
 
molten_dragon said:
The problem with this tactic is that federation weapons aren't powerful enough to penetrate the shields of most imperial ships. It would be like shooting spitballs at a tank.
The empire would also have the edge in mobility, since hyperdrive is much faster than warp drive.
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There's nothing to on film support either of these statements.
 
Star Trek vs. Star Wars is, at its heart, a debate about science vs. spirituality. The center of the Star Wars universe is a mystical faith - the Jedi & Sith, worshipping alternate aspects of The Force - where the Star Trek universe, while not completely neglecting the emotional and spiritual, is about the triumph of reason and sentience. So I'll take my side and say the Federation would win because it could adapt, whereas the Galactic Empire is just a bunch of Nazis ruled by an evil wizard and a cyborg.
 
Troubadour said:
Star Trek vs. Star Wars is, at its heart, a debate about science vs. spirituality. The center of the Star Wars universe is a mystical faith - the Jedi & Sith, worshipping alternate aspects of The Force - where the Star Trek universe, while not completely neglecting the emotional and spiritual, is about the triumph of reason and sentience. So I'll take my side and say the Federation would win because it could adapt, whereas the Galactic Empire is just a bunch of Nazis ruled by an evil wizard and a cyborg.
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WHY? Why did you just Godwin a thread about Star Wars and Star Trek. Seriously...Buzz Killington.
 
Goobieman said:
This man GETS IT.
:clap:
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Thats irrelevant if Federation weapons can't breach Empire shields. And we have two conflicting sources, and nothing substantive beyond that. As such, we can only find a battle between these two groups as inconclusive.
 
soccerboy22 said:
WHY? Why did you just Godwin a thread about Star Wars and Star Trek.
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Godwin? Am I supposed to censor myself to avoid having some idiotic internet meme name-dropped on me? Read what I said and stop obsessing on trifles.

soccerboy22 said:
Seriously...Buzz Killington.
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Hey, my argument was total pwnage! The Federation would win because science is adaptive while religion and militarism are socially rigidifying.
 
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Troubadour said:
Godwin? Am I supposed to censor myself to avoid having some idiotic internet meme name-dropped on me? Read what I said and stop obsessing on trifles.



Hey, my argument was total pwnage! The Federation would win because science is adaptive while religion and militarism are socially rigidifying.
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Pretty sure Some Imperial officers said that to Lord Vader and you know what happened to them? The religion force choked their asses dead.
 
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