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When should the United States of America go to war?

When should the United States of America go to war?

  • Total voters
    72
spud_meister said:
do you think America would have the economy it has today if not for war?
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That's different than "war is necessary for the economy". Having a poweful military is key to protect strategic interests; it should have read, "a military industrial complex is necessary for our economy". Waging war as a means of "improving the economy" however is backwards.
 
The United States should only go to war with a Declaration of War. Only through Congress and with support of the American people.

No preemptive war.
No playing world police.
No nation building.
 
The Mark said:
As in, when an "opportunity" presents itself (however slight and flimsy, or great and imperative), what reasons/incidents do you consider necessary to justify the USA going to war, or even a "conflict/whatever".

Please choose your generalized poll option and post with your reasons for doing so.
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Whenever the President deems fit to deploy troops as his role as Commander-in-Chief, or whenever the House and then Senate deems fit to fund certain military actions, or whenever Congress deems fit to declare war as is their power as stated in the Constitution.
 
When it is justified in doing so.
 
Korimyr the Rat said:
Was he? We owe almost all of the power and wealth we've enjoyed for the past century to our involvement in the two World Wars. It's a shame that most of Europe has lost their taste for war and the Russians aren't an effective enemy any more. I'm not sad to see international communism in its death throes, but at least the Soviets could set us up with real wars on a regular basis.



The most basic benefit that warfare provides the species is that it causes surges in the birth rate and encourages exogamous breeding. And since most of the new fathers are soldiers, it encourages breeding among people who are fitter than the general population.
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I find it rather frightening you believe war is healthy and acceptable.
Actually, it goes to show you have a complete disregard for human life. That, or you are unaware of the horrors and the grief war creates. It's also rather disturbing your posts have been thanked.
 
Johnny said:
The United States should only go to war with a Declaration of War. Only through Congress and with support of the American people.
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Is Declaration of War defined in the USA Constitution? If not, where and how is it defined. I have heard the argument that, when the US Congress voted overwhelmingly to authorize using all necessary force against Iraq, that was a Declaration of War.

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TOJ said:
Is Declaration of War defined in the USA Constitution? If not, where and how is it defined. I have heard the argument that, when the US Congress voted overwhelmingly to authorize using all necessary force against Iraq, that was a Declaration of War.

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My understanding is that the vote on Iraq authorized the use of force but was not a declaration of war.
 
TOJ said:
Is Declaration of War defined in the USA Constitution? If not, where and how is it defined. I have heard the argument that, when the US Congress voted overwhelmingly to authorize using all necessary force against Iraq, that was a Declaration of War.

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It isn't a Declaration of War unless it is implicitly and formally declared as such.
 
Kroanon said:
It isn't a Declaration of War unless it is implicitly and formally declared as such.
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Do you have a source for that or is it just your opinion?

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reefedjib said:
My understanding is that the vote on Iraq authorized the use of force but was not a declaration of war.
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Your understanding? From what authoratative source?

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TOJ said:
Your understanding? From what authoratative source?

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Declaration of war by the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The War Powers Resolution

In 1973, following the withdrawal of most American troops from the Vietnam War, a debate emerged about the extent of presidential power in deploying troops without a declaration of war. A compromise in the debate was reached with the War Powers Resolution. This act clearly defined how many soldiers could be deployed by the President of the United States and for how long. It also required formal reports by the President to Congress regarding the status of such deployments, and limited the total amount of time that American forces could be employed without a formal declaration of war.

Although the constitutionality of the act has never been tested, it is usually followed, most notably during the Grenada Conflict, the Panamanian Conflict, the Somalia Conflict, the Gulf War, and the Iraq War. The only exception was President Clinton's use of U.S. troops in the 78-day NATO air campaign against Serbia during the Kosovo War.[citation needed] In all other cases, the President asserted the constitutional authority to commit troops without the necessity of Congressional approval, but in each case the President received Congressional authorization that satisfied the provisions of the War Powers Act.
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The posts above answered quite accurately.

We can also look to the founders for guidance.

Thomas Jefferson said "Commerce with all nations, alliances with none."

The notion that we can spread democracy through the barrel of a gun is asinine. It's our global occupation, placing of sanctions and embargos and overdoing our military aggressiveness that makes us more isolated and hated around the world. It weakens our defense.
 
Korimyr the Rat said:
Pretty much whenever the opportunity presents itself. At least every couple decades or so, whether we have an excuse or not. War is necessary for the economy and for maintaining the martial spirit of the nation, and is generally good for the species.
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James Madison said:
Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded, because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes; and armies, and debts, and taxes are the known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few. In war, too, the discretionary power of the Executive is extended; its influence in dealing out offices, honors, and emoluments is multiplied; and all the means of seducing the minds, are added to those of subduing the force, of the people. The same malignant aspect in republicanism may be traced in the inequality of fortunes, and the opportunities of fraud, growing out of a state of war, and in the degeneracy of manners and of morals engendered by both. No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.
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Korimyr,

The founders knew better. Constant war saps the economy, empowers the state, and degrades the ethics of the people. It's fundamentally incompatible with a free economy and society.
 
Explicitly* not implicitly xD
eusa_doh.gif
 
TOJ said:
Oh, Wikipedia.... well that settles it. They are certainly the highest authority to which some folks refer or recognize. :roll:

When I said authoritative source, I was referring to some official document, court decision, or law that defined Declaration of War. If there is none, how can you claim the USA Congress has to explicitly use the phrase in a resolution?

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As far as Wikipedia goes, it is a fine reference for undisputed facts, like a Declaration of War and the War Powers Act. It is a peer reviewed encyclopedia. Snarky comments here get you nowhere.

Next up, I never claimed the US has to use that phrase in a resolution.

The foregoing reference to the War Powers Act that you so brilliantly discarded defines how an authorization to use force meets the requirements of the Constitution (hint: look at article 1 section 8).

You want an authoritative source? Go find it your ****ing self. I'm not doing research for you.
 
reefedjib said:
As far as Wikipedia goes, it is a fine reference for undisputed facts, like a Declaration of War and the War Powers Act. It is a peer reviewed encyclopedia.
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If you say so. :rofl

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You want an authoritative source? Go find it your ****ing self. ....
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Oh my, Sweetie, you don't need to get all nasty.

From previous post:
reefedjib said:
My understanding is that the vote on Iraq authorized the use of force but was not a declaration of war.
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So you don't really have a valid source. It is just what you want to believe... Gotcha.

I asked a simple question and you made a definitive statement that didn't address the question and, turns out, for which you don't have a valid source. Why didn't you just say you don't really know what the hell you are talking about. ;)


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TOJ said:
If you say so. :rofl

Oh my, Sweetie, you don't need to get all nasty.

From previous post:
So you don't really have a valid source. It is just what you want to believe... Gotcha.

I asked a simple question and you made a definitive statement that didn't address the question and, turns out, for which you don't have a valid source. Why didn't you just say you don't really know what the hell you are talking about. ;)


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I have no idea why you busted in so argumentative when I said it was my opinion. It is tiresome. You are so ignored.
 
reefedjib said:
I have no idea why you busted in so argumentative when I said it was my opinion. It is tiresome. You are so ignored.
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Actually, you said it was your understanding. I simply asked on what that understanding was based. And, Sweetie, you are the one that got nasty.

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earthworm said:
Who was it now, several hundred years ago, advised that the still young USA stay clear of European conflicts..
Thomas Jefferson?
How little he knew, but he was basically right.
I think that this whole Islamic extremest thing has to be fought politically, not militarily..
Our last 3 to 5 responses were not right.
We have a UN , lets use it for its intended purpose..
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I would tend to agree with you, except for the UN a corrupt and inept organization currently being run by dictators.
 
Redress said:
Christians attacked us before 9/11 in Oklahoma...
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pbrauer said:
...Iraq was NOT a threat to anyone..
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Christians have never attacked us. Muslims have committed more than 15,500 deadly terror attacks around the world SINCE 911. We should take out Iran's nuke facilities before it gets REALLY ugly. Saddam Hussein threatened to take us off the map with his wmd. We took him seriously.
 
chickie said:
I think we need to take out Iran's nuke facilities. They have already said they will wipe the USA and Israel off the map. I support pre-emptive or helping Israel hit it.
I disagree war is bad for the econ. We had TWO wars under W and the econ was amazing until liberals took over CONgress in 07.
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You are a very wise chickie!!

That's the least we can do for Israel!! After all they have fought shoulder to shoulder with the US in every military conflict since their inception in '48. Google "Israeli Heros Of the Korean, Viet Nam, Iraq, and Afghanistan Wars.... They are our greatest ally. GWs wars were a blessing to us all. Let's hope that Obama does as he is told and keeps them going forever. Both Israel and the US are dependent on war since they are two of the worlds leading manufacturers of war implements. We should never allow any competition in this area. Remember, every time a cruise missle is fired into a nation of muslim extremists, or some ordinance fired into a toyota truck full of Palistinians MONEY is being made by someone here at home and also in our beloved friends land of Israel. That is good bussiness.
 
Other question is HOW. do we really need to OCCUPY these countries? IMO, a cruise missle or 2 each week, slowly but surely taking out their ability to defend themselves, should be enough. I say we start with the Saudi palaces....
 
TOJ said:
Actually, you said it was your understanding. I simply asked on what that understanding was based. And, Sweetie, you are the one that got nasty.

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And you are the one who is irrelevant regarding this discussion.
 
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