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Which tax system is most 'fair'

Which tax system is most 'fair'?

  • Progressive Tax

    Votes: 28 46.7%

  • Regressive Tax

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Flat Percentage Tax Rate

    Votes: 14 23.3%

  • Flat Dollar Tax

    Votes: 4 6.7%

  • Other

    Votes: 14 23.3%
  • Total voters
    60
TurtleDude said:
Laugh all you want, You are the one who is upset you are not wealthy and whining at those who are.
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Your smrt.. you must be rich.

EDIT:be my friend.
 
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cpwill said:
:) the vast majority of millionaires are first-generation. small business owners and the like.
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Gabriel thinks they swindled people to get that way. But you are right-I think there was a book called "the millionaire next door" that lays that all out.
 
Gabriel said:
Well lets just eliminate taxation all together since we can't come up with a fair one for all the living.
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That's just plain stupid. LEts get rid of a tax system that lets the non payers vote up the taxes of the payers
 
Gabriel said:
Well lets just eliminate taxation all together since we can't come up with a fair one for all the living.
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I never said that we need to eliminate taxes. In fact, I gave the perfectly fair tax system that is in the Constitution of the United States in post 134. I don't see you sending off your entire check to the government for redistribution.
 
TurtleDude said:
That's just plain stupid. LEts get rid of a tax system that lets the non payers vote up the taxes of the payers
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Go home you commie.. We don't need your totalitarian communist extortion taxes. Go back to russia!
 
Gabriel said:
Your smrt.. you must be rich.

EDIT:be my friend.
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There is a rather strong correlation between intelligence and education and income. US today did a study of that in about 2004 that noted that education and intelligence is becoming more and more important in becoming wealthy than at any time in American history. furthermore, high paying low education factory jobs are disappearing and one of the reason why there is a bigger gap between the well off and the working poor is because the working poor usually did not make proper choices or their parents didn't make proper choices leaving them undereducated in a society where education is more and more a requirement.
 
The_Patriot said:
I never said that we need to eliminate taxes. In fact, I gave the perfectly fair tax system that is in the Constitution of the United States in post 134. I don't see you sending off your entire check to the government for redistribution.
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Progressive taxation is the only "fair" tax because of the axiom of needs being cost into the equation.
 
The_Patriot said:
I never said that we need to eliminate taxes. In fact, I gave the perfectly fair tax system that is in the Constitution of the United States in post 134. I don't see you sending off your entire check to the government for redistribution.
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Of course you didn't say that. Its SOP with him
 
Gabriel said:
Progressive taxation is the only "fair" tax because of the axiom of needs being cost into the equation.
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wrong again-your needs should not affect my tax bill. I don't pay more for a car because of your needs-I should not pay more for government services. and as I noted before, we net tax payers would have never agreed to a government where we are forced to pay for people like you.
 
TurtleDude said:
There is a rather strong correlation between intelligence and education and income. US today did a study of that in about 2004 that noted that education and intelligence is becoming more and more important in becoming wealthy than at any time in American history. furthermore, high paying low education factory jobs are disappearing and one of the reason why there is a bigger gap between the well off and the working poor is because the working poor usually did not make proper choices or their parents didn't make proper choices leaving them undereducated in a society where education is more and more a requirement.
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You used the word intellegent.. educated snob. Go away no one wants educated people talking about government. We don't need your totalitarian government it's already been tryed and no one likes it.. go back to russia you commie!
 
TurtleDude said:
That's just plain stupid. LEts get rid of a tax system that lets the non payers vote up the taxes of the payers
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I should start a thread to talk about the merits of the republican voting system versus the democratic one... I'll edit this post with the link to the right forum....

*runs off to start a new thread*

EDIT: Link to the new thread.
 
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TurtleDude said:
wrong again-your needs should not affect my tax bill. I don't pay more for a car because of your needs-I should not pay more for government services. and as I noted before, we net tax payers would have never agreed to a government where we are forced to pay for people like you.
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Welfare bum.. the rich should pay their fair share and not dump it on the poor.
 
Gabriel said:
Progressive taxation is the only "fair" tax because of the axiom of needs being cost into the equation.
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Nope, it's not and is wholly unAmerican since the country was founded upon the principles of fair taxation.
 
Gabriel said:
You used the word intellegent.. educated snob. Go away no one wants educated people talking about government. We don't need your totalitarian government it's already been tryed and no one likes it.. go back to russia you commie!
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one of the most interesting concessions of "I have lost this argument" I have ever seen
 
The_Patriot said:
Nope, it's not and is wholly unAmerican since the country was founded upon the principles of fair taxation.
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uhh I am not going to endlessly argue the same points over and over but if you insist what you need to do is debunk my argument entirely.

Well I think what you have to consider matters of fairness in a particular way to see no taxation as the most fair.

No taxation would result in no government and anarchy outright. It would be a disaster.

The second fairest tax according to you based on flat taxation where everyone pays the same tax does not consider that finances in terms of having dollars to spend has a bottom. A flat tax hits the lowest income bracket far more then the upper income bracket. So according to this logic if you have less money then someone with far more wealth to pay for needs/wants, it is somehow fair for you to have less money available for needs. Because you do have less money for needs it creates smaller pool of wealth available for wants. The person with less money has to spend a larger percent of his money on needs then the person with more money. When a person works for money equivalent to the poverty line or less they spend a greater portion of their money on needs under a flat tax system. A flat tax disproportionately punishes low income.

A progressive taxation does tax people with more total available money to spend then the people with less money to spend. However one only has to consider the means by which they attain that larger portion of wealth to reason they should indeed pay more. Many wealthy employ people who work for less then the poverty line.. so it is clear that the wealthy have created more wealth from people who are under huge income pressure in more of a parasitic manner then a symbiotic way the wealthy make wealth from the less fortunate. Many wealthy people don't do anything but invest their capital while the working poor are busy making them the money they live a privileged life from.

A progressive tax makes it possible for the wealthy to re-contribute to society via public services that their less fortunate social counterparts should indeed benefit from. A progressive taxation is the most fair considering the costs of needs on the lowest income bracket. More importantly from an economic sense in a consumer economy it makes sense for the wealthy to want consumers to have money to spend.

I personally think libertarians need to re-evaluate their idea of what fair is.
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TurtleDude said:
one of the most interesting concessions of "I have lost this argument" I have ever seen
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You said concessions.. go away and stop using smrt words rich turtle.
 
The_Patriot said:
Nope, it's not and is wholly unAmerican since the country was founded upon the principles of fair taxation.
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socialists, parasites, wealth haters, dependency addicts etc hate the fact that others do better than they do. They also hate the founders and the constitution (as it is really written) because the founders were mostly the cream of the crop of colonial society-proud accomplished men who made it to the top and wanted to create a society where men like them would always be on the top. To think they wanted a society where the untalented, the unambitious and the un educated would be able to confiscate their wealth is inconceivable
 
cpwill said:
:) I will be.


EDIT: buy me something today and invest in a friendship with me :D
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Oh.. me stupd I have no peoples to tlk to. How much an hour?
 
Gabriel said:
You said concessions.. go away and stop using smrt words rich turtle.
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you have not earned the ability to tell me-or anyone else to leave. are you too poor to afford an A?
 
TurtleDude said:
socialists parasites
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OMG your a socialist parisite. Go back to russia you commie welfare bum. No one likes socialist parisites.. its already been done and none likes it..
 
Gabriel said:
OMG your a socialist parisite. Go back to russia you commie welfare bum. No one likes socialist parisites.. its already been done and none likes it..
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You're not your. fail
 
TurtleDude said:
You're not your. fail
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Your a smrt person you must have money.

EDIT: Uhh, I can't even call you smrt anymore and not whip myself for pretending.
 
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Gabriel said:
uhh I am not going to endlessly argue the same points over and over but if you insist what you need to do is debunk my argument entirely.
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I already did debunk your argument with the words of the founding fathers in the Constitution of the United States. Their idea of a fair tax was done by the number of people living in each state and every person had to pay the exact same amount.

For example, Congress passes a measure to raise money to pay for the Army and Navy that is 50 million dollars. There are one million people living in each of the fifty states, so every person's tax liability came to exactly $1. This is why there is a census every ten years.

Taxes upon goods produced in any of the states in the Union is prohibited on the federal and state level when they are exported/imported into another state in the Union. Goods exported outside of the Union to foreign countries are subject to taxation as long as such taxation is spread across all goods exported. Goods imported into the Union from foreign countries are subject to taxation since the founding fathers' thinking was to foster the entrepreneurial spirit at home and to prevent dependence upon a foreign nation.
 
The_Patriot said:
I already did debunk your argument with the words of the founding fathers in the Constitution of the United States. Their idea of a fair tax was done by the number of people living in each state and every person had to pay the exact same amount.

For example, Congress passes a measure to raise money to pay for the Army and Navy that is 50 million dollars. There are one million people living in each of the fifty states, so every person's tax liability came to exactly $1. This is why there is a census every ten years.

Taxes upon goods produced in any of the states in the Union is prohibited on the federal and state level when they are exported/imported into another state in the Union. Goods exported outside of the Union to foreign countries are subject to taxation as long as such taxation is spread across all goods exported. Goods imported into the Union from foreign countries are subject to taxation since the founding fathers' thinking was to foster the entrepreneurial spirit at home and to prevent dependence upon a foreign nation.
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I don't think that the constitutional architects has the L curve in mind when they wrote that. It would be interesting to see that they say unambiguously where poor should pay the same taxes as the ultra rich.

 
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