fredmertz
Active member
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2010
- Messages
- 358
- Reaction score
- 115
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Libertarian
Yes. I am sure you are a moral person. However, you are missing the point. I have pointed out an aspect of human nature and explained why it is important. If you really look around, you will see that its importance is self evident as it has a very real and strong power to shape our society. You may disagree whether this aspect of human nature is a good thing, but barring some genetic change, its not going to go away. Ultimately, people are not solely self-maximizers because if they were, we would not even have this conversation because it would be obvious to both of us. We do not discuss the proper number of arms and legs for example.
You can and should state your case why you think one value system is better than another, but you are doing yourself a disservice in pretending that people are something that they are not. The majority would be uncomfortable in a strictly justice based system (with no mercy or empathy) and they have a legitimate reason for feeling that way due the fact it is in their very make-up.
I cannot 'state my case' any better than you can. We both see the same evidence. And we have used the evidence to support our claims. morals do have a very real and strong power to shape our society. I am not arguing that. It is in human nature to understand morals and want to be a moral person. I understand that. They question I answer differently is WHY? I believe it reduces to self maximization. You believe it is what it is and is no more complicated than that. Regardless, the end result is nearly the same - people will be moral - will do good deeds - will help their neighbor.
In fact, I think the fact that they help others to help themselves is a huge factor as to how good a person is - moreso than if it was just their nature - because they are CHOOSING to do so. If helping someone else makes you feel that good about yourself (or if not helping them would make you feel that bad about yourself) that you help them with no other reward than the good feeling or lack of bad feeling, then I'd say you have a huge concern with supporting your moral integrity and you are an awesome person. If it's simply what you do because it's in your nature, you're good person sure, but you had no choice but to be a good person. My conclusion would say that you have a strong conscience and I'd like you. So no - I'm not doing myself a disservice. And I'm not 'pretending'. I'm sharing my belief. You're allowed to disagree and I welcome that. But please don't accuse me of pretending. That's just insulting.
The last point I would like to make is a point that I have made before: This game is for $100. The two key parts to that point is 1) it is a game in which I am just trying to max out with no cost to myself. 2) It is $100. It is not a life changing amount. If it were $10myn, then I would absolutely split the money in some way. probably a 50/50. Though again, I think I could get away with more, but I would want to do that person a favor. Because my life would change w/ $5myn and I would be very happy to be able to help someone else change their life with $5myn at no cost to me. But $50 certainly won't change their life. If it were a different game, I would have a different answer. My answer is based on $100 and it's hard to believe people would be so emotional over $100. And my life wouldn't change knowing I could have had $50 but blew it going for $100. If person B rejected my 100/0 offer, I would be confused because it simply doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me. I would think that they wouldn't expect anything other than a 100/0. Again, this is my opinion based on my belief system - not pretending and I think it is more pure for the reasons I stated above. I like that we can disagree and I hope we can get back to that being ok with you.