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What should happen to this little girl?

What should happen to this child and her mom?

  • If they are illegal, deport them both immediately!

    Votes: 15 51.7%
  • If they are illegal, deport her mom, but she can stay.

    Votes: 4 13.8%
  • They both can stay.

    Votes: 7 24.1%
  • Other (explain)

    Votes: 3 10.3%

  • Total voters
    29
So most of this this statement is a lie.

Straw man. Your original statement was "by your logic we shouldn't throw someone into prison for a crime if they have a child", which is totally unrepresentative of my position. I certainly do believe that we should throw people into prison if they have a child if they are guilty of crimes such as murder, molestation, etc. In this case, however, I do not.

In the future, you'd do much better avoiding such arguments - provided it is an actual debate you are seeking. I certainly enjoy hearing arguments from the other side, so what say we avoid such off-base generalizations in the future for the sake of a more honest exchange? Thanks.
 
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Straw man. Your original statement was "by your logic we shouldn't throw someone into prison for a crime if they have a child", which is totally unrepresentative of my position. I certainly do believe that we should throw people into prison if they have a child if they are guilty of crimes such as murder, molestation, etc. In this case, however, I do not.

So the law should not be applied equally? I know allot of people deported would love to know the US government is playing favorites.

In the future, you'd do much better avoiding such arguments - provided it is an actual debate you are seeking. I certainly enjoy hearing arguments from the other side, so what say we avoid such off-base generalizations in the future for the sake of a more honest debate? Thanks.

I don't think it was a straw man at all. To many people when it comes to law are to quick to make exceptions depending on cuteness etc.

Either the law should apply to everyone, or no one at all. This is the only way our system can work for the people, all of the people.
 
So the law should not be applied equally? I know allot of people deported would love to know the US government is playing favorites.

I never said that the law should be applied unequally. What I said was that I disagree with the law, therefore, I disagree with deporting the child and her mother. If you think that they both should be deported, great! That's why I started this poll, to see who agrees/disagrees with my position, and what reasons they give.


I don't think it was a straw man at all. To many people when it comes to law are to quick to make exceptions depending on cuteness etc.

Either the law should apply to everyone, or no one at all. This is the only way our system can work for the people, all of the people.

His argument was a straw man because it misrepresented my position. I am against deportation/imprisonment in this case, which was superficially turned into an argument that I am against imprisoning ALL mothers with children who break the law.
 
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Deport the mother, give the kid to social services. Might make people think twice about their anchor babies
 
I think that she should be investigate for illegal immigration, and if she is an illegal immigrant, she should be made to go through the immigration process and if she's acceptable she and her child should be able to stay. A judge should then make the mother do community service. If her mother fails the immigration process, deport them both.
What about those who have applied legally and have been waiting for years to be accepted. Why does this individual get special status amongst those who do it the right way.
 
Believe the issue has already been addressed and concluded. The government will not be pursuing.


Will try to find a link......



.
Figures, what would happen to a some one who is a U.S. citizen if they decided to violate the law. What makes illegals above the law and not a U.S. citizen.
 
I can agree with this.



Yeah... I doubt that's what was intended when the laws were written.



Humans are not objects, and using this pair as a "lesson" will change nothing. If anything, Hispanics will trust and respect our government that much less. They will continue to live in hiding.
So ignoring the laws of this country is O.K., that would be fine if we all could violate the law.
 
I never said that the law should be applied unequally. What I said was that I disagree with the law, therefore, I disagree with deporting the child and her mother.

What law are you disagreeing with? She is an illegal alien. Do you mean the child should stay and the mother should be deported? Or are you saying the mother should not because the child was born here?

I don't understand what law you are talking about specifically.

If you think that they both should be deported, great! That's why I started this poll, to see who agrees/disagrees with my position, and what reasons they give.

Get no argument from me on that.

His argument was a straw man because it misrepresented my position. I am against deportation/imprisonment in this case, which was superficially turned into an argument that I am against imprisoning ALL mothers with children who break the law.

You say the law should be enforced equally, but you disagree so that makes it OK for this one person to be above the law in this case?

You are not making any sense. :confused:
 
So ignoring the laws of this country is O.K., that would be fine if we all could violate the law.

Could it be a cutlture thing perhaps?

I mean, I have been to Mexico many times. South, West, Central and too many border towns to count.

Everybody knows the deal. The law is subjective in Mexico. What we call destable bribery, they call business as usual. (Even worse than Chicago.)

I understand that when I visit. I know that a five dollar bill gets me to the front of the line. I have seen the resort guests get shook down by the policia. It's just the way it is. It's understood.

You would have to erase generations of conditioning before expecting any culture to morph into our culture, living and breathing our values.

That's the most confusing thing. One would think that the biggest proponent of immigration control on our southern borders would be legal resident's of hispanic decent. For, if they liked the lack of rule by law and lowly wages, they would have stayed in Mexico to begin with.

I love Mexico. And I think the mexican people, as a whole, are some of the finest people on this planet. I can't say enough good things about them. But they will HAVE to understand, eventually, that this ain't Mexico. Trying to make it Mexico will be done at their own peril.

Everyone needs to take a step back and breathe. Logic and the dictates of reason mandate that there is no possible way we can round up kick out all the illegal's. Even if we could it would add terrible side affects on our economy that we could not stand right now.

They need to open local, regional, registration offices in selected areas and give the illegals a chance to turn themselves in, pay a fine through payroll garnishment, just like a tax, then register them. Then put the harshest of harsh penalties on any US citizen employing illegals.

After a year has past, close the regional offices and open streamlined operations for registrations at the border. Give them a chance to NOT be illegal. They're gonna come anyways. Might as well at least TRY to get SOME control of it. Just make it simpler to legally register yet harsher to be here illegally.

After a year of catering to the illegals with offers of affordable fines and convenient local registration, those that do not comply should not only be thereafter deported, but sent to hard labor camps for at least 18 months before being sent back home to their country of orgin.

This plan should be agreeable by most folks. Us gringos REALLY don't hate these Mexicans. But we are pissed at their lack of respect for our laws. I think my plan is an honest and achievable plan that would draw support from both sides of the issue. The only people I think would oppose it are the ones that want to just totally open the borders and go La Raza on our ass.

Those folks better thing twice.

Just my 2 cents.
 
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What law are you disagreeing with? She is an illegal alien. Do you mean the child should stay and the mother should be deported? Or are you saying the mother should not because the child was born here?

I don't understand what law you are talking about specifically.

Ahh, sorry, Blackdog. The 'law' I was referring to was the Arizona law - I should have been more specific.


You say the law should be enforced equally, but you disagree so that makes it OK for this one person to be above the law in this case?

You are not making any sense. :confused:

I'm making perfect sense. I never said this woman who is here illegally is above the law. What I said was that I disagree with deporting her. The argument can certainly be made that she is here illegally, and thus should be deported; however, I disagree with deportation. I would love to see immigration reform, and citizenship be made easier for those individuals who want to become citizens. Maybe something along the lines of turning herself in, paying a fine or doing community service, then beginning the process of becoming a citizen. I totally understand if you are against my position - most conservatives are, and I respect that. Basically, I wanted to hear all viewpoints, hence the reason I made this poll to begin with.
 
Could it be a cutlture thing perhaps?

I mean, I have been to Mexico many times. South, West, Central and too many border towns to count.

Everybody knows the deal. The law is subjective in Mexico. What we call destable bribery, they call business as usual. (Even worse than Chicago.)

I understand that when I visit. I know that a five dollar bill gets me to the front of the line. I have seen the resort guests get shook down by the policia. It's just the way it is. It's understood.

You would have to erase generations of conditioning before expecting any culture to morph into our culture, living and breathing our values.

That's the most confusing thing. One would think that the biggest proponent of immigration control on our southern borders would be legal resident's of hispanic decent. For, if they liked the lack of rule by law and lowly wages, they would have stayed in Mexico to begin with.

I love Mexico. And I think the mexican people, as a whole, are some of the finest people on this planet. I can't say enough good things about them. But they will HAVE to understand, eventually, that this ain't Mexico. Trying to make it Mexico will be done at their own peril.

Everyone needs to take a step back and breathe. Logic and the dictates of reason mandate that there is no possible way we can round up kick out all the illegal's. Even if we could it would add terrible side affects on our economy that we could not stand right now.

They need to open local, regional, registration offices in selected areas and give the illegals a chance to turn themselves in, pay a fine through payroll garnishment, just like a tax, then register them. Then put the harshest of harsh penalties on any US citizen employing illegals.

After a year has past, close the regional offices and open streamlined operations for registrations at the border. Give them a chance to NOT be illegal. They're gonna come anyways. Might as well at least TRY to get SOME control of it. Just make it simpler to legally register yet harsher to be here illegally.

After a year of catering to the illegals with offers of affordable fines and convenient local registration, those that do not comply should not only be thereafter deported, but sent to hard labor camps for at least 18 months before being sent back home to their country of orgin.

This plan should be agreeable by most folks. Us gringos REALLY don't hate these Mexicans. But we are pissed at their lack of respect for our laws. I think my plan is an honest and achievable plan that would draw support from both sides of the issue. The only people I think would oppose it are the ones that want to just totally open the borders and go La Raza on our ass.

Those folks better thing twice.

Just my 2 cents.
Originally being from Texas, I couldn't agree with you more. I posted in the hopes that people would see how upside down this is and where it will lead us. BTW well said...
 
Ahh, sorry, Blackdog. The 'law' I was referring to was the Arizona law - I should have been more specific.




I'm making perfect sense. I never said this woman who is here illegally is above the law. What I said was that I disagree with deporting her. The argument can certainly be made that she is here illegally, and thus should be deported; however, I disagree with deportation. Maybe something along the lines of turning herself in, paying a fine or doing community service, then beginning the process of becoming a citizen. I totally understand if you are against my position - most conservatives are, and I respect that. Basically, I wanted to hear all viewpoints, hence the reason I made this poll to begin with.
I believe this is what we conservatives would like to see as well, as a conservative I do know that immigrants is what made this country great. Making it easy to circumvent our laws and then being above the law, gives illegals no initiative to assimilate into our society. This also brings up another argument, what about those we have over looked and denied citizenship not to mention deported, those people from other countries. Then also what about those who have been waiting for years to become a citizen, what right do illegals from our southern borders have that affords them the ability to jump in front of the line. All these questions I believe must be addressed before any amnesty or reform is even considered.
 
Originally being from Texas, I couldn't agree with you more. I posted in the hopes that people would see how upside down this is and where it will lead us. BTW well said...

If you ever spent any time down in the valley you would agree with me regarding what a good bunch of people mexican-americans are.

Native Texan here. :2wave:
 
Ahh, sorry, Blackdog. The 'law' I was referring to was the Arizona law - I should have been more specific.

OK.

I'm making perfect sense. I never said this woman who is here illegally is above the law. What I said was that I disagree with deporting her. The argument can certainly be made that she is here illegally, and thus should be deported; however, I disagree with deportation. I would love to see immigration reform, and citizenship be made easier for those individuals who want to become citizens. Maybe something along the lines of turning herself in, paying a fine or doing community service, then beginning the process of becoming a citizen. I totally understand if you are against my position - most conservatives are, and I respect that. Basically, I wanted to hear all viewpoints, hence the reason I made this poll to begin with.

Ahhhhh! OK, again I see..

You are correct I do not agree, but that is subjective in this case.

Carry on and thanks for clarifying it for me.
 
If you ever spent any time down in the valley you would agree with me regarding what a good bunch of people mexican-americans are.

Native Texan here. :2wave:

Oh yeah, you are right about that!

Most of them have lived there for generations. Is Freddie Fender still around?:)
 
They both should be deported if they are here illegally. I think it is absolutely insane to allow children born in the United States illegeally to become citizens, as this isn't fair to parents who, after being deported, would be seperated from their children.

They're not separated from their children, the children can go back to wherever the parents are going until they turn 18, at which time they can come back. Just because you're an American citizen doesn't mean you have to actually live in the U.S.

Besides, why are we having any sympathy for these lawbreakers who put themselves into these situations willingly? If they didn't want to be separated from their children, why did they run across a border illegally to have their kids on the other side?
 
In your opinion, what do you think should happen to this little girl and her family now that she inadvertently blew the whistle on them?

Line them up, have the little girl shoot them herself.

Heheh...not really.

It's really hard to say, I mean we start talking about taking these hard lines with illegal immigration and we're gonna run into a lot of this. Do we deport the whole lot back? Do we have some form of reasonable and intelligent manner by which we can best preserve the family? To be honest, I think most of the illegal immigration crap is overblown propaganda to deflect away from the bigger things the government is doing. And in that light, I'd favor methods which work with the individuals to help them in their specific conditions to maintain and preserve some semblance of family and focus on integration into the society.
 
Mrs. Obama handled the question improperly. She had an opportunity to explain to children the importance of the rule of law, instead she told a group of impressionable children that the government would try to make it OK.

If the mother is illegal and the child is a citizen, the mother has a choice. As a parent she has every right to take her child with her when she is deported, or she has the right to leave her child in the care of a citizen willing to take on the responsibility.
 
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