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Where did the Universe come from?

Where did the Universe come from?

  • From the Big Bang, not sure what was before. God does not exist and was not involved.

    Votes: 33 40.2%

  • Not the Big Bang, but some other physical event. God does not exist and was not involved.

    Votes: 2 2.4%

  • God created the Universe without a Big Bang. Earth was especially created.

    Votes: 2 2.4%

  • God created the Universe with a Big Bang and then the universe evolved.

    Votes: 29 35.4%

  • Some other mechanism created the Universe, without God...

    Votes: 7 8.5%

  • God created the Universe in some other fashion...

    Votes: 9 11.0%
  • Total voters
    82
rivrrat said:
But then where did 'god' come from? It had to come from somewhere, right? So where did it come from?

You have an infinite loop going here with that kind of logic.
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No, God did not have to come from somewhere as God is everlasting.
 
Redress said:
We have I think at least 2 people who post regularly who have degrees in physics, at least one of whom works in the field. I am waiting for one of them to find this thread and make us all look ignorant. Should be fun when they do, a good chance to learn.
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My undergrad was in Physics but it has been 18 years...
 
American said:
I don't understand what you're saying here.
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What he is saying is that what we experience as matter is really energy in a certain state.

You can sort of say its like water and ice. When it is ice, it is solid whereas if it was water, it flows and can affect things.

Not a great analogy, but the best I can think of.

But if you look at things like radioactive decay, you can see it. An atom lets off some energy and it loses some of its structure and either changes into another element or into an isotope of the same element.

Another way of looking at it would be the interaction of matter and antimatter. It pretty much all turns into energy.

I guess you could say it would be like ice melting. There is less ice (or in the atom's case protons or neutrons) after water drips off.

But yeah, a real physicists would be better at this (as Redress states). I only know what I do from the college library and from reading for pleasure. So my understanding may be inaccurate.

Its fun to act like I know something though :)
 
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Well we're also kind of getting off topic, but it's somewhat interesting.
 
All current data points towards a Big Bang. Whether or not there was a god involved is something science will not be able to say. It's all personal opinion at that point.
 
reefedjib said:
Several interesting discussions have led me to do a poll, asking this important question. After voting, leave a comment on how you voted and what led you to think this way.
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Right now I subscribe to the expansion event (big-bang), after which the universe follows various laws and evolves accordingly. I personally believe everything was designed to operate the way it does, but as I know of no empirical evidence supporting the existence of a Creator I would caution anyone against mixing science with God here.
 
Jerry said:
Right now I subscribe to the expansion event (big-bang), after which the universe follows various laws and evolves accordingly. I personally believe everything was designed to operate the way it does, but as I know of no empirical evidence supporting the existence of a Creator I would caution anyone against mixing science with God here.
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God is a scientist, among every other profession.
 
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reefedjib said:
God is a scientist, among every other profession.
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Off topic, but I wonder if it is possible to be a scientist if you already know anything.
 
reefedjib said:
God is a scientist, among every other profession.
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Well then maybe He could be so kind as to publish some research is a peer-reviewed journal once in a while ;)
 
According to some Hindus, maya, the grand illusion of life, is layered like an onion. At the outermost is matter, then comes energy, followed by mind (this is NOT like our individual minds, but the world of thought), then spirit, then God. There are forms in the worlds of matter (bodies), energy (forces), mind (thoughts), and spirit (souls and other spiritual creatures). There are no forms in the world of God. God has no form. The act of creation started in the realm of God, where he formed a Word (the First Form) that created the worlds of spirit, then mind, then energy, then matter. The world of spirit emanates from God. The world of mind emanates from the world of spirit. The world of energy emanates from the world of mind. The world of matter emanates from the world of energy.

What we are postulating as the Big Bang is really the emanation (creation) of the world of energy from the world of mind. Prior to this there were emanations of the spirit world and the mental world. Note that the creation of matter from energy, reflects the emanation of matter from the world of energy. You cannot create the world of energy without emanation from the world of mind and that is called the Big Bang.
 
Jerry said:
Well then maybe He could be so kind as to publish some research is a peer-reviewed journal once in a while ;)
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I believe he published in the following publications:
  • Vedas
  • Upanishads
  • Torah
  • New Testament
  • Quran

Unfortunately, most of it is regarding human behavior and not cosmological metaphysics.
 
God created the universe, the big bang theory is flawed. I don't know how God did it, but I'm sure it wasn't through the big bang. Option #3 for me.
 
digsbe said:
God created the universe, the big bang theory is flawed. I don't know how God did it, but I'm sure it wasn't through the big bang. Option #3 for me.
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I wouldn't say it is a complete explanation for the creation of the universe, but there is a lot of evidence that backs it up, so it is hard to totally dismiss it.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/astronomy/bigbang.html#evidence

My biggest problem with the big bang is that it leaves a lot of loose ends, but the universe is a big and complex thing, so that's not to be unexpected.
 
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digsbe said:
God created the universe, the big bang theory is flawed. I don't know how God did it, but I'm sure it wasn't through the big bang. Option #3 for me.
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Flawed how specifically?
 
reefedjib said:
I believe he published in the following publications:
  • Vedas
  • Upanishads
  • Torah
  • New Testament
  • Quran

Unfortunately, most of it is regarding human behavior and not cosmological metaphysics.
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Those aren't scientific journals and they weren't written by God.
 
Jerry said:
Those aren't scientific journals and they weren't written by God.
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Your user pane mentions clinging to bibles yet you dismiss the old and new testament?
 
megaprogman said:
Your user pane mentions clinging to bibles yet you dismiss the old and new testament?
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:prof OT =/= scientific journal.

Instead of simply stating that God stopped the Earth for a day, a journal would have gon into much detail of God applying an exaggerated torque induced gyroscopic precession.

  • How was the torque applied?
  • How much torque was applied?
  • What was the exact circumference of the precession?
  • How was the precession terminated?
  • Include a Climate Impact Statement.

Instead all we got was "the sun stood still"...well no it didn't, that's just what it looked like to a lay man on the ground. That's not a technical explanation of the physics and methods involved.
 
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Jerry said:
:prof OT =/= scientific journal.

Instead of simply stating that God stopped the Earth for a day, a journal would have gon into much detail of God applying an exaggerated torque induced gyroscopic precession.

Instead all we got was "the sun stood still"...well no it didn't, that's just what it looked like to a lay man on the ground. That's not a technical explanation of the physics and methods involved.
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The scribes would have been pissed to have had to copy all that down in addition to the existing bible!
 
reefedjib said:
The scribes would have been pissed to have had to copy all that down in addition to the existing bible!
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Yeah well that's what they were being paid with slaves for so to bad for them.
 
The evidence points toward the big bang.

What caused the big bang or why it came about is unknown. AFAIK, any talk about what came "before" or "caused" the big bang is nonsense because before the planck time our understanding of physics breaks down.

Perhaps its the christian god, perhaps its the hindu gods, perhaps its a ham sandwich. We just don't know.

My answer is "I don't know". That is the best answer until more evidence or some other means of confirming a proposed theory is in (this includes the theory that god created the universe).

"I don't know" is a valid answer. One doesn't have to reject the possibility of God or accept that God created the universe. One can simply not know. I believe that is the ONLY valid position to take barring personal claims of supernatural revelation or guidance, a conundrum all its own.
 
Jerry said:
:prof OT =/= scientific journal.

Instead of simply stating that God stopped the Earth for a day, a journal would have gon into much detail of God applying an exaggerated torque induced gyroscopic precession.

  • How was the torque applied?
  • How much torque was applied?
  • What was the exact circumference of the precession?
  • How was the precession terminated?
  • Include a Climate Impact Statement.

Instead all we got was "the sun stood still"...well no it didn't, that's just what it looked like to a lay man on the ground. That's not a technical explanation of the physics and methods involved.
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I was referring to the written by God part. Not the science part.
 
My answer is that the universe was never created. That is a linear concept because we live a linear existence.
 
Damn if anyone knows the answer to that one. By definition, in fact, it couldn't have come from anywhere, since the origin of the originator would then become the de-facto origin, and the question merely moves back to "what was the origin of the origin's origin"?

Since there's no evidence of any God or other supertition based entity, it's pointless to say "God".
 
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