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French law could see fines for burqas

Burqa ban+fine, example to follow or shy

  • This law should be completely implemented in the West

    Votes: 6 15.4%

  • This law is a must in general

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • This law is good

    Votes: 3 7.7%

  • The law is not good

    Votes: 24 61.5%

  • Other opinion(explain).

    Votes: 6 15.4%
  • Total voters
    39
misterman said:
My point was that not all of them do. Some choose to wear it.

Just let them choose, either way.
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My point was that with psychological abuse people may make decisions and "choose" things that are not in their best interest although they are the ones making the choice.

So when you post something that says:
Women who choose to wear the burqa are choosing to belong – not to feel alienated.
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There is far more to it than merely a "choice." Something your superficial analysis did not even take into account. :roll:
 
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Apocalypse said:
A suit is a sign of formality and representation, a burqa is a sign of the woman's obedience to the male in Islamic culture, in a relation of ownership.
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So is the practice of the father giving away the bride at a wedding. But we didn't ban it, we just educated ourselves and redefined the meaning. It's now just a symbolic gesture.
 
ScummyD said:
My point was that with psychological abuse people may make decisions and "choose" things that are not in their best interest although they are the ones making the choice.

So when you post something that says:

There is far more to it than merely a "choice." Something your superficial analysis did not even take into account. :roll:
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I agree. For so many Mulsim women, the "choice" is between wearing the Burqa and being beaten, knifed or raped.

Great "choice", eh?


As far as I'm concerned, the only women who say they WANT to wear the d@mn things have experienced such psychological abuse that hey are experiencing something akin to the Stockholm syndrome.


again, I point out how it is mostly conservatives arguing for womens rights, while the left argues in favor of systematic degradation of women.

If people wish to support Muslims, instead of supporting the troglodytes, why not support those like the group Ni Putes Ni Soumises who are fighting against the oppression?
 
Kandahar said:
Define "tool of oppression." I don't want to wear a suit. My society tells me I have to wear it because I'm male. Does that make it a tool of oppression?
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Does your owner beat you if you don't wear it, K? Do you fear being gang raped if you don't wear your suit?
 
Gardener said:
again, I point out how it is mostly conservatives arguing for womens rights, while the left argues in favor of systematic degradation of women.
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Holy ****ing ****, are you kidding me? You're arguing to BAN a clothing choice. You're arguing to remove a woman's right to choose what clothing she can wear and you want to sit there and pretend you're being righteous by doing that? PRETEND that you're protecting women because obviously they're too psychologically frail to make decisions for themselves?!?

What you are doing is misogynistic and insulting to ALL women. To even sit there and try to say that you're fighting for women's rights while at the same time stating that they're too ****ed in the head to decide for themselves what to do so you will decide for them is just the epitome of a self-righteous, sexist, misogynistic ..... grrrr.... I'll refrain from further words because I'll probably get dinged for it.

As a woman, all I have to say is please STOP "fighting for women's rights". Please. Because that's a far cry from what you are doing.
 
Im not in favour.However i dislike the burka and think is often forced however i dont think a government is capable of deciding the difference.

So i will stay with my personnel opinion of thinking its wrong, backward and misogynistic.Without asking for it to be banned.
 
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rivrrat said:
Holy ****ing ****, are you kidding me? You're arguing to BAN a clothing choice. You're arguing to remove a woman's right to choose what clothing she can wear and you want to sit there and pretend you're being righteous by doing that? PRETEND that you're protecting women because obviously they're too psychologically frail to make decisions for themselves?!?

What you are doing is misogynistic and insulting to ALL women. To even sit there and try to say that you're fighting for women's rights while at the same time stating that they're too ****ed in the head to decide for themselves what to do so you will decide for them is just the epitome of a self-righteous, sexist, misogynistic ..... grrrr.... I'll refrain from further words because I'll probably get dinged for it.

As a woman, all I have to say is please STOP "fighting for women's rights". Please. Because that's a far cry from what you are doing.
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Such an angry post at such an imaginary position. Maybe you didn't read his post right. Here was the main point:

I agree. For so many Mulsim women, the "choice" is between wearing the Burqa and being beaten, knifed or raped.
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He's not against a "woman's right to choose" anything, and I find it odd that you would claim that he was without addressing his actual argument.
 
Bikinis vs. Burqas

Islamic clothing company:
SA-hjb-05_prod.2.jpg

American clothing company:
womens_swim.2.jpg

I report you decide.
 
Dav said:
Such an angry post at such an imaginary position. Maybe you didn't read his post right. Here was the main point:




He's not against a "woman's right to choose" anything, and I find it odd that you would claim that he was without addressing his actual argument.
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Anyone who is for a ban, is against a woman's right to choose what to wear.
 
Dav said:
He's not against a "woman's right to choose" anything, and I find it odd that you would claim that he was without addressing his actual argument.
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If he's for a ban, he's against her right to choose.
 
rivrrat said:
Anyone who is for a ban, is against a woman's right to choose what to wear.
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Not that I agree with this law, but Gardener does have a valid point. Many Muslim women don't really choose to wear the Burka.
 
Ethereal said:
Not that I agree with this law, but Gardener does have a valid point. Many Muslim women don't really choose to wear the Burka.
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LOTS of women don't choose to wear it. Obviously. But some do.

Let them choose, either way.
 
Ethereal said:
Not that I agree with this law, but Gardener does have a valid point. Many Muslim women don't really choose to wear the Burka.
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Many women in the US don't really choose to wear shirts either. But we're forced to by threat of fines and imprisonment.

Regardless, in a western country, they ALL choose to wear the burqa. If it is not required by their government, then it is their choice to wear it. They are no more forced to wear it and/or remain in an abusive relationship than non-Muslim women are.

I mean are Amish women FORCED to wear the crappy clothing they wear? Are nuns forced to wear their habits? No.

Hell, when I was in India, I considered wearing something similar. And, I did walk around with a scarf over my head most of the time. I could see a HUGE benefit to wearing something to cover my hair and face. HUGE benefit. If it hadn't been so damn hot (to me), I would have at times.
 
rivrrat said:
Many women in the US don't really choose to wear shirts either. But we're forced to by threat of fines and imprisonment.

Regardless, in a western country, they ALL choose to wear the burqa. If it is not required by their government, then it is their choice to wear it. They are no more forced to wear it and/or remain in an abusive relationship than non-Muslim women are.
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Nobody is saying that the government is always the one forcing them to wear it. The government isn't the only one who can force/pressure people to do things.

Hell, when I was in India, I considered wearing something similar. And, I did walk around with a scarf over my head most of the time. I could see a HUGE benefit to wearing something to cover my hair and face. HUGE benefit. If it hadn't been so damn hot (to me), I would have at times.
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This seems like an odd statement coming from someone who said that we only wear clothes because "we're a bunch of prudes".
 
The way to change things is from the bottom up and not top down authoritarianism. When you see these clowns walking around in costumes mock and ridicule them out of existence. If they want to hide behind full body drapes tell them just to stay home behind closed doors altogether like the freaks that they are.
 
ScummyD said:
The way to change things is from the bottom up and not top down authoritarianism. When you see these clowns walking around in costumes mock and ridicule them out of existence. If they want to hide behind full body drapes tell them just to stay home behind closed doors altogether like the freaks that they are.
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No, thanks.

I have better things to do with my life than to verbally abuse random innocent strangers on the street who haven't ever harmed me in any way.
 
Arcana XV said:
No, thanks.

I have better things to do with my life than to verbally abuse random innocent strangers on the street who haven't ever harmed me in any way.
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Guess I have more free time than you and can spare two seconds. Must suck for you.
 
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I'm kinda torn on this issue, but I lean towards thinking that burqas should be banned. The reason being that we cannot truly know whether a woman is wearing it voluntarily or not. Of course some women tell the media that they do, but are they just saying that because they're under pressure?
 
AgentM said:
I'm kinda torn on this issue, but I lean towards thinking that burqas should be banned. The reason being that we cannot truly know whether a woman is wearing it voluntarily or not. Of course some women tell the media that they do, but are they just saying that because they're under pressure?
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That's not really sound logic, since you could use it for not only any article of clothing, but pretty much any product ever.

The only way to solve the problem of women being forced to wear the veil is to crack down on the thugs responsible, and, more importantly, get them to assimilate into society.
 
Arcana XV said:
Immensely. I so wish I had more time to spend hurting people in my daily routine.
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I wouldn't know what it's like to have so little time. But it's gotta suck.
 
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