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Should getting a sex change be legal?

Should getting a sex change be legal?

  • Yes, it should be legal

    Votes: 75 87.2%
  • No, it should be illegal

    Votes: 10 11.6%
  • I don't know

    Votes: 1 1.2%

  • Total voters
    86
Why wouldn't being transgendered be a disorder? There is a solution to the problem. Get a sex change.

Well, I'm sure it can cause mental problems because you don't feel comfortable in your skin, but I don't think that it's solely a mental problem like some are asserting here.
 
Well, I'm sure it can cause mental problems because you don't feel comfortable in your skin, but I don't think that it's solely a mental problem like some are asserting here.

Funny thing, I know a guy that got a sex change then turned into lesbian. She/he is perfectly happy with it. Pretty bizarre huh?
 
Funny thing, I know a guy that got a sex change then turned into lesbian. She/he is perfectly happy with it. Pretty bizarre huh?

It's not bizarre at all. I have a friend who did it too. I'm not going to pretend to understand what it feels like to not feel comfortable in your own skin like that and feel like a woman but be a man or whatever, but I certainly think that they should be able to do what makes them happy. The fact that people would assert that it's some kind of mental illness is insulting to say the least.
 
It's not bizarre at all. I have a friend who did it too. I'm not going to pretend to understand what it feels like to not feel comfortable in your own skin like that and feel like a woman but be a man or whatever, but I certainly think that they should be able to do what makes them happy. The fact that people would assert that it's some kind of mental illness is insulting to say the least.

I think we need to come to common terms on what an illness is. From my POV I would define it as something causes harm physically and or mentally to an individual. I can see why being transgendered under this POV could be considered an illness.
 
What is the purpose of this comment, to denegrate religious people? It's quite obvious if you think you can hide behind the fact that you didn't say Bible, Christian, Jew or religion.

No. I'm a Methodist. I wasn't looking to make this a religious topic. It was to illustrate how ridiculous it is to force our morals on others as long as they aren't harming anyone else.
 
You don't see chopping off body parts as doing any harm?

I wouldn't do it to myself if that's what you are asking. But then I'm quite satisfied with my body. So much so that I have no need to get any type of piercing or tattoo or anything else. Though I may get lasik surgery eventually. But only because in the long run it is cheaper than buying glasses every 2 years.

Go to your doctor and tell her you want her to help you lose weight by having your left arm removed. See what she says.

Voluntary amputees exist. I see no problem with doctors performing these operations. All of these people seem much happier once they have these operations performed.

Voluntary Amputation | MetaFilter

NSFW CHOP CHOP! Look mom, no hand!

I think EgoffTib answered the next part of your post for you. Thanks EgoffTib. :)
 
Perhaps you are right. As I have said, I don't think the government should be involved at all. The doctor certainly is involved though, and I think his/her responsibility is to "first, do no harm" as it were, and not to do whatever the patient will pay for.

I just think if someone goes up to a doctor and says "Hey, I will pay you $2000 to chop of my penis" if the doctor says "Sure thing! Let me go get meat cleaver!" that makes them a bit of a scumbag, and doesn't really demonstrate a genuine concern for their patient.

The kind of doctor that performs such operations is not the kind that you would see in a normal hospital saving lives in the ER. These types of doctors are specialists that are only in the profession to make money. Not save lives.
 
"It has nothing to do with the mind." - Dr_Patrick

According to this article, the APA still list transgenderism as a mental disorder in the DSM.

So is depression, and yet it has a physical treatment.
 
A mental sickness is any disorder that interferes with a person's ability to normally function in society. If a sex change, which can't be done willy nilly as said before, is the only "cure" than so be it. It's not my life. It's there's It should be treated as such
 
I wouldn't do it to myself if that's what you are asking. But then I'm quite satisfied with my body. So much so that I have no need to get any type of piercing or tattoo or anything else. Though I may get lasik surgery eventually. But only because in the long run it is cheaper than buying glasses every 2 years.

I wasn't asking if you would have it done to yourself. I was asking if you would chop your friends dick off if he asked you (or paid you) to. If your friend is unhappy having a dick, and he says he will give you $50 bucks to chop it off, is there any reason not to take his money and make him a happy man?

I think EgoffTib answered the next part of your post for you. Thanks EgoffTib.

I can only hope that the doctors willing to do that are as rare as the people wishing to have it done.
 
The kind of doctor that performs such operations is not the kind that you would see in a normal hospital saving lives in the ER. These types of doctors are specialists that are only in the profession to make money. Not save lives.

Sure. I get that. And I never even hinted at a suggestion that it should be illegal for them to do so.

The question of whether it was moral to do so arose in the thread however, so I am compelled to place such doctors in the ranks of loan sharks, politicians, gold digging tarts, televangelists, lawyers, and other unsavoury types that get their money in despicable and unscrupulous ways.
 
This argument is akin to the whole "If we allow gay marriage, then we will have to allow people to marry dogs, cats, etc." And how exactly are you qualified to give an assessment as to whether or not these people are mentally ill?

So you admit that the limit for you is just allowing people to go to corrupt doctors so they can pretend to be a gender they are not? If you allow someone to go to a corrupt doctor to modify some body parts or add implants so that person can pretend to be a gender they are not then why not let someone go to a doctor so they can pretend to be a species they are not? Both are either absurd or neither are absurd. A man who thinks he is a woman trapped in a man's body is no different and is just as insane as a person who thinks they are a tiger,duck or cat trapped in man's body.

Little Timmy can wear fake dog ears, a fake fur coat and a tail and have everyone in his school call him spot until he is old enough to get to get some surgeries to modify his body parts and add implants to make it more physical. WHy should that be any more or less ridiculous than allowing little Nicholas to go to school wearing a dress and having everyone call him Nicole until he is old enough to get some surgeries(yes this is actually happening in real life)?
 
I agree that the government shouldn't be involved, and I don't even have any issue with the morality of wanting or asking for a sex change. I am not sure where I stand regarding the moral obligations of the doctors though.

If you were a doctor, would you perform any operation a patient asked for, including amputation, even if it wasn't medically necessary? If not, what would you think of a fellow doctor who cut off a patient's arm just because she asked to have it removed and could afford the operation?

In the case of amputation, you are losing the functionality of your limb.

In the case of a sex change, nothing is actually being "cut off." Existing tissue is being restructured so it's a hole instead of a pole (or in rare cases, vice versa). No functionality is lost; the patient is still able to urinate and have sex. They won't ever be able to reproduce, but lots of people get surgery to eliminate that functionality anyway.
 
If you allow someone to go to a corrupt doctor to modify some body parts or add implants so that person can pretend to be a gender they are not then why not let someone go to a doctor so they can pretend to be a species they are not?

What about boob implants. BTW men get them too.
 
Something that seems to be overlooked here in all this talk of "its a mental disorder" is the fact that something like 1 in every 2000 people are born intersexed (which is entirely physical) and then need to either live their life in a between sexed limbo, or have had a sex arbitrarily assigned to them, many times involving surgical manipulation to assign them a "proper" gender.

Those who seek out sex changes and those who feel they are "in the body of the wrong sex" are quite few and far between, the thing that would be interesting to know is of these people how many of those were actually among the 1 in 2000 that were born with some form of intrasexed condition in the first place.
 
In the case of amputation, you are losing the functionality of your limb.

In the case of a sex change, nothing is actually being "cut off." Existing tissue is being restructured so it's a hole instead of a pole (or in rare cases, vice versa). No functionality is lost; the patient is still able to urinate and have sex. They won't ever be able to reproduce, but lots of people get surgery to eliminate that functionality anyway.

It seems to me that turning a pole into a hole involves chopping off the pole, I am no doctor though, so I suppose I can't say for sure. Regardless of how it is done, it is clearly a very extreme mutilation, much more so than piercings, scarification or even boob jobs.

It seems to me that Jamesrage's analogy is right on track. What fundamental difference is there between someone who thinks they are a woman trapped in a man's body and someone who thinks they are a duck trapped in a man's body?

Certainly the man might claim to be happier after feathers have been grafted into his skin, but I can't help but wonder about the moral fiber of a doctor who grafts duck feathers into a man's skin to help him feel more like a duck.
 
It seems to me that turning a pole into a hole involves chopping off the pole, I am no doctor though, so I suppose I can't say for sure. Regardless of how it is done, it is clearly a very extreme mutilation, much more so than piercings, scarification or even boob jobs.

So what?

Panache said:
It seems to me that Jamesrage's analogy is right on track. What fundamental difference is there between someone who thinks they are a woman trapped in a man's body and someone who thinks they are a duck trapped in a man's body?

What is the fundamental difference between a man who wants a vagina, and a woman who wants bigger boobs or a straighter nose?
 
What is the fundamental difference between a man who wants a vagina, and a woman who wants bigger boobs or a straighter nose?

Or a man who wants a larger penis. We need to outlaw those penis enlarging pumps too!
 
I wasn't asking if you would have it done to yourself. I was asking if you would chop your friends dick off if he asked you (or paid you) to. If your friend is unhappy having a dick, and he says he will give you $50 bucks to chop it off, is there any reason not to take his money and make him a happy man?

For $50? Nope. For $1,000? Sure. After he signed a piece of paper promising not to sue me for anything or have me brought up on charges and had it notarized. The only reason that I could think of not to do it is that it would gross me out. I'm not to fond of seeing blood. Hence why I'm not a doctor.

I can only hope that the doctors willing to do that are as rare as the people wishing to have it done.

You might not want to do any google searches about it then....
 
Sure. I get that. And I never even hinted at a suggestion that it should be illegal for them to do so.

The question of whether it was moral to do so arose in the thread however, so I am compelled to place such doctors in the ranks of loan sharks, politicians, gold digging tarts, televangelists, lawyers, and other unsavoury types that get their money in despicable and unscrupulous ways.

Ah if you are just going at this from a morality perspective then there really is nothing to talk about. IMO it is not immoral to help make someone happy through a simple (the word "simple" is relative here) medical procedure that harms no one. I would imagine that the one getting the procedure would not call it harm. So when it comes to morality it is entirely up to someones POV.
 

So there.

What is the fundamental difference between a man who wants a vagina, and a woman who wants bigger boobs or a straighter nose?

The man's neurosis is extreme, and the woman's neurosis is only mild. The woman can change her mind and get the silicone removed later. Her issue is a matter of self image rather than self identity. Women get boob jobs because they think they are small-breasted women, not because they think they are really big-breasted women who are somehow in the wrong body.

My opinion of elective plastic surgery is low to begin with, but I really can't fathom mangling people's genitalia for a living. In my opinion it takes a person of low moral character to find satisfaction in such a career.
 
No. I'm a Methodist. I wasn't looking to make this a religious topic. It was to illustrate how ridiculous it is to force our morals on others as long as they aren't harming anyone else.
Why don't you head down to the religious forum, you can hold a prayer meetin' down there? Why do you need to hijack this thread?
 
Why don't you head down to the religious forum, you can hold a prayer meetin' down there? Why do you need to hijack this thread?

Says the guy who first brought religion into the thread...
 
Ah if you are just going at this from a morality perspective then there really is nothing to talk about. IMO it is not immoral to help make someone happy through a simple (the word "simple" is relative here) medical procedure that harms no one. I would imagine that the one getting the procedure would not call it harm. So when it comes to morality it is entirely up to someones POV.

Yeah, I am still kinda on the fence about it. Giving heroin to a middle school kid doesn't harm anyone either assuming that the kid doesn't consider themselves harmed. It still reeks of unscrupulousness to me though.:(
 
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