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Healthcare question for Christians

WWJD?


  • Total voters
    34
Forced charity, by Government edict, certainly is not Christian charity. It is oppression.
Yes, thankfully you Christians are doing the Christian thing and caring for your neighbors, loving them as you love yourself. Thus there is no healthcare crisis, no ghetto, no poverty and so on.
 
And compair the dates...

The latest translations (as in 2008) do not say slavers. Sorry. :roll:

:lol:

Blackdog, I didnt miss the dates. However, the bible is not an article, with updates. Its printing in 2008 makes it no more authoritative. For example, I was brought up on the King James Bible, but after some 25 years someone brings out a version in 2008 and I and every Christian is supposed to take it as the words of Christ?

Yea just like the most recent translation. :roll:

Please dude get real.


Please dont try that on us. I encourage you also to get real.


When they take it by force to give to someone else it is. It is not charity at that point.

What is stealing is not defined by you. If taxation were stealing it would be against the law.
But please, dont take my word for it. Just try and sue the US government for stealing your taxes over the years...you could make millions back in paid taxes! I encourage you to try it.
 
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:lol:

Blackdog, I didnt miss the dates. However, the bible is not an article, with updates. Its printing in 2008 makes it no more authoritative. For example, I was brought up on the King James Bible, but after some 25 years someone brings out a version in 2008 and I and every Christian is supposed to take it as the words of Christ?

The translations allot of them in the old Bibles are completely wrong. The KJV is considered the worst.

For example it is "you shall not murder" not "you shall not kill." Huge difference.

Literally thousands of such errors are in the KJV and other Bibles. The newest Bibles are translated from the actual Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic not the KJV.

Please dont try that on us. I encourage you also to get real.

I just did with a little thing called a facts. :2wave:

What is stealing is not defined by you. If taxation were stealing it would be against the law.

Please point out where I said all taxation is stealing? I said when the government takes money by force to redistribute it to others it is stealing. It is by the definition.

But please, dont take my word for it. Just try and sue the US government for stealing your taxes over the years...you could make millions back in paid taxes! I encourage you to try it.

You are kidding right? :shock:
 
Yes, thankfully you Christians are doing the Christian thing and caring for your neighbors, loving them as you love yourself. Thus there is no healthcare crisis, no ghetto, no poverty and so on.
How, exactly do you equate there being poverty, etc, to Christians not doing what Christ taight?
 
Yes, thankfully you Christians are doing the Christian thing and caring for your neighbors, loving them as you love yourself. Thus there is no healthcare crisis, no ghetto, no poverty and so on.
That is simply ignorant and nothing more than a useless red herring.

You fail.
 
Yes, thankfully you Christians are doing the Christian thing and caring for your neighbors, loving them as you love yourself. Thus there is no healthcare crisis, no ghetto, no poverty and so on.

What do you want? People to be completey provided for off the pay of others?

GET A JOB!
 
The translations allot of them in the old Bibles are completely wrong. The KJV is considered the worst.

For example it is "you shall not murder" not "you shall not kill." Huge difference.

Literally thousands of such errors are in the KJV and other Bibles. The newest Bibles are translated from the actual Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic not the KJV.



I just did with a little thing called a facts. :2wave:

Indeed, you do highlight some interesting dilemmas. Many thanks.

Lets set out things more clearly;

1/ The use of 'kidnappers' does not logically exclude slave traders. As of course, one may gain slaves by kidnap. Thus the statements on such by Jesus do not take the politics out of his message.

2/ The ISV you rely on is not above criticism and thus neither I nor I fear many across the world will be taking it on as the revealed word any time soon given the ISV's interesting take on things;

ISV -
I am the true vine, and my Father is the vintner
.

Vintner meaning wine seller.

KJV -
I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

Much better.

I should also here mention the frequent Americanisms peppering the work that damage its credibility and make it likely that itll be some time before its received across the world;
they went outside and proceeded one block when the angel suddenly left him





Please point out where I said all taxation is stealing? I said when the government takes money by force to redistribute it to others it is stealing. It is by the definition.

My apologies, I didnt know I had to wait for you to say 'all' taxation before I could make the point.
So those taxes you pay that do not come directly back to you are stolen?



You are kidding right? :shock:

Of course! We both know it would be a fools errand.:roll:
 
I doubt Jesus would have much of an opinion either way, which characterizes his feelings toward most Roman policies. Christianity is mostly about transcendence. You can enjoy earthly things if you have them and don't disperse your soul into them, but you are still supposed to be fine even if you possess nothing material. Because you have the kingdom of heaven, through which eternal paradise and all things are possible.
 
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I doubt Jesus would have much of an opinion either way, which characterizes his feelings toward most Roman policies. Christianity is mostly about transcendence. You can enjoy earthly things if you have them and don't disperse your soul into them, but you are still supposed to be fine even if you possess nothing material. Because you have the kingdom of heaven, through which eternal paradise and all things are possible.

Then why be a brother to man?
 
Wanted to take a second and point something out here. This is not an attack, just an observation on this thread and others like it.

BLZebub - Not Chrsitian
Devil505 - Not Christian
Disnydude - Christian
Gwendoline - Unknown
Joe1991 - Not Christian
Laila - Sunni Muslim
Layla Z - Unknown
NDN Dancer - Not Christian
SouthernDemocrat - Jeffersonian Christian (I know exactly what that is as I am similar)

Out of the 9 Members who voted yes to the question only 2 or 3 are actual Christians. 4 are confirmed non-believers/different religion. I would say the 2 unknown are likely Christians of some sort but you never know.

Interesting. This deserves another thread all to itself.

Not that it is anyone's business but I am a Christian. I've worked for churches as a youth minister, music minister, and peer minister and I was a summer missionary during college. I am also a huge believer in the separation of church and state.

In my current job, I see so many kids who are sick but their parents can't afford to take them to the doctor. These are not lazy parents who aren't working in most cases, but even if they were sitting at home drinking beer all day, should their child be punished? What seems to happen is that the parents wait until the child is seriously sick, then they end up in the ER which they really can't afford. When they can't pay their bill who ends up paying for it? Is universal health care the best answer for this? I think so, not because I am a Christian but because I think it is the right thing to do.
 
Indeed, you do highlight some interesting dilemmas. Many thanks.

Lets set out things more clearly;

1/ The use of 'kidnappers' does not logically exclude slave traders. As of course, one may gain slaves by kidnap. Thus the statements on such by Jesus do not take the politics out of his message.

Yes it would as kidnapping was illegal, slave trading was not.

2/ The ISV you rely on is not above criticism and thus neither I nor I fear many across the world will be taking it on as the revealed word any time soon given the ISV's interesting take on things;

ISV - I am the true vine, and my Father is the vintner

Vintner meaning wine seller.

KJV - I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

Much better.

You must either think I am stupid or sorely lacking in my Bible study to make such an utterly dishonest comparison.

ISV - I am the true vine, and my Father is the vintner

Vinter means "winemaker" Winemaking, or vinification, is the production of wine, starting with selection of the grapes or other produce and ending with bottling the finished wine.

KJV - I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

A farmer.

Now which one fits better or is the better translation?

I should also here mention the frequent Americanisms peppering the work that damage its credibility and make it likely that itll be some time before its received across the world;

"they went outside and proceeded one block when the angel suddenly left him"

It was written for Americans so what? Nice fallacy though. I mean really that has nothing to do with being a much more accurate translation. :lol:

My apologies, I didnt know I had to wait for you to say 'all' taxation before I could make the point.

Now more dishonesty? Why do you wish to attribute things to me I have not said or even implied?

Your point was highly exaggerated and had nothing to do with my comments about taxes.

So those taxes you pay that do not come directly back to you are stolen?

Please read what I said. Taxes collected by the Federal Government should go for the military, infrastructure (payroll, building etc), and Some limited emergency's that is pretty much it. That is all it was envisioned by the founders to do.

"The nation had few taxes in its early history. From 1791 to 1802, the United States government was supported by internal taxes on distilled spirits, carriages, refined sugar, tobacco and snuff, property sold at auction, corporate bonds, and slaves. The high cost of the War of 1812 brought about the nation's first sales taxes on gold, silverware, jewelry, and watches. In 1817, however, Congress did away with all internal taxes, relying on tariffs on imported goods to provide sufficient funds for running the government." - History of the Income Tax in the United States — Infoplease.com

The Civil War (the beginning of the end) greatly expanded "Federalism" to a status that had the founders rolling over in their graves. The Federal government was never ment to have the kind of power it has today.

Of course! We both know it would be a fools errand.:roll:

More fallacy. :roll:
 
Not that it is anyone's business but I am a Christian. I've worked for churches as a youth minister, music minister, and peer minister and I was a summer missionary during college. I am also a huge believer in the separation of church and state.


OK

In my current job, I see so many kids who are sick but their parents can't afford to take them to the doctor. These are not lazy parents who aren't working in most cases, but even if they were sitting at home drinking beer all day, should their child be punished? What seems to happen is that the parents wait until the child is seriously sick, then they end up in the ER which they really can't afford. When they can't pay their bill who ends up paying for it? Is universal health care the best answer for this? I think so, not because I am a Christian but because I think it is the right thing to do.

That is valid, and my comments are to those trying to use Christianity as a reason to force Obama care on us. Not you who is on a political track.

I think the system needs fixing but it is the government who broke it in the first place. They are the last people I expect to fix it.
 
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