Should adultery be a criminal offense punishable by jailtime?

I've not read the whole thread so this may have been asked already.

For those advocating criminalizing adultery where else in personal relationships, especially sexual, do you think the government should be involved. Should pre-maritial sex be a criminal offense punishable by jail time? How about homosexual behavior?

TOJ said:

I've not read the whole thread so this may have been asked already.

For those advocating criminalizing adultery where else in personal relationships, especially sexual, do you think the government should be involved. Should pre-maritial sex be a criminal offense punishable by jail time? How about homosexual behavior?

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So basicly you want us to re-hash the entire thread when there's only 19 pages untill it will be closed.

No thank you.

Arcana XV said:

Well, she does have a point. What would you do if your wife stopped having sex with you and refused to give you a divorce? Would you really become celibate until she finally changes her mind, which could take years?

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The state has default laws that protect people from others dragging their feet for cases just like these.

I don't think rivrrat meant what she said as an excuse for cheating, but as a possible explanation why someone would feel compelled to cheat.

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That may be well and true... but how we word things indicates how we feel subconsciously. To say that somebody "made" us do something as ridiculous as cheat may not be what they meant to say, but in my experience, it is a perfect representation regarding how they actually feel about the matter. In Rivs case, it aligns PERFECTLY with the many many MANY times that I have heard her make excuses and justifications for peoples irresponsible and untrustworthy behacior. Just look at her refusal to see the context in which I am discussing trust, or this issue for that matter. She keeps indicating that my argument is about "a person's feeling" being "hurt". INO she is dishonest or deluded. Seriously... and dishonest goes towards her attitudes about why she doesn want to view her cheating with a married man actions as irresponsible and untrustworthy...

Look, with KK and riv this is the routine. They admit to being selfish and not caring. It is the "families fault" that the family breaks up, not their fault in any shape or form. She has never indicated that it is not the kids faulr, she just glosses over that point that I keep making, for she knows that it will bury her and she will have to face reality. That is why I end it in a "whatever..."

Only the two people involved know what's really going on in a marriage. This is why this whole making adultery criminal is such a retarded idea.

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That's not true... counselers might know. Friends. Family. I have known many peoples marrital issues. WE have been to a counselor. I have talked to my dad, brother and friend about things, as has my wife. To say that it is in the family since only they know, and it is their issue as to whether it breaks up is a cop out. It is simply retarded. They make the final decision, but for most everybody that I know think that cheating is marriage ending and they know this prior to cheating.



This was an interesting read regardless of stand on the issue...

Should Adultery be a Crime?

Maximus Zeebra said:

Wow.. Amazing, just amazing.. And I guess adultery do not lead to divorce?

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Not always...

Bodhisattva said:

The state has default laws that protect people from others dragging their feet for cases just like these.

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Point. And, if you ask me, the state has been making divorce easier and easier to obtain with each passing decade. And this is true in practically the entire industrialized world. It really doesn't seem all that bothered about doing its utmost to keep families together. Does anyone really think that MaxZ's idea of making adultery illegal has a chance in hell of ever becoming law? :lol:

That may be well and true... but how we word things indicates how we feel subconsciously. To say that somebody "made" us do something as ridiculous as cheat may not be what they meant to say, but in my experience, it is a perfect representation regarding how they actually feel about the matter. In Rivs case, it aligns PERFECTLY with the many many MANY times that I have heard her make excuses and justifications for peoples irresponsible and untrustworthy behacior. Just look at her refusal to see the context in which I am discussing trust, or this issue for that matter. She keeps indicating that my argument is about "a person's feeling" being "hurt". INO she is dishonest or deluded. Seriously... and dishonest goes towards her attitudes about why she doesn want to view her cheating with a married man actions as irresponsible and untrustworthy...

Look, with KK and riv this is the routine. They admit to being selfish and not caring. It is the "families fault" that the family breaks up, not their fault in any shape or form. She has never indicated that it is not the kids faulr, she just glosses over that point that I keep making, for she knows that it will bury her and she will have to face reality. That is why I end it in a "whatever..."

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Yeah, I'm not here to pass judgment on others, sorry. I'll just say this, in cases of adultery I never blame the other woman for anything. I didn't in my case and I won't do it in other cases either. She didn't do anything wrong. My ex husband did. He is the only one to blame for the choices he made. All she ever did wrong was fall in love with him. If you can even ever call love "wrong".

That's not true... counselers might know. Friends. Family. I have known many peoples marrital issues. WE have been to a counselor. I have talked to my dad, brother and friend about things, as has my wife. To say that it is in the family since only they know, and it is their issue as to whether it breaks up is a cop out. It is simply retarded. They make the final decision, but for most everybody that I know think that cheating is marriage ending and they know this prior to cheating.

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None of these people will ever know the whole story. They get glimpses of what the two parties decide to share, but we never really get the whole story.

As for your last point, it's a cultural thing, you know. While it is true that most of my American friends do consider adultery to be THE deal breaker, it's no so much the case in Europe. Europeans, for some reason, tend to be much more forgiving of infidelity. Except for the Mediterranean cultures, that seem to still regard women as either virgins or whores and where men still think their wife's vagina is their personal property. :lol:

This was an interesting read regardless of stand on the issue...

Should Adultery be a Crime?

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There's so much I disagree with in there, I wouldn't know where to start breaking that mumbo jumbo of pop psych, sociological myths and evolutionary psych apart. :lol:

Jerry said:

So basicly you want us to re-hash the entire thread when there's only 19 pages untill it will be closed.

No thank you.

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I don't care what is rehashed. I just asked a simple question. :roll:

EgoffTib said:

Not always...

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I never said adultery always leads to divorce. Thats why I make it a big point in this thread that "criminalization" of adultery should only give the offended party the RIGHT to press charges and have the adulterer punished. That would be up to them.

TOJ said:

I've not read the whole thread so this may have been asked already.

For those advocating criminalizing adultery where else in personal relationships, especially sexual, do you think the government should be involved. Should pre-maritial sex be a criminal offense punishable by jail time? How about homosexual behavior?

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I am only answering on my own behalf..

1. Government should NOT be involved. It should be about giving the RIGHT of the party cheated on to press charges against the adulterer if he so wanted and had sufficient proof. Its not about state surveillance of human relationship and discovering adulterers and putting them in jail.
2. No pre-marital sex should definetely not be a criminal offense in my opinion.
3. Homosexual behavior and sex should not be criminal behavior, but in my opinion, homosexual relations should not be accepted by the state, meaning homosexual marriage and adoption should never be considered.

I guess since I am the thread starter and have somewhat conservative views on adultery, those should be satisfactory answers to gain a more overall view on my stands?

Maximus Zeebra said:

I am only answering on my own behalf..

1. Government should NOT be involved. It should be about giving the RIGHT of the party cheated on to press charges against the adulterer if he so wanted and had sufficient proof. Its not about state surveillance of human relationship and discovering adulterers and putting them in jail.
2. No pre-marital sex should definetely not be a criminal offense in my opinion.
3. Homosexual behavior and sex should not be criminal behavior, but in my opinion, homosexual relations should not be accepted by the state, meaning homosexual marriage and adoption should never be considered.

I guess since I am the thread starter and have somewhat conservative views on adultery, those should be satisfactory answers to gain a more overall view on my stands?

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What the hell are you talking about. Who do you think the wronged party is going to complain to and who is going to conduct the investigation and prosecution and who it going imprision the offender? How is the government not involved in a criminal matter?

Maximus Zeebra said:

1. Government should NOT be involved. It should be about giving the RIGHT of the party cheated on to press charges against the adulterer if he so wanted and had sufficient proof. Its not about state surveillance of human relationship and discovering adulterers and putting them in jail.

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So even if an adulterer doesn't have children they still get punished? Because...

scourge99 said:

So even if an adulterer doesn't have children they still get punished? Because...

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Because they slept with someone else than who they were married to. Any new law on criminalization of adultery would certainly include another clausul in the marriage contract, stating that you can face criminal prosecution if you cheat on your spouse.

TOJ said:

What the hell are you talking about. Who do you think the wronged party is going to complain to and who is going to conduct the investigation and prosecution and who it going imprision the offender? How is the government not involved in a criminal matter?

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Perhaps if you read the rest of point 1 you will understand the first part of point 1.

Maximus Zeebra said:

Because they slept with someone else than who they were married to.

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that's circular logic: its illegal because its in the contract and its the contract because its illegal.
Can you explain to me why someone should be punished for sleeping with another when married? Others have made it quite clear its just about the kids but if a married couple doesn't have kids you are still advocating that they get punished. This begs the question: if its not about kids then what's your reasoning? People should get thrown in jail because they broke a civil contract? People should get thrown in jail because they hurt someones feelings or destroyed their trust?

Bodhisattva said:

That may be well and true... but how we word things indicates how we feel subconsciously. To say that somebody "made" us do something as ridiculous as cheat may not be what they meant to say, but in my experience, it is a perfect representation regarding how they actually feel about the matter. In Rivs case, it aligns PERFECTLY with the many many MANY times that I have heard her make excuses and justifications for peoples irresponsible and untrustworthy behacior.

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What excuses have I made for anyone's untrustworthy behavior? The only thing I have done is explain how or why someone may cheat. And, I have repeatedly stated that I feel it is best to remove oneself from a relationship before cheating. I have stated that unequivocally. I have also stated that if someone doesn't choose to do that, it is no one else's business but theirs and their partner's. Certainly not the government's.

Just look at her refusal to see the context in which I am discussing trust, or this issue for that matter. She keeps indicating that my argument is about "a person's feeling" being "hurt". INO she is dishonest or deluded.

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Then what is it about? I have asked you repeatedly and you have yet to give an answer.

Seriously... and dishonest goes towards her attitudes about why she doesn want to view her cheating with a married man actions as irresponsible and untrustworthy...

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I didn't cheat, they did. I broke no one's trust, they did.

Look, with KK and riv this is the routine. They admit to being selfish and not caring. It is the "families fault" that the family breaks up, not their fault in any shape or form.

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Yes, it is the fault of the members of the relationship that the relationship broke up. It is NEVER anyone's fault but theirs.

She has never indicated that it is not the kids faulr, she just glosses over that point that I keep making, for she knows that it will bury her and she will have to face reality. That is why I end it in a "whatever..."

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Glosses over what? Of course I've never indicated it was not any kid's fault because I never implied that it WAS any kid's fault. WTF kid are you talking about? Methinks you're the one trying to escape reality since you obviously put words in my mouth and then try to condemn me for what you THINK I said. It's insane. Why don't you try reading what I say instead of glossing over what I say and putting words in my mouth.

Maximus Zeebra said:

And it should be their decision if they want to press charges against the person who committed the adultery. Giving them that possibility rather than not, is just fair.

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It's fair to let someone use our court system out of spite because their feelings got hurt? Seriously?

rivrrat said:

It's fair to let someone use our court system out of spite because their feelings got hurt? Seriously?

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Yeah thats it, end of discussion.. I am not going to repeat all the reasons why people should have those rights, I have repeated it enough already.. Good night..

Maximus Zeebra said:

Because they slept with someone else than who they were married to. Any new law on criminalization of adultery would certainly include another clausul in the marriage contract, stating that you can face criminal prosecution if you cheat on your spouse.

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And who determines what "cheating" is? What if they have a threesome? Is that cheating? Will both parties go to jail?

What if the wife thinks it's cheating because her husband looked at porn. Can she press charges then too?

This was a great post overall Arcana... *bows*

Arcana XV said:

Point. And, if you ask me, the state has been making divorce easier and easier to obtain with each passing decade. And this is true in practically the entire industrialized world. It really doesn't seem all that bothered about doing its utmost to keep families together. Does anyone really think that MaxZ's idea of making adultery illegal has a chance in hell of ever becoming law? :lol:

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They are making it easier, and there is nothing wrong with that at all...
Let 'em separate and move on...

My opinion on an emotional level is to put the worst adulterers in prison...
Those that are just scum on all levels and that do this act...

Most are not on that level, so my rationale must then take over and
say that prison should not be an option, but I just get so pissed at
the thought of cheating. I can't even watch movies or tv shows without
cringing when they cheat or lie about wanting to be with another...

It makes me sick that people can be so ****ty to each other, and that is
being irresponsible and untrustworthy in the worst possible way...

Yeah, I'm not here to pass judgment on others, sorry. I'll just say this, in cases of adultery I never blame the other woman for anything. I didn't in my case and I won't do it in other cases either. She didn't do anything wrong. My ex husband did. He is the only one to blame for the choices he made. All she ever did wrong was fall in love with him. If you can even ever call love "wrong".

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Love isn't wrong, and if the "other women" don't know about the marriage,
they have done NOTHING wrong at all. Once the marriage is known though,
well, they can be in love all they want, but just knowing that they man is
a cheater and all that should be enough to let the woman know that he is
a loser and for her to continue indicates that she isn't much better, IMO.

None of these people will ever know the whole story. They get glimpses of what the two parties decide to share, but we never really get the whole story.

As for your last point, it's a cultural thing, you know. While it is true that most of my American friends do consider adultery to be THE deal breaker, it's no so much the case in Europe. Europeans, for some reason, tend to be much more forgiving of infidelity. Except for the Mediterranean cultures, that seem to still regard women as either virgins or whores and where men still think their wife's vagina is their personal property. :lol:

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It's the deal breaker for me. No question.

There's so much I disagree with in there, I wouldn't know where to start breaking that mumbo jumbo of pop psych, sociological myths and evolutionary psych apart. :lol:

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Didn't say that it was science or holy writ, just that it was interesting...

rivrrat said:

What excuses have I made for anyone's untrustworthy behavior? The only thing I have done is explain how or why someone may cheat. And, I have repeatedly stated that I feel it is best to remove oneself from a relationship before cheating. I have stated that unequivocally. I have also stated that if someone doesn't choose to do that, it is no one else's business but theirs and their partner's. Certainly not the government's.



Then what is it about? I have asked you repeatedly and you have yet to give an answer.


I didn't cheat, they did. I broke no one's trust, they did.


Yes, it is the fault of the members of the relationship that the relationship broke up. It is NEVER anyone's fault but theirs.


Glosses over what? Of course I've never indicated it was not any kid's fault because I never implied that it WAS any kid's fault. WTF kid are you talking about? Methinks you're the one trying to escape reality since you obviously put words in my mouth and then try to condemn me for what you THINK I said. It's insane. Why don't you try reading what I say instead of glossing over what I say and putting words in my mouth.

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- You constantly make excuses and/or don't acknowledge untrustworthy or irresposible behavior
- I have answer repeatedly... it is about a CONSEQUENCE.
- You cheated if you slept with a married man, you are untrustworthy IMO.
- It is partially your fault if the marriage ended
- You don't acknowledge that it is anybody's fault but the "families" and when called on it you don't clarify. If it is the "family" and kids are a part of the "family" then you are saying that it is their decision/fault as well.

rivrrat said:

It's fair to let someone use our court system out of spite because their feelings got hurt? Seriously?

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...And here we go AGAIN. It is not simply about "feelings". If it changed it would be due to a CONSEQUENCE.

rivrrat said:

And who determines what "cheating" is? What if they have a threesome? Is that cheating? Will both parties go to jail?

What if the wife thinks it's cheating because her husband looked at porn. Can she press charges then too?

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...And now it just gets down to being retarded.
Do you do this on purpose?
Is this why the teachers were unable to teach you?

Maximus Zeebra said:

Perhaps if you read the rest of point 1 you will understand the first part of point 1.

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I did read it. The first part of point one makes the rest of point one kind of irrelevent. You say you don't want the government involved yet you want the cheater prosecuted. How do you propose to accomplish this?

Bodhisattva said:

...And now it just gets down to being retarded.
Do you do this on purpose?
Is this why the teachers were unable to teach you?

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Who is being retarded here? RR's questions are perfectly legit. :roll:

TOJ said:

Who is being retarded here? RR's questions are perfectly legit. :roll:

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You're gonna come in here rolling your eyes at me like a retard? What a punk. Shoo...

Bodhisattva said:

You're gonna come in here rolling your eyes at me like a retard? What a punk. Shoo...

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That's pretty much typical of you. Can't answer her questions so you resort to calling her names. Yeah, you are the retard. :roll: