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Should birth records be available to adopted children?

Should birth records be open to adopted children

  • Yes

    Votes: 9 50.0%
  • No

    Votes: 1 5.6%
  • Depends on the circumstances

    Votes: 7 38.9%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 1 5.6%

  • Total voters
    18
They gave up their right to privacy when they fornicated. Let them get a restraining order if the first meeting doesn't go well.

With the anger you show toward your birth parents, I'm pretty sure that any reconnection would go badly. Why do you resent them so much? Your birth mother gave you up most likely so that you could have a better life than she could provide, or because she was too young to be a responsible parent. You sound as if you hate her, and are just itching for the opportunity to tell her to her face. That's really sad.
 
With the anger you show toward your birth parents, I'm pretty sure that any reconnection would go badly. Why do you resent them so much? Your birth mother gave you up most likely so that you could have a better life than she could provide, or because she was too young to be a responsible parent. You sound as if you hate her, and are just itching for the opportunity to tell her to her face. That's really sad.

I think you are misinterpreting my thoughts regarding my personal situation. My wife does geneology. I could find my egg and sperm donors if I so desired. I'm sure my egg donor did give me up for a better life for me. I don't resent that. I have curiousity about blood siblings moreso than birth parents. If I wanted to find out, I could. I'm more worried about them not leaving me alone if I don't care for their company. I'm not bitter. I don't need extra X-mas cards. It would be interesting to meet them. I don't know them though to have an opinion either way.

But, donors that give up kids for unselfish reasons don't really have to worry about their privacy. It's the ones that give up kids for selfish reasons that I hold no quarter for. I see these people as hiding from their guilt. Boo hoo. It's been known for eternity that sex may lead to pregnancy. They got out of raising their offspring. The least they could do is give someone some explanation.

Who is ever really ready for a child?
 
I think you are misinterpreting my thoughts regarding my personal situation. My wife does geneology. I could find my egg and sperm donors if I so desired. I'm sure my egg donor did give me up for a better life for me. I don't resent that. I have curiousity about blood siblings moreso than birth parents. If I wanted to find out, I could. I'm more worried about them not leaving me alone if I don't care for their company. I'm not bitter. I don't need extra X-mas cards. It would be interesting to meet them. I don't know them though to have an opinion either way.

But, donors that give up kids for unselfish reasons don't really have to worry about their privacy. It's the ones that give up kids for selfish reasons that I hold no quarter for. I see these people as hiding from their guilt. Boo hoo. It's been known for eternity that sex may lead to pregnancy. They got out of raising their offspring. The least they could do is give someone some explanation.

Who is ever really ready for a child?

You say you're not bitter... but you sure sound bitter. I've known a couple of women who gave up their babies at birth. One of them never regretted it. She was on her way to college (actually, she was still in high school), wasn't ready to have a child, but didn't believe in abortion. She'd probably be one of those "selfish reasons" you elude to. I don't think she'd appreciate being called selfish because she wasn't financially or emotionally ready to raise a baby, but if her child wanted to hunt her up just to punish her with withering words, I'm the desired result would be achieved. She'd be deeply hurt and emotionally devasted.

The other simply couldn't bear to see the face of her rapist in a child. Showing up on her front door would probably send her into an emotional meltdown... and really, what child wants to know that it is the product of a violent rape? Some things should be left alone, you know?

If the parents want to find children given up for adoption, there are plenty of places they can register as willing. If they don't, they deserve the privacy they were promised, not an unwilling yank back to the bleakest time of their lives.
 
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It's been known for eternity that sex may lead to pregnancy.

Ohhh, not the, "if you don't want kids, don't have sex" sermon. :doh

If this was such a perfect world we wouldn't need contraception or adoption to begin with. We could all click our heels together and wish our perfect dream life to correct its course when it takes the wrong fork in the road. However....

They got out of raising their offspring. The least they could do is give someone some explanation.

That would certainly help to erode the "anonymous" status, doncha think?

Who is ever really ready for a child?

Lots of people. Do you seriously believe this is such a black and white issue? Haven't you ever seen parents who, when you look at their innocent kids, make you think, "Those kids would be better off with someone else!"?

I'm more worried about them not leaving me alone if I don't care for their company.

I would suggest that, with your obvious resentment towards your situation, it would not be a good idea to seek out your "donors", as you call them. But, then again, maybe it would be therapeutic.
 
You say you're not bitter... but you sure sound bitter.

About my personal situation I'm not bitter. But yes, when people shirk personal responsibility it chafes my ass. I'm not upset they gave up kids for adoption. People who don't want kids make for ****ty parents. My problem is that they think they don't at least owe them a conversation about why they gave them up. It's not like it costs them anything.

I've known a couple of women who gave up their babies at birth. One of them never regretted it. She was on her way to college (actually, she was still in high school), wasn't ready to have a child, but didn't believe in abortion. She'd probably be one of those "selfish reasons" you elude to. I don't think she'd appreciate being called selfish because she wasn't financially or emotionally ready to raise a baby, but if her child wanted to hunt her up just to punish her with withering words, I'm the desired result would be achieved. She'd be deeply hurt and emotionally devasted.

No, I wouldn't call that a selfish reason. I'm talking about people that make that decision because it would interfere with their social lifestyle, i.e. partying.

If the child was put in a better situation, they wouldn't hunt anyone down to punish with withering words. They probably have questions.

If the child was put in a bad situation, they may be upset. But that's the risk a donor took for their child. An uncomfortable conversation isn't that big of a trade off for not having to make 18 years of sacrifice.

A child can't give up their rights to their biological history.

The other simply couldn't bear to see the face of her rapist in a child. Showing up on her front door would probably send her into an emotional meltdown... and really, what child wants to know that it is the product of a violent rape? Some things should be left alone, you know?

I understand her giving up the child. I would want to know if I was the product of a violent rape. I might have been. I'll never know probably. I believe the truth is not damaging. It's just the truth. I prefer to live in reality and not some fantasy. Maybe I am emotionally strong. Maybe that's why.

If the parents want to find children given up for adoption, there are plenty of places they can register as willing. If they don't, they deserve the privacy they were promised, not an unwilling yank back to the bleakest time of their lives.

I think the kids should have more privacy. What if they don't know? That would be quite a shock. People get reminded of bleak times all the time. Are the people you know that emotionally fragile? People can handle a lot more than they realize. In such a religious culture I find it telling that people think God would throw something at them that they couldn't handle.
 
Ohhh, not the, "if you don't want kids, don't have sex" sermon. :doh

No, it's not that sermon. I'm fine with adoption. Is an explanation too much to ask. It's not like they are being forced to have any real responsibility.

If this was such a perfect world we wouldn't need contraception or adoption to begin with. We could all click our heels together and wish our perfect dream life to correct its course when it takes the wrong fork in the road. However....

Listen, I'm not the one advocating a fantasy life for anyone. I'm not pining for a perfect world.


That would certainly help to erode the "anonymous" status, doncha think?

What's the need for anonymity 18 years after the fact?


Lots of people. Do you seriously believe this is such a black and white issue? Haven't you ever seen parents who, when you look at their innocent kids, make you think, "Those kids would be better off with someone else!"?

A lot of people think they are ready for a child. But until you experience being a parent, you can't really say you are ready for all it entails. That doesn't mean that you can't handle it. It just means that things you didn't plan for can happen.

I'm not against adoption. Yes, I've seen kids that may be better off elsewhere. What does that have to do with donors giving their offspring some answers?


I would suggest that, with your obvious resentment towards your situation, it would not be a good idea to seek out your "donors", as you call them. But, then again, maybe it would be therapeutic.

If I resented my situation, I would try to find them. You are right, it could be good, it could be bad. If it were bad I would just ignore them. I don't have any need to yell at them. I'm perfectly happy with the parents that raised me. I just don't think that parents should be sheilded from answering questions that their offspring may have. If nothing else, at least make them say they want nothing to do them.
 
Well, I disagree. I do not believe that children given up for adoption have the right to interrogate their biological parents for any reason. They could have been aborted; instead, they were carried to term and given to adoptive parents who desperately wanted children to raise. You resent that? You feel you have the right to answers? You don't. Sorry about that. You do not have the "right" to such interrogation, to such explanation. You were given life. Make the most of it instead of plotting how to wreak revenge on a desperate birth mother who faced her own worst nightmare, and managed to survive it.

Adoptive children do not have the right to barge into the lives of their birth parents 18 years later and demand an explanation. They simply do not.

Hatred and sense of selfish entitlement simply gives credence to those who would choose abortion over adoption to prevent their lives from being torn asunder by resentful, bitter children too immature and self-absorbed to appreciate the quandry suffered by those who chose to give them life rather than oblivion. Narcissism and a total lack of empathy will never give peace to either the child or the birth parent that the child so desperately wants to punish. It only enforces the reality that bearing a child, no matter what the circumstance, from an unplanned pregnancy will create a cloud of destruction over one's entire life unless that pregnancy is terminated.

I'm pro-choice, but when the options faced are dire and more dire, then choice has been removed. A little gratitude toward one who has chosen to suffer the pain of pregnancy and childbirth to give one's offspring a chance would go a long way toward healing any emotional wounds. If it comes to the point that bearing a child means that one will have to face that child, have that child reappear in one's life and be forced to explain or defend that decision decades later, the will tip the scales in favor of abortion.

You have been given life. You deserve nothing more, in my opinion.
 
People need to know about possible and genetic and birth problems. Will a person have MS, HIV, MD, Chrohns Disease, etc.

In the past it was just word of mouth, but now it medical testing and is good info to have.
 
Well, I disagree. I do not believe that children given up for adoption have the right to interrogate their biological parents for any reason. They could have been aborted; instead, they were carried to term and given to adoptive parents who desperately wanted children to raise. You resent that? You feel you have the right to answers? You don't. Sorry about that. You do not have the "right" to such interrogation, to such explanation. You were given life. Make the most of it instead of plotting how to wreak revenge on a desperate birth mother who faced her own worst nightmare, and managed to survive it.

Why do you think I resent that? Because I call them donors? The titles "mother" and "father" are earned in my opinion. Anyone can be a sperm/egg donor. It takes something more to be a parent.

Why do you think I want to "wreak revenge"?

Adoptive children do not have the right to barge into the lives of their birth parents 18 years later and demand an explanation. They simply do not.

Well, they should have the right. It's not too much to ask. How is the donor put out by it?

Hatred and sense of selfish entitlement simply gives credence to those who would choose abortion over adoption to prevent their lives from being torn asunder by resentful, bitter children too immature and self-absorbed to appreciate the quandry suffered by those who chose to give them life rather than oblivion. Narcissism and a total lack of empathy will never give peace to either the child or the birth parent that the child so desperately wants to punish. It only enforces the reality that bearing a child, no matter what the circumstance, from an unplanned pregnancy will create a cloud of destruction over one's entire life unless that pregnancy is terminated.

Why do you think that children would be resentful and bitter? You've ignored my points in previous posts. Instead you've inaccurately focused on what you perceive to be my bitterness. Now you are throwing out cheap insults such as immature, resentful, bitter, self-absorbed, and narcissistic. Now why would you do that?

Where do you get this narcissistic idea that the fruit of one's loins would create a "cloud of destruction over one's entire life"? It wouldn't. It's called a restraining order.

I'm pro-choice, but when the options faced are dire and more dire, then choice has been removed. A little gratitude toward one who has chosen to suffer the pain of pregnancy and childbirth to give one's offspring a chance would go a long way toward healing any emotional wounds. If it comes to the point that bearing a child means that one will have to face that child, have that child reappear in one's life and be forced to explain or defend that decision decades later, the will tip the scales in favor of abortion.

I just don't believe that someone who couldn't consider what their actions might bring about in 9 months are going to consider what will happen in 18 years. People don't get abortions because of fears about what will happen in 18 years. They do it for a myriad of reasons. But if they did choose to abort because they couldn't face their past in 18 years, that's okay too. Aborted fetuses aren't bitter, resentful, self-absorbed, narcissistic, and don't bring about clouds of destruction.

We don't have a people shortage on this planet. If I was aborted, I wouldn't be here to be upset about it.

You have been given life. You deserve nothing more, in my opinion.

And giving life to someone doesn't make them a parent.
 
I believe that if one has biological children somewhere in the world, one has a responsibility to them.
It doesn't matter if the law says one doesn't. Blood matters.
I think if one cannot see one's way clear to acknowledging one's biological children at any point in one's life, then one is better off not going through with the pregnancy. It's better.
Adoption does not need to be "made easier and more attractive" to pregnant women so that there will be less abortions.
There don't need to be less abortions.
People need to understand that creating new people and sending them out into the world is a massive responsibility, one that cannot be abdicated, even if the law says otherwise.
People who would deny their own blood don't need to have children.
They should have abortions.
Adoptive parents could then adopt one of the millions of children languishing in foster care, who need homes.
 
Why do you think I resent that? Because I call them donors? The titles "mother" and "father" are earned in my opinion. Anyone can be a sperm/egg donor. It takes something more to be a parent.

Why do you think I want to "wreak revenge"?

Just the tone of your posts, which are so different from your normal, upbeat postings. You sound resentful when you say that adoptive children are entitled to an explanation and have a right to demand one. I could be wrong... in fact you are telling me I'm wrong, so I will accept my error... but that's just how you have repeatedly come across.

Well, they should have the right. It's not too much to ask. How is the donor put out by it?

We disagree here. I've already given several examples of how the birth mother could be devastated by it.

Why do you think that children would be resentful and bitter? You've ignored my points in previous posts. Instead you've inaccurately focused on what you perceive to be my bitterness. Now you are throwing out cheap insults such as immature, resentful, bitter, self-absorbed, and narcissistic. Now why would you do that?

I apologize. I wasn't referring to you, but the way my post was worded may have given that impression. I do, however, know some adopted folks who are very bitter, resentful, self-absorbed and narcissistic. I know others who are emotionally shattered because their parents "didn't want them." This is a tough situation on both sides, and there is no single answer that is right for everyone in this position.

Where do you get this narcissistic idea that the fruit of one's loins would create a "cloud of destruction over one's entire life"? It wouldn't. It's called a restraining order.

Well, if either side is feeling threatened enough that a restraining order is necessary, I'd say that has created a cloud of destruction... and I'd further suggest the emotional impact would be there for a lifetime.

I just don't believe that someone who couldn't consider what their actions might bring about in 9 months are going to consider what will happen in 18 years. People don't get abortions because of fears about what will happen in 18 years. They do it for a myriad of reasons. But if they did choose to abort because they couldn't face their past in 18 years, that's okay too. Aborted fetuses aren't bitter, resentful, self-absorbed, narcissistic, and don't bring about clouds of destruction.

We don't have a people shortage on this planet. If I was aborted, I wouldn't be here to be upset about it.

True enough. I just don't think that we should make abortions more appealing that adoption, and removing the privacy restrictions will in some cases do just that.

And giving life to someone doesn't make them a parent.

That is absolutely true.

Again I apologize if you thought my examples were directed at you personally. They certainly were not. They were just that... examples... of how such a forced meeting could go horribly wrong, and the emotional aftermath of it.
 
True enough. I just don't think that we should make abortions more appealing that adoption, and removing the privacy restrictions will in some cases do just that.

Abortion and adoption are not equivalent options.
it's not about one being "more appealing" than the other.
One is an alternative to pregnancy. The other is an alternative to parenting.
In one, a child is involved, and in the other, no child is involved.

There is no reason for society to try to make adoption "more attractive", "more appealing", or "more convenient".

There is nothing particularly attractive or appealing about bringing a new person into this world, flesh of one's flesh and blood of one's blood, and then abdicating all responsibility to that person and denying that you have a biological child. Denying that to the child's very face, refusing to acknowledge your own biological child should he or she ever find you.

"Gift of life", my butt.

If you'd never been born, you wouldn't care. You wouldn't even know.

:?
 
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No, it's not that sermon. I'm fine with adoption. Is an explanation too much to ask.

Come on. I've read too many of your posts to believe you really believe this. It truly sounds like you resent being put up for adoption and cannot accept that your mother took that action with what's best for you in her mind.

As already stated, this is no simple issue. Think about how hard it must have been for your mom to part with you. Can you wrap your mind and emotions around that? I can't think of a harder decision to make.

Sometimes not knowing is thee best answer. Not perfect. Just the best. I sincerely hope you can come to terms with this. I am not attacking you. I feel for you.
 
Abortion and adoption are not equivalent options.
it's not about one being "more appealing" than the other.
One is an alternative to pregnancy. The other is an alternative to parenting.
In one, a child is involved, and in the other, no child is involved.

There is no reason for society to try to make adoption "more attractive", "more appealing", or "more convenient".

There is nothing particularly attractive or appealing about bringing a new person into this world, flesh of one's flesh and blood of one's blood, and then abdicating all responsibility to that person and denying that you have a biological child. Denying that to the child's very face, refusing to acknowledge your own biological child should he or she ever find you.

"Gift of life", my butt.

If you'd never been born, you wouldn't care. You wouldn't even know.

:?

Giving a child up for adoption is not a choice I would ever make with an unwanted pregnancy. I'd opt for abortion.

The thing is, I'm pro-choice... that means that I respect the choice to carry a child to term and give it up, if that is the choice the birth mother makes. It doesn't matter if she makes that choice because of religious convictions, personal beliefs, or her own moral compass. I support her choice. That's what pro-choice is all about.

A birth mother giving up a child for adoption is promised anonomity, unless she chooses to waive that in the future. Revoking that promise decades down the line is unfair, and a violation of her privacy. Officially revoking anonomity altogether puts undue pressure, in my opinion, on a woman who desperately does not want to be confronted by a "strange" child in the future, but who also does not believe in abortion. A woman contemplating that decision should not be pressured to decide between either to bearing a child she does not want knowing that there's a good chance she'll be confronted by that child in the future, or opting for an abortion she does not want in order to prevent that confrontation from happening.

BTW, I also believe that birth parents do not have the right to force a meeting with the children they gave up if those children do not want it.
 
Just the tone of your posts, which are so different from your normal, upbeat postings. You sound resentful when you say that adoptive children are entitled to an explanation and have a right to demand one. I could be wrong... in fact you are telling me I'm wrong, so I will accept my error... but that's just how you have repeatedly come across.

You haven't been around here very long. I have used this tone before. I just don't rag on the Bush administration anymore. :mrgreen:

I know several women who have given up kids because they don't want to stop partying. Now, I could buy how hard it is to give up their kid if they took steps to ensure they didn't have the same thing happen again. But they didn't. Instead they repeatedly get pregnant and give up their kids. If it were so heartbreaking for them, it wouldn't happen repeatedly. I don't buy their crocodile tears. Yes, the kids undoubtedly are better off with other people. But ultimately, these women run from responsibility at every chance. It's sickening. There are plenty of kids waiting to be adopted. They only add to the problem. It burns my ass that people want to protect their irresponsible ways.

We disagree here. I've already given several examples of how the birth mother could be devastated by it.

I think your rape example is the one with the most credence. But, it's not like these women forgot that they raped. You don't forget something like that. I don't mean to sound callous, but if they are still devastated by reminders of that 18 years later, they need professional help. The only way to overcome it is to face it head on. Avoiding it or ignoring it will not allow for healing.

I apologize. I wasn't referring to you, but the way my post was worded may have given that impression. I do, however, know some adopted folks who are very bitter, resentful, self-absorbed and narcissistic. I know others who are emotionally shattered because their parents "didn't want them." This is a tough situation on both sides, and there is no single answer that is right for everyone in this position.

Thanks for the apology. I apologize for misinterpreting your comments. But of those people you speak of, do they have a legitimate gripe? Were they abused. Their lifegivers made a decision that impacted their entire life. I don't believe that a decision like that should be made without any feedback on how that turned out.

Well, if either side is feeling threatened enough that a restraining order is necessary, I'd say that has created a cloud of destruction... and I'd further suggest the emotional impact would be there for a lifetime.

Or they could just be harrassing them for answers after they were told they weren't interested in talking. That isn't a cloud of destruction. I think the destruction scenario is not very common anyway. Life is serious. Your decisions have consequences. I don't believe people should be shielded from that.

True enough. I just don't think that we should make abortions more appealing that adoption, and removing the privacy restrictions will in some cases do just that.

I've already addressed this. People aren't going to think 18 years ahead. If they had that kind of planning in their life, they wouldn't be in the predicament that they are in. Obviously a rape victim (who rarely get pregnant) who wouldn't have an abortion normally isn't going to change their mind if they are going to live with a 9 month reminder of their trauma.

That is absolutely true.

Again I apologize if you thought my examples were directed at you personally. They certainly were not. They were just that... examples... of how such a forced meeting could go horribly wrong, and the emotional aftermath of it.

It's all good. Emotionally distressing things happen all the time. I see no reason to insulate people from this.
 
Come on. I've read too many of your posts to believe you really believe this. It truly sounds like you resent being put up for adoption and cannot accept that your mother took that action with what's best for you in her mind.

I am glad I was put up for adoption. I couldn't have asked for a better mother. I have nothing to resent. I haven't even tried to find my lifegiver. I resent irresponsible people who think they shouldn't be accountable for their actions.

As already stated, this is no simple issue. Think about how hard it must have been for your mom to part with you. Can you wrap your mind and emotions around that? I can't think of a harder decision to make.

I'm sure it might have been hard. From what I know, she was a large woman and no one knew she was pregnant. I also know that I have two older siblings. I don't begrudge her for her decision. If I was raised in a bad household, I might feel differently, but that isn't reality.

I think some might argue that having an abortion is a harder decision to make. I know a woman who had two abortions and then gave up two later children because she couldn't go through with another abortion.

Sometimes not knowing is thee best answer. Not perfect. Just the best. I sincerely hope you can come to terms with this. I am not attacking you. I feel for you.

You don't need to feel for me. I am a firm believer in reality. The truth will set you free. People who are emotionally unhealthy don't need protection. They need professional help.
 
Giving a child up for adoption is not a choice I would ever make with an unwanted pregnancy. I'd opt for abortion.

The thing is, I'm pro-choice... that means that I respect the choice to carry a child to term and give it up, if that is the choice the birth mother makes. It doesn't matter if she makes that choice because of religious convictions, personal beliefs, or her own moral compass. I support her choice. That's what pro-choice is all about.

A birth mother giving up a child for adoption is promised anonomity, unless she chooses to waive that in the future. Revoking that promise decades down the line is unfair, and a violation of her privacy. Officially revoking anonomity altogether puts undue pressure, in my opinion, on a woman who desperately does not want to be confronted by a "strange" child in the future, but who also does not believe in abortion. A woman contemplating that decision should not be pressured to decide between either to bearing a child she does not want knowing that there's a good chance she'll be confronted by that child in the future, or opting for an abortion she does not want in order to prevent that confrontation from happening.

BTW, I also believe that birth parents do not have the right to force a meeting with the children they gave up if those children do not want it.

I agree with your last ssentence.

But what is wrong with a woman facing their guilt? Sure, it may be "unsettling" at first, but in the long run, she'll be better for it.
 
I do agree, in theory, with some of the things Tucker said, but let's be honest, some birth parents don't want to be found, if they did, they'd be the ones making the effort.

If you give up your child for adoption you also give up your rights to contact with the child. In effect, you are nothing more than any other citizen to the child. So, if you then try to contact the child you could be prosecuted for harassment just as any other ordinary citizen would who tries to trace someone else's child.

This is unfortunate for those very few fathers who may discover (years after the adoption has happened) that they fathered a child from a one night stand but that is another risk from unprotected sex.

-- I think that, at the time of adoption, the birth parents should be able to opt in or out of being contacted later, say at age 18. If the parents are amenable to being contacted, the adopted child is given that information, if not, they are not. Seems simple enough.

Many people don't know how they would react if the child contacts them however the child should be allowed to find out about their bio-parents for the very reasons Tucker stated. As for contact - that should be up to the parties involved once initial letters / contact has been exchanged. There are already harassment and other protective laws around if one party chooses not to have further involvement.
 
If you give up your child for adoption you also give up your rights to contact with the child. In effect, you are nothing more than any other citizen to the child. So, if you then try to contact the child you could be prosecuted for harassment just as any other ordinary citizen would who tries to trace someone else's child.

Yes, you're right. But by the same token, a child who goes out and tries to find their birth parents can suffer the same fate if the parents don't wish to be found.

This is unfortunate for those very few fathers who may discover (years after the adoption has happened) that they fathered a child from a one night stand but that is another risk from unprotected sex.

I can't say I'm particularly sorry for them, if you're a moron, you deserve what you get.

Many people don't know how they would react if the child contacts them however the child should be allowed to find out about their bio-parents for the very reasons Tucker stated. As for contact - that should be up to the parties involved once initial letters / contact has been exchanged. There are already harassment and other protective laws around if one party chooses not to have further involvement.

So long as it's handled respectfully and the wishes of both parties are respected, I haven't got a problem with it. However, the way it was presented, that the children have an automatic right to make any kind of contact they want with their parents whether the parents want that contact or not is ludicrous. If both parties are amenable to the contact, then by all means, knock yourself out.
 
--I can't say I'm particularly sorry for them, if you're a moron, you deserve what you get.

It isn't always as simple or clear as that however, I'd forgotten that in the UK the laws changed in 1992 so that mothers couldn't give their kids up for adoption unless they sought and found the father to agree. Before this, women could simply make the unilateral decision to give up a child's rights and the father's.

So it wasn't just one night stands, it was also men in married and long term couples who'd split during pregnancy this happened to. It was ridiculously easy for a mother to walk into an adoption center and hand the child over even when her ex-husband or ex partner wanted to raise the child himself.

Your point about a man who has unprotected sex stands however "moron" is wrong when you consider the child's rights being given up.

-- So long as it's handled respectfully and the wishes of both parties are respected, I haven't got a problem with it. However, the way it was presented, that the children have an automatic right to make any kind of contact they want with their parents whether the parents want that contact or not is ludicrous. If both parties are amenable to the contact, then by all means, knock yourself out.

There we are in agreement, I don't think that anyone - whether adopted or raised by birth parents have any automatic right to contact with anyone who has no wish for further contact.
 
There we are in agreement, I don't think that anyone - whether adopted or raised by birth parents have any automatic right to contact with anyone who has no wish for further contact.

Independent Thinker was saying exactly that, that an adopted child had a right to contact their birth parents regardless of the parent's wishes.
 
Independent Thinker was saying exactly that, that an adopted child had a right to contact their birth parents regardless of the parent's wishes.

Yes, I did.
 
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