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Is the fat acceptance movement good for society?

Thoughts?

  • Yes, it's good for society and isn't hurting young people.

    Votes: 4 6.5%

  • It's good and bad.

    Votes: 18 29.0%

  • It's bad for society. We shouldn't teach young people to be happy with obesity.

    Votes: 33 53.2%

  • Other

    Votes: 7 11.3%
  • Total voters
    62
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dex4974 said:
The United States and other developed countries have obesity rates that are increasing at an alarming speed. Is fat acceptance teaching young people that it's okay to not control your eating habits? Is it teaching young people that it's okay to be undisciplined? We teach young people that it's bad to smoke because it's unhealthy and can hurt them. Is the same not true of obesity?

In my view respecting and loving yourself means taking care of your body and keeping it healthy. It means having disciplined behavior.
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It is good and bad. It is good that people are less likely to be shamed for no real reason and it is based because weight has linked to worse health consequences over time.

Really, we should be looking at alternatives to traditional weight loss, such as Keto or Paleo which is showing to be more effective as we learn more about how the human body processes sugar and the various hormone responses surrounding that.
 
dex4974 said:
It sounds like this topic is quite sensitive for you. I won't continue our disagreement but to say that fat people do impact the whole of society and even the planet. Our healthcare infrastructure is inundated with fat people that could have avoided being there with better life choices. That costs us tax dollars, efficiency in healthcare and it raises insurance costs for everybody. Also human overconsumption is destroying wildlife the world over, so don't tell me fat people aren't hurting anybody but themselves. That's false.
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It is not sensitive for me at all... I am in great shape and very healthy.

Human over-consumption is not the argument here... that is just a Red Herring.

As is the healthcare structure... Red Herring.

I made a pretty common sense statement that fat people are not harming anybody but themselves... same with drivers, or are you going to counter that drivers are responsible for millions of death and contribute to Global Warming now?
 
tacomancer said:
It is good and bad. It is good that people are less likely to be shamed for no real reason and it is based because weight has linked to worse health consequences over time.

Really, we should be looking at alternatives to traditional weight loss, such as Keto or Paleo which is showing to be more effective as we learn more about how the human body processes sugar and the various hormone responses surrounding that.
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No one is saying that alternative methods of weight loss should not be explored. Anything that works is good. We are saying that obesity is killing millions of American, making the quality of life worse for millions of Americans and costing us all more for healthcare. Anything this harmful should not be accepted.

It is more harmful than cigarettes. Would you say "let the kid smoke he is only hurting himself"?

It is more harmful than firearms. Would you say "let the kid play with the gun, he will only shoot himself"?

It is more harmful than heroin. Would you say "let the kid shoot up, what the heck?

No to all of the above. Harmful behavior is to be discouraged. Peer pressure is often the best method of getting through to young people. It is time to stop making excuses and start some tough love. I know dozens of people who have owned up to their weight problem and took the steps necessary to correct it. You won't find a one of them who says I sure wish I hadn't lost all that weight. Every one of them says I look better now, I feel better now, I have more energy, life is better.

Like it or not shaming works.
 
BahamaBob said:
No one is saying that alternative methods of weight loss should not be explored. Anything that works is good. We are saying that obesity is killing millions of American, making the quality of life worse for millions of Americans and costing us all more for healthcare. Anything this harmful should not be accepted.

It is more harmful than cigarettes. Would you say "let the kid smoke he is only hurting himself"?

It is more harmful than firearms. Would you say "let the kid play with the gun, he will only shoot himself"?

It is more harmful than heroin. Would you say "let the kid shoot up, what the heck?

No to all of the above. Harmful behavior is to be discouraged. Peer pressure is often the best method of getting through to young people. It is time to stop making excuses and start some tough love. I know dozens of people who have owned up to their weight problem and took the steps necessary to correct it. You won't find a one of them who says I sure wish I hadn't lost all that weight. Every one of them says I look better now, I feel better now, I have more energy, life is better.

Like it or not shaming works.
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You are talking to a guy who has lost almost 100 lbs and now does 5k's
 
Bodhisattva said:
I made a pretty common sense statement that fat people are not harming anybody but themselves
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Your common sense statement is objectively false. Ask any medical professional about the impact fat people have on our healthcare system, or better yet go read some of the studies. You're wrong. Fat people are hurting and holding back our species in multiple ways, and it's getting worse.
 
noonereal said:
what does "fat acceptance" mean?

For example, if you do not accept "fat" people do you mean you then ridicule them or even throw stones at them?
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It is an odd phrase.
 
dex4974 said:
Your common sense statement is objectively false. Ask any medical professional about the impact fat people have on our healthcare system, or better yet go read some of the studies. You're wrong. Fat people are hurting and holding back our species in multiple ways, and it's getting worse.
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Then you make my point that you are about fat shaming and your whole, "i want to help them" line is bull****.
 
Bodhisattva said:
Then you make my point that you are about fat shaming and your whole, "i want to help them" line is bull****.
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No, I am about contradicting blatant nonsense such as "Fat people are not hurting anybody." I also never said I want to help them; they need to help themselves. I just don't like SJWs giving fat people more reasons to give up on getting healthier.
 
dex4974 said:
No, I am about contradicting blatant nonsense such as "Fat people are not hurting anybody." I also never said I want to help them; they need to help themselves. I just don't like SJWs giving fat people more reasons to give up on getting healthier.
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Fat people are not hurting anybody... your examples did not show any evidence of that.
 
Bodhisattva said:
Fat people are not hurting anybody... your examples did not show any evidence of that.
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You're in denial. There are countless studies that back up my claims.

Hurting healthcare

Three ways obesity is affecting the entire healthcare system

Increasing Obesity Rates Put Strain on Healthcare Workers - Knowledge at Work

Obesity puts more strain on health services than smoking – The Insiders' Guide to Expatriate Health

Obesity placing strain on NHS

https://www.nursinginpractice.com/overweight-putting-strain-health-services

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=111302222

------

Hurting the planet

https://www.inquisitr.com/257410/obesity-hurting-our-planet-possibly-more-than-overpopulation-study/

https://www.niehs.nih.gov/health/materials/obesity_and_the_environment_508.pdf

https://www.chicagotribune.com/busi...e-hurting-fuel-efficiency-20121008-story.html

https://greentumble.com/the-negative-effects-of-consumerism/

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ea...climate-change-says-Sir-Jonathan-Porritt.html

https://www.treehugger.com/green-living-4846055
 
dex4974 said:
You're in denial. There are countless studies that back up my claims.

Hurting healthcare

Three ways obesity is affecting the entire healthcare system

Increasing Obesity Rates Put Strain on Healthcare Workers - Knowledge at Work

Obesity puts more strain on health services than smoking – The Insiders' Guide to Expatriate Health

Obesity placing strain on NHS

https://www.nursinginpractice.com/overweight-putting-strain-health-services

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=111302222

------

Hurting the planet

https://www.inquisitr.com/257410/obesity-hurting-our-planet-possibly-more-than-overpopulation-study/

https://www.niehs.nih.gov/health/materials/obesity_and_the_environment_508.pdf

https://www.chicagotribune.com/busi...e-hurting-fuel-efficiency-20121008-story.html

https://greentumble.com/the-negative-effects-of-consumerism/

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ea...climate-change-says-Sir-Jonathan-Porritt.html

https://www.treehugger.com/green-living-4846055
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Fat people are not hurting people... the healthcare system is not people... and fat people are not hurting the planet as much as cars, planes, ships, over fishing, diverting water away from rivers to places in the middle of the desert like Las Vegas or for Palm Springs golf courses... or people eating too much sugar or killing people in auto accidents (that is actually hurting people) but I bet that yo udrive a car, right? You are hurting people. Sorry.
 
Bodhisattva said:
Fat people are not hurting people... the healthcare system is not people... and fat people are not hurting the planet as much as cars, planes, ships, over fishing, diverting water away from rivers to places in the middle of the desert like Las Vegas or for Palm Springs golf courses... or people eating too much sugar or killing people in auto accidents (that is actually hurting people) but I bet that yo udrive a car, right? You are hurting people. Sorry.
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You are in intense denial. Additional strain on the healthcare system hurts everybody. People rely on our healthcare system, so yes, obese people are impacting more than just themselves with their bad decisions. Our entire society is being negatively impacted by obesity. Also having a car is a somewhat necessary evil for a lot of people; being fat is not necessary.
 
dex4974 said:
You are in intense denial. Additional strain on the healthcare system hurts everybody. People rely on our healthcare system, so yes, obese people are impacting more than just themselves with their bad decisions. Our entire society is being negatively impacted by obesity.
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Who does not get to have health care as a result of fat people?

Also having a car is a somewhat necessary evil for a lot of people; being fat is not necessary.
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Justification. Car drivers literally kill tens of thousands of Americans each year. Fat Amy and Friends kill zero.

Your hurting the planet argument is ridiculous.
 
Bodhisattva said:
Who does not get to have health care as a result of fat people?
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Quality of available healthcare goes down with more strain. You obviously did not read the many credible links I provided for you. I'm not surprised that you're not actually interested in seeing evidence that contradicts what you believe.

Bodhisattva said:
Justification. Car drivers literally kill tens of thousands of Americans each year. Fat Amy and Friends kill zero.
Click to expand...

I am actually floored by how absurd your arguments are. I'm quite sure I'll never get through. You're not worth any more of my effort.

Bodhisattva said:
Your hurting the planet argument is ridiculous.
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It's not my argument. It's the argument of scientists and healthcare professionals.
 
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dex4974 said:
Quality of available healthcare goes down with more strain. You obviously did not read the many credible links I provided for you. I'm not surprised that you're not actually interested in seeing evidence that contradicts what you believe.
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What is really hurting the health care system is not fat people. It is for profit hospitals, ridiculously high drug and surgical costs, Doctors and Nurses making a ton of money compared to their colleagues around the world, reactive and defensive medical systems, etc. Do fat people put a strain on the healthcare system? Perhaps.. . but a lot less than car drivers do. Then there are smokers, drug addicts, etc.

I am actually floored by how absurd your arguments are. I'm quite sure I'll never get through. You're not worth any more of my effort.
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I goes to show how weak your argument is and where your real concern lies...

30,000 + people are killed in America by car drivers each year.

Fat people are not killing anybody... because they are fat.

It's not my argument. It's the argument of scientists and healthcare professionals.
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I read your first link: Obesity Hurting Our Planet Possibly More Than Overpopulation [Study]

Nothing much of how fat people are hurting the planet. Nothing substantial or with any real evidence, at least.

I pointed out things that are really hurting the planet... and you ignored them. :shrug:
 
Bodhisattva said:
What is really hurting the health care system is not fat people. It is for profit hospitals, ridiculously high drug and surgical costs, Doctors and Nurses making a ton of money compared to their colleagues around the world, reactive and defensive medical systems, etc. Do fat people put a strain on the healthcare system? Perhaps.. . but a lot less than car drivers do. Then there are smokers, drug addicts, etc.



I goes to show how weak your argument is and where your real concern lies...

30,000 + people are killed in America by car drivers each year.

Fat people are not killing anybody... because they are fat.



I read your first link: Obesity Hurting Our Planet Possibly More Than Overpopulation [Study]

Nothing much of how fat people are hurting the planet. Nothing substantial or with any real evidence, at least.

I pointed out things that are really hurting the planet... and you ignored them. :shrug:
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:lamo
 
dex4974 said:
:lamo
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wow... that was easy. I should have just posted facts from the beginning. anyway... better luck next time, I guess.
 
dex4974 said:
Convincing yourself that you're winning online debates seems important to you.
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No convincing needed... once the debate is clearly over and the other guy (you) laughs off facts... well. :shrug:
 
dex4974 said:
The United States and other developed countries have obesity rates that are increasing at an alarming speed. Is fat acceptance teaching young people that it's okay to not control your eating habits? Is it teaching young people that it's okay to be undisciplined? We teach young people that it's bad to smoke because it's unhealthy and can hurt them. Is the same not true of obesity?

In my view respecting and loving yourself means taking care of your body and keeping it healthy. It means having disciplined behavior.
Click to expand...

The somewhat overused phrase: "It is what it is", is applicable here.
If people are supposed to know about physiological health, they have to receive the knowledge from somewhere.
Expecting social media and apologia groups to provide adequate knowledge is beyond stupid. If people don't make a genuine effort to educate themselves and their offspring, they are 100% free to die from their own lifestyle choices without anyone being required to as much as raise an eyebrow on their behalf.
 
dex4974 said:
The United States and other developed countries have obesity rates that are increasing at an alarming speed. Is fat acceptance teaching young people that it's okay to not control your eating habits? Is it teaching young people that it's okay to be undisciplined? We teach young people that it's bad to smoke because it's unhealthy and can hurt them. Is the same not true of obesity?

In my view respecting and loving yourself means taking care of your body and keeping it healthy. It means having disciplined behavior.
Click to expand...

There are people who are predisposed to be being morbidly obese...and then there are those who gain weight by eating/drinking poorly with little to no physical activity. In any event, I don't think we should celebrate it, but at the same time, shame it either.

The problem is largely American. It is because we have an abundance of processed food. And an aversion to physical activity. As well as a political group who start screaming about the encroachment of rights when schools and certain institutions follow health guidelines and serve healthier food with more physical activities instead of letting people chose to eat cheesypoofs and sit at the laptop getting mad at Michelle Obama.....

Many other nations (not all) have cuisines that are based on far more nutritional items like Greece. Or have elements of their cuisine that goes back centuries so you can have a good choice of processed food or a national dish that most will choose over eating poorly. We don't really have that.

We DO have American cuisine after a fashion, but it tends not to be that healthy. However...if you look at 18th century recipes like I have, you can find some pretty savory and tasty stuff that can also be healthy for you. I've lost about ten pounds over the past few weeks by simply eating better an incorporating these dishes in my diet.

So, if you are history buff and/or want to try some different ways to make food check this guy out: YouTube .
 
dex4974 said:
The United States and other developed countries have obesity rates that are increasing at an alarming speed. Is fat acceptance teaching young people that it's okay to not control your eating habits? Is it teaching young people that it's okay to be undisciplined? We teach young people that it's bad to smoke because it's unhealthy and can hurt them. Is the same not true of obesity?

In my view respecting and loving yourself means taking care of your body and keeping it healthy. It means having disciplined behavior.
Click to expand...

I picked, 'both'. You can be very active, be a healthnut about what you put into your body, and still be thicker than what you would like to be, as everyone's metabolism and family history.is differet. I don't think people should feel bad about this, and regardless of habits, people are going to end up being different shapes and sizes. That said, this isn't an excuse to just say, '**** it' and ignore health and fitness altogether. I say be content with your body, but don't let that be an excuse to stop being concerned, and to stop trying.

This commercial I've been seeing lately has this big gall dancing around half-naked while eating some sort of food product. I'm not a chubby-chaser, but she's what I would consider to be a 'BBW', but the product itself doesn't seem to be marketed as a healthy alternative to anything, so intentional or not, it's implying that you can and should eat as much of this product as you want and that you shouldn't worry about getting any bigger. I could be dead-wrong about this ad, but if I'm not . . . yowzer, what an irresponsible message.
 
BahamaBob said:
You are what you eat. Eat garbage, become garbage. It is not hard to understand. If you are a lazy twit and load up on processed food, you can only blame yourself for being a fat creep. Lard butts like all losers always have someone or something else to blame. People who go to the gym and are fit are eating the same food (in less quantity) as the lard butts. Why don't your hormones and gut bacteria affect them? I have five sons. When they were young and wanted a snack they got an apple. They ate balanced meals and played competitive sports. None of them are fat. They have too much pride to let their bodies go to seed. My grandkids are the same way. Instead of watching TV they are playing soccer. Most kids today spend their free time playing a video game or dinking with their Iphone while cramming down chips and candy bars. They will grow up to be lard butts with a dozen excuses just like you.

Take a trip over to France or Germany, you will rarely see a lard butt who isn't an American Tourist. You will also notice the people there walk and ride bikes instead of taking a car everywhere.

Go pump your fairy tale to someone else. I know better.
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I think you are a bit misinformed. About a quarter of the German population is obese with over 60% being overweight.
France is better at about 1 in 10 people being obese
While it is true America is the worst, most of the 1st world countries are struggling with this to varying degrees.
 
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