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Are you worried about voter fraud in this year's presidential primaries and election?

Are you worried about voter fraud in this year's presidential primaries and election?

  • Total voters
    16
Josie said:
These are two top news stories today:

Russia is looking to help Trump win in 2020, election security official told lawmakers - CNNPolitics

Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times

Are you worried about voter fraud tied to Russia? Why or why not?
Click to expand...

Every intelligence agency we have has confirmed Russian interference. No reason to think they won't again. At this point I don't think they care about Trump winning as much as they do about creating further divisions in the US. Trump winning divides America further, but more than that their presence undermines the election integrity and will incite and divide people further. I think they want it to be known, and I think they will be blatant about it. It will ensure more infighting in the US. United we stand, divided we fall. Russia has much to gain by the US falling.
 
Voter fraud has never been a problem in America. Remember the commission djt set up to investigate...they found nothing. I am worried about foreign interference.
 
Josie said:
These are two top news stories today:

Russia is looking to help Trump win in 2020, election security official told lawmakers - CNNPolitics

Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times

Are you worried about voter fraud tied to Russia? Why or why not?
Click to expand...

Who wouldn't be if they could analyze correctly the facts:

Talk about minds being exploited, by Russian intelligence. I have to admit the Russians are slick. The 'intelligence brief' claims Russian
intentions to disrupt the Democratic primaries & that meddling is already working out.
to perfection. Not since the Roosevelt years have Russians found a candidate to their liking.

Henry Wallace who was Roosevelt's VP & challenged Truman in '48 condemned US moves to establish world domination, especially directed against Russia.
Like the new Russian fanboy, Wallace viewed capitalists as not being interested in production to benefit the peoples of the world or even their own people.
They are interested only in profits.

Obviously for all to see they are throwing out feelers that they intend to interfere in the elections on behalf of Trump knowing full well like
Trump knew, that this 'false flag' would be highlighted by the Democrats & hurt Trump's election chances. Smart move by the Russians
to get the first truly Russian asset into the White house
 
mrjurrs said:
Voter fraud has never been a problem in America. Remember the commission djt set up to investigate...they found nothing. I am worried about foreign interference.
Click to expand...


What's disappointing is that instead of at least seriously considering Trump's charge, many media reports merely parrot leftist talking points and anti-Trump
rhetoric by pushing the idea that Republicans and others not of the progressive left who seek to limit voting to citizens only are racist, xenophobic nuts.

The only problem is, a study in 2014 in the online Electoral Studies Journal made a quite similar claim: In the 2008 and 2010 elections, they said, as
many as 2.8 million illegal noncitizen votes were cast, "enough to change meaningful election outcomes including Electoral College votes and congressional
elections," said the study, authored by Jesse T. Richman and Gushan A. Chattha, both of Old Dominion University, and David C. Earnest of George Mason University.

The bombshell was this: "Noncitizen votes likely gave Senate Democrats the pivotal 60th vote needed to overcome filibusters in order
to pass health care reform and other Obama administration priorities in the 111th Congress.”
 
mrjurrs said:
Voter fraud has never been a problem in America. Remember the commission djt set up to investigate...they found nothing. I am worried about foreign interference.
Click to expand...
That term may not have been the most accurate one for the OP to use.

I think the broader 'electoral fraud' may be the right one.

idk
 
slick said:
What's disappointing is that instead of at least seriously considering Trump's charge, many media reports merely parrot leftist talking points and anti-Trump
rhetoric by pushing the idea that Republicans and others not of the progressive left who seek to limit voting to citizens only are racist, xenophobic nuts.

The only problem is, a study in 2014 in the online Electoral Studies Journal made a quite similar claim: In the 2008 and 2010 elections, they said, as
many as 2.8 million illegal noncitizen votes were cast, "enough to change meaningful election outcomes including Electoral College votes and congressional
elections," said the study, authored by Jesse T. Richman and Gushan A. Chattha, both of Old Dominion University, and David C. Earnest of George Mason University.

The bombshell was this: "Noncitizen votes likely gave Senate Democrats the pivotal 60th vote needed to overcome filibusters in order
to pass health care reform and other Obama administration priorities in the 111th Congress.”
Click to expand...

I tried to look that up.
But the paper was withdrawn.

Do you know why?
 
slick said:
What's disappointing is that instead of at least seriously considering Trump's charge, many media reports merely parrot leftist talking points and anti-Trump
rhetoric by pushing the idea that Republicans and others not of the progressive left who seek to limit voting to citizens only are racist, xenophobic nuts.

The only problem is, a study in 2014 in the online Electoral Studies Journal made a quite similar claim: In the 2008 and 2010 elections, they said, as
many as 2.8 million illegal noncitizen votes were cast, "enough to change meaningful election outcomes including Electoral College votes and congressional
elections," said the study, authored by Jesse T. Richman and Gushan A. Chattha, both of Old Dominion University, and David C. Earnest of George Mason University.

The bombshell was this: "Noncitizen votes likely gave Senate Democrats the pivotal 60th vote needed to overcome filibusters in order
to pass health care reform and other Obama administration priorities in the 111th Congress.”
Click to expand...

aww, man.
oh, bummer.

One of the authors says that Trumpco et al are actively misrepresenting his research.
Who would believe that a politician like Trump would misrepresent facts?

Seriously, who believes trumpco et al would misrepresent this?

Author of Trump's Favorite Voter Fraud Study Says Everyone's Wrong | WIRED
That was Richman's research, all right. The problem, says Richman, who identifies as a political moderate, is that the Trump administration's interpretation of his report is totally off. "Trump and others have been misreading our research and exaggerating our results to make claims we don't think our research supports," Richman says. "I'm not sure why they continue to do it, but there’s not much I can do about that aside from set the record straight."
But Richman is unequivocal that even if his findings are correct, Clinton would have still handily won the popular vote in November, despite the new president's claims.
"I can't quite account for the math being so badly wrong in their analyses," he says of the Trump administration's interpretation of his report.
​
 
Josie said:
These are two top news stories today:

Russia is looking to help Trump win in 2020, election security official told lawmakers - CNNPolitics

Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times

Are you worried about voter fraud tied to Russia? Why or why not?
Click to expand...

The last time they looked - for five years under Bush - they came up with a hair over 130 cases nationwide, ultimately getting only 87 convicted. Those were also mainly votes in local elections, not federal elections.

In 5-Year Effort, Scant Evidence of Voter Fraud - The New York Times

And most of the reports of sporadic voter fraud are about GOP behavior, whether it's the party organization or it's some woman voting twice for Trump because she felt the need to "fight voter fraud" (no, really, that happened).

It simply isn't the huge deal Fox/GOP has been saying. As with just about anything else they report, it's sensationalist crap designed to appeal to fear of brown people. The same people who insisted that millions of illegals voted for Trump simply because he told them to say it.
 
Last edited:
I am worried about republican voter suppression

And

Voter Stupidity

Media will be loaded with russian trolls and other BS got to be smart enough to see through it
 
Josie said:
These are two top news stories today:

Russia is looking to help Trump win in 2020, election security official told lawmakers - CNNPolitics

Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times

Are you worried about voter fraud tied to Russia? Why or why not?
Click to expand...

I'm not worried about Russian voter fraud but I am concerned about American voter fraud. For Russia to manipulate the election they would have to hack voter tabulation programs and as long as there is a paper ballot to back the vote totals up that kind of manipulation could easily be discovered. American voter fraud, however, can be committed by allowing ineligible voters to cast a ballot, "harvesting" ballots from voters who have no idea what they're voting for (ie. dementia patients and the mentally ill) and voting in multiple states.

The so called "massive" Russian voter fraud of 2016 appears to have revolved around social media advertising. I have a hard time wrapping my head around how that can be too manipulative as our own candidates spend millions upon millions of dollars on equally misleading advertisements.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
aww, man.
oh, bummer.

One of the authors says that Trumpco et al are actively misrepresenting his research.
Who would believe that a politician like Trump would misrepresent facts?

Seriously, who believes trumpco et al would misrepresent this?

Author of Trump's Favorite Voter Fraud Study Says Everyone's Wrong | WIRED
That was Richman's research, all right. The problem, says Richman, who identifies as a political moderate, is that the Trump administration's interpretation of his report is totally off. "Trump and others have been misreading our research and exaggerating our results to make claims we don't think our research supports," Richman says. "I'm not sure why they continue to do it, but there’s not much I can do about that aside from set the record straight."
But Richman is unequivocal that even if his findings are correct, Clinton would have still handily won the popular vote in November, despite the new president's claims.
"I can't quite account for the math being so badly wrong in their analyses," he says of the Trump administration's interpretation of his report.
​
Click to expand...

In 2014, a disturbing study was released by political scientists at Old Dominion University. Their work showed that a
significant percentage of foreign nationals residing in the United States, whether lawfully or unlawfully present, were
registered to vote in US elections—and that a significant number of them actually have voted in recent years—6.4 percent
in 2008 and 2.2 percent in 2010. That is enough to have swayed election outcomes in some states: “there is reason
to believe non-citizen voting changed one state’s Electoral College votes in 2008, delivering North Carolina to Obama,
and that non-citizen votes have also led to Democratic victories in congressional races including a critical 2008
Sen- ate race [in Minnesota] that delivered for Democrats a 60-vote filibuster-proof majority in the Senate.” It is, of course,
illegal for noncitizens to vote in federal and state elections. But this study suggests that hundreds of thousands of illegal votes
may have been cast in the United States in every federal election


illegal voting | USA Gov Policywww.usagovpolicy.com › tag › illegal-voting

Noncitizens, Voting Violations and U.S. Elections
 
Last edited:
slick said:
In 2014, a disturbing study was released by political scientists at Old Dominion University. Their work showed that a
significant percentage of foreign nationals residing in the United States, whether lawfully or unlawfully present, were
registered to vote in US elections—and that a significant number of them actually have voted in recent years—6.4 percent
in 2008 and 2.2 percent in 2010. That is enough to have swayed election outcomes in some states: “there is reason
to believe non-citizen voting changed one state’s Electoral College votes in 2008, delivering North Carolina to Obama,
and that non-citizen votes have also led to Democratic victories in congressional races including a critical 2008
Sen- ate race [in Minnesota] that delivered for Democrats a 60-vote filibuster-proof majority in the Senate.” It is, of course,
illegal for noncitizens to vote in federal and state elections. But this study suggests that hundreds of thousands of illegal votes
may have been cast in the United States in every federal election
illegal voting | USA Gov Policywww.usagovpolicy.com › tag › illegal-voting
Noncitizens, Voting Violations and U.S. Elections
Click to expand...

Have you failed to understand that I am quoting the study's author speaking about this study?

Author of Trump's Favorite Voter Fraud Study Says Everyone's Wrong | WIRED
That was Richman's research, all right. The problem, says Richman, who identifies as a political moderate, is that the Trump administration's interpretation of his report is totally off. "Trump and others have been misreading our research and exaggerating our results to make claims we don't think our research supports," Richman says. "I'm not sure why they continue to do it, but there’s not much I can do about that aside from set the record straight."
But Richman is unequivocal that even if his findings are correct, Clinton would have still handily won the popular vote in November, despite the new president's claims.
"I can't quite account for the math being so badly wrong in their analyses," he says of the Trump administration's interpretation of his report.
​
 
Simon W. Moon said:
Have you failed to understand that I am quoting the study's author speaking about this study?

Author of Trump's Favorite Voter Fraud Study Says Everyone's Wrong | WIRED
That was Richman's research, all right. The problem, says Richman, who identifies as a political moderate, is that the Trump administration's interpretation of his report is totally off. "Trump and others have been misreading our research and exaggerating our results to make claims we don't think our research supports," Richman says. "I'm not sure why they continue to do it, but there’s not much I can do about that aside from set the record straight."
But Richman is unequivocal that even if his findings are correct, Clinton would have still handily won the popular vote in November, despite the new president's claims.
"I can't quite account for the math being so badly wrong in their analyses," he says of the Trump administration's interpretation of his report.
​
Click to expand...

Agreed Trump's interpretation of his report is totally off, Trump embellishes things. Regardless you miss the point of the thread which
is that significant voter fraud exists, & in certain disputes has altered the victor in some political races throughout recent times.
Mrs. Clinto still would have won the popular vote agreed but it would not have been by 2,700,000


Look, Let's go to California where Clinton got all the votes she needs for a plurality:
Clinton 8,753,798
Trump 4,483,810

So Clinton won the plurality one state California by 4,270,000 votes
While Trump won the plurality in the other 49 states combined by over 1,500,000 votes

The Democrats received 5 million more votes in in 2016 than they did in 1980
while the Republicans received the same amount no increase since 1980, I wonder
why. In bizarroville California where people with driver liscenses become voter
eligible could it be that of those 5 million more DEM votes a certain number are from the
huge waves of illegals since 1980 who are sheltered in this odd sanctuary state.
 
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Josie said:
These are two top news stories today:

Russia is looking to help Trump win in 2020, election security official told lawmakers - CNNPolitics

Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times

Are you worried about voter fraud tied to Russia? Why or why not?
Click to expand...

Not that tied to Russia, no.

Just plain home-grown voter fraud.

There are several types which pop up form time to time.

1. Absentee ballots for senior citizens, especially those in group home care. IMO this is one of the most prevalent, where a personal assistant/CNA who is "motivated" will have one or more senior's sign the form and then "fill it out for them."

2. Dead voters. From time to time these still seem to pop up, i.e. someone who is still on the voting rolls although dead...voting.

3. Illegal immigrant voting. From time to time we hear of some incident where illegals were on the voting rolls, and where some did vote.

I also often wonder where all sorts of "uncounted ballots" suddenly appear, as with certain counties in Florida (2016 and 2000).

I am not concerned about Russian voter fraud. Not enough systems (if any) set up to be both completely electronic and accessible from outside means.
 
Josie said:
These are two top news stories today:

Russia is looking to help Trump win in 2020, election security official told lawmakers - CNNPolitics

Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times

Are you worried about voter fraud tied to Russia? Why or why not?
Click to expand...

There hasn't been evidence of widespread voter fraud in nearly 100 years.

Its just one or two people here and there and not enough to statistically alter results.

The Russia issue is more about poorly informed voters being influenced by false information. However, it is still one person, one vote.
 
Lucky 1 said:
This is about the most ridiculous thing ever!!!! Nobody with a brain believes the Ruskies would prefer to have Donald Trump President over "Comrade Bernie"
Click to expand...

Umm, the russians haven't been communist for about 30 years now ...

You should google the term "fall of the berlin wall"
 
slick said:
Agreed Trump's interpretation of his report is totally off, Trump embellishes things. Regardless you miss the point of the thread which
is that significant voter fraud exists, & in certain disputes has altered the victor in some political races throughout recent times.
Mrs. Clinto still would have won the popular vote agreed but it would not have been by 2,700,000
Look, Let's go to California where Clinton got all the votes she needs for a plurality:
Clinton 8,753,798
Trump 4,483,810
So Clinton won the plurality one state California by 4,270,000 votes
While Trump won the plurality in the other 49 states combined by over 1,500,000 votes
The Democrats received 5 million more votes in in 2016 than they did in 1980
while the Republicans received the same amount no increase since 1980, I wonder
why. In bizarroville California where people with driver liscenses become voter
eligible could it be that of those 5 million more DEM votes a certain number are from the
huge waves of illegals since 1980 who are sheltered in this odd sanctuary state.
Click to expand...
There's some doubt if the study's numbers are even accurate.
And if they were accurate,
the study's author says they from too small of a sample to extrapolate from.

But, even if we do extrapolate from these numbers,
the number of this sort of illegal votes would be 835k across the nation with about 140k being in CA.
So, this questionable illegal alien conspiracy would've been responsible for at most 3% of the difference between Clinton's numbers and Trump's in California.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
There's some doubt if the study's numbers are even accurate.
And if they were accurate,
the study's author says they from too small of a sample to extrapolate from.

But, even if we do extrapolate from these numbers,
the number of this sort of illegal votes would be 835k across the nation with about 140k being in CA.
So, this questionable illegal alien conspiracy would've been responsible for at most 3% of the difference between Clinton's numbers and Trump's in California.
Click to expand...

Agreed, that's the assessment of my last reply. Voter fraud is a problem that's my only contention:
small text of one of many examples. illegal voting | USA Gov Policy

A 2004 study by the Federation for American Immigration Reform noted:

“There is evidence that noncitizens are being registered and casting votes, but due to the laxity in checking the eligibility of registrants and voters the full extent of the problem is not known. One of the most extensively documented cases of illegal voting was in California in 1996. Loretta Sanchez, a Democrat, defeated Republican incumbent Robert Dornan by 984 votes. Dornan called for an investigation of alleged illegal voting by noncitizens. According to Congressional Quarterly…’Task force Chairman [U.S. Representative] Vernon J. Ehlers, R-Mich., said investigators had found concrete evidence of 748 illegal votes by noncitizens…’“A lack of attention to the phenomenon of noncitizen voting and a failure to impose penalties against those who cast votes fraudulently has rendered laws against such activity meaningless. It is a federal crime to vote illegally.”

The enthusiasm evident in Democrat-controlled states to allow illegals to obtain drivers’ licenses is a key part of this drive to change the balance of political power. The Obama Administration took action which had the effect of increasing the likelihood of illegals being able to register to vote. The Democratic Party has consistently opposed reasonable and necessary measures to prevent voter fraud.
 
Voter fraud? No. Interference by Russia and other foreign governments, very worried.
 
I'm more concerned about Russia intentionally "leaking" information that they had not only attempted to or successfully hacked state election infrastructures (which they did do in 2016 and in other nations since), but that they had taken the additional steps of altering voter registries and/or vote totals (something that we do not have reason to believe has happened anywhere yet). Whether or not they actually did do it may be beside the point. Floating the suggestion that they had may be all that it takes to start a firestorm.
 
I'm more worried about stupid people voting.
 
Tlrmln said:
I'm more worried about stupid people voting.
Click to expand...

I'm more worried about stupid people driving. If you are of median intelligence then about half of the drivers you are sharing the roadways with are dumber than you are. ;)
 
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