which is most difficult to believe of all Catholic doctrine?

What is limbo in Catholic doctrine?

On Mary being a virgin, that is obvious in Matthew and Luke.

Blue Donkey said:

What is limbo in Catholic doctrine?

On Mary being a virgin, that is obvious in Matthew and Luke.

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But she did not remain a virgin, as she had other children...

Elvira said:

But she did not remain a virgin, as she had other children.

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That is not a "Catholic doctrine" belief. It is simply a fact. So it did not need to be a poll choice.

Blue Donkey said:

That is not a "Catholic doctrine" belief. It is simply a fact. So it did not need to be a poll choice.

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The perpetual virginity of Mary is a Marian doctrine, taught by the Catholic Church and held by a number of groups in Christianity, which asserts that Mary (the mother of Jesus) was "always a virgin, before, during and after the birth of Jesus Christ."[1] This doctrine also proclaims that Mary had no marital relations after Jesus' birth nor gave birth to any children other than Jesus.[2] While the Bible mentions brothers of Jesus,[3] Catholic, Orthodox, and some traditional Protestant interpretations offer various explanations that align with the doctrine of Mary's perpetual virginity; that these siblings were either children of Joseph from a previous marriage, cousins of Jesus, or were closely associated with the Holy Family.

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Perpetual virginity of Mary - Wikipedia

@ saints

I am not opposed to saints.

They make a religion a bit more colourful than always Jesus alone only.

Blue Donkey said:

What is limbo in Catholic doctrine?

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Better ask: "What was limbo?"

The problem with praying to saints obviously is they are not God. The Bible tells us to only worship and pray to God directly, not via sinners who died centuries ago.

Blue Donkey said:

Well, I don't hate Catholic people. I have a Catholic friend. I just hate the fact that Catholics have unbiblical beliefs

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@ un-biblical

Poor Easter Bunny - and poor Christmas Tree.
They are both as unbiblical as hell!

Rumpel said:

Better ask: "What was limbo?"

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OK, so what was it?

narrowroad said:

which is most difficult to believe of all Catholic doctrine?

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I happen to be a Catholic

And I am opposed to quite a few things that are regarded as typically Catholic.

Here are just 2 of them

- that priests are not allowed to marry
- that women are not allowed to become priest - or bishop - or Pope - or whatever - in the Catholic Church

Rumpel said:

@ un-biblical

Poor Easter Bunny - and poor Christmas Tree. They are both as unbiblical as hell!

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Hell is 100% Biblical. See the "lake of fire" in Revelation.

The Easter Bunny is not a Christian tradition. Pagans celebrated the beginning of spring hundreds or thousands of years before Jesus was born. As for Christmas trees, it was the Catholic Church's idea that Jesus was born on December 25 despite Biblical evidence he was actually born in late September.

Blue Donkey said:

OK, so what was it?

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Some place where all those babies go who died before they could be baptized

But I never believed in that!

Blue Donkey said:

The Easter Bunny is not a Christian tradition.

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Poor bunnies!

Are they pagan? :shock:

Well well, we 'll just have to live with that if we want to earn our Easter eggs. eace

Rumpel said:

Poor bunnies!

Are they pagan?

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Why are these traditions so ingrained in Easter Sunday? And what do they have to do with the resurrection of Jesus? Well, to be frank, nothing.

Bunnies, eggs, Easter gifts and fluffy, yellow chicks in gardening hats all stem from pagan roots. These tropes were incorporated into the celebration of Easter separately from the Christian tradition of honoring the day Jesus Christ rose from the dead.

According to the University of Florida's Center for Children's Literature and Culture, the origin of the celebration - and the origin of the Easter Bunny - can be traced back to 13th-century, pre-Christian Germany, when people worshiped several gods and goddesses.

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Where Did the Easter Bunny Come From? - Seeker

Blue Donkey said:

Hell is 100% Biblical. See the "lake of fire" in Revelation.

The Easter Bunny is not a Christian tradition. Pagans celebrated the beginning of spring hundreds or thousands of years before Jesus was born. As for Christmas trees, it was the Catholic Church's idea that Jesus was born on December 25 despite Biblical evidence he was actually born in late September.

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The lake of fire is not hell, otherwise hell would not be thrown into the lake of fire, along with death...neither of which can literally burn, so the lake of fire must be symbolic of something else...what happens when you throw something into the fire? It is destroyed...just as hell and death will be....second death is everlasting destruction...

"And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death." Revelation 20:14 KJV

Rumpel said:

Poor bunnies!

Are they pagan? :shock:

Well well, we 'll just have to live with that if we want to earn our Easter eggs. eace

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How many bunnies do you know lays eggs?:2razz:

d0gbreath said:

Jesus was close to the middle of eleven brothers and sisters. Mary's virginity would have had to have been questionable.

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Where to you get that from? I know of no record of older brothers or sisters of Jesus.

Elvira said:

How many bunnies do you know lays eggs?:2razz:

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There is no such thing as a hare or rabbit that lays eggs. Because this fictional animal is nowhere in the Bible, we know it is pagan and not invented by Christians. Catholics, however, did play a role in spreading the tradition here.

upsideguy said:

Where to you get that from? I know of no record of older brothers or sisters of Jesus.

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"Remained a virgin" obviously means Jesus does not have any YOUNGER brothers and sisters. A Protestant told me the book of John was written by a brother of Jesus, not the Baptist, which would disprove the belief Mary never had sex with Joseph.

upsideguy said:

Where to you get that from? I know of no record of older brothers or sisters of Jesus.

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How many siblings did Jesus have? | GotQuestions.org

Constantine's Canon tries to say that they were all younger, but James was in his forties when Jesus began preaching. Jesus also had a twin brother named Thomas as discovered in the jars at the Nag Hammadi. Googling will get you answers that indicate that his four brothers and two sisters (maybe more) were from Joseph's previous marriage and were only half brothers. No one wants to state that Mary had children before the birth of Christ because the Church will condemn those as heretics.

It's your belief, so whatever you believe is true to you.

Blue Donkey said:

There is no such thing as a hare or rabbit that lays eggs. Because this fictional animal is nowhere in the Bible, we know it is pagan and not invented by Christians. Catholics, however, did play a role in spreading the tradition here.

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Yep, thus the :2razz:...

Again, why do Catholics put a lot of unbiblical stuff in their doctrine and church practices?

Blue Donkey said:

"Remained a virgin" obviously means Jesus does not have any YOUNGER brothers and sisters. A Protestant told me the book of John was written by a brother of Jesus, not the Baptist, which would disprove the belief Mary never had sex with Joseph.

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I am not taking issue with younger brothers and sisters, its the idea of older brothers and sisters that I am challenging.

d0gbreath said:

How many siblings did Jesus have? | GotQuestions.org

Constantine's Canon tries to say that they were all younger, but James was in his forties when Jesus began preaching. Jesus also had a twin brother named Thomas as discovered in the jars at the Nag Hammadi. Googling will get you answers that indicate that his four brothers and two sisters (maybe more) were from Joseph's previous marriage and were only half brothers. No one wants to state that Mary had children before the birth of Christ because the Church will condemn those as heretics.

It's your belief, so whatever you believe is true to you.

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The Bible is pretty clear that Mary was a virgin at the time of conception. He did have brothers and sisters. I do not buy (nor do I even get the theological reasoning behind) the idea that Mary was a virgin after the birth of Christ or, even wilder, that she comes from a line of virgins. Frankly the obsession with the virginity Mary seems antithetical to God's gift of sex by suggesting that sex is sin (there is that Catholic guilt for you). Then again, Catholic doctrine is riddled with a degree of mythology (see choices of poll above) that are departures from the Bible. I don't get terribly hung up on these departures; then again, I am not Catholic. Protestant thinking also includes some degree of mythology. It is just human corruption of the Word of God to make it more comforting.

But given the clarity of the Bible on the subject of Immaculate Conception, I accept it. The idea that Jesus had older full brothers is not much more than speculation, hence I do not accept that.

Though I do not take the Bible literally, I do take it as truth. For example, I do believe the scientific record regarding the age of the earth. Though it stands contrary to the literal read of the Bible, I do not find it contrary to the truth of the Bible, which it is God's creation. I have no reason to doubt the Immaculate Conception, but if not true, to me it would be a discredit to my understanding of the Bible rather than the Bible itself.

Blue Donkey said:

Again, why do Catholics put a lot of unbiblical stuff in their doctrine and church practices?

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2000 years of selling their theology to pagans involved a whole lot of co-mingling of ideas, myths and customs. See also Christmas and Easter.

narrowroad said:

which is most difficult to believe of all Catholic doctrine?

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Mary remaining a virgin since Jesus had brothers

d0gbreath said:

How many siblings did Jesus have? | GotQuestions.org

Constantine's Canon tries to say that they were all younger, but James was in his forties when Jesus began preaching. Jesus also had a twin brother named Thomas as discovered in the jars at the Nag Hammadi. Googling will get you answers that indicate that his four brothers and two sisters (maybe more) were from Joseph's previous marriage and were only half brothers. No one wants to state that Mary had children before the birth of Christ because the Church will condemn those as heretics.

It's your belief, so whatever you believe is true to you.

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Jesus could not possibly be a twin. He was the first-born Son. I am not aware of any Bible verse stating Mary was Joseph's second wife and would be interested in reading a Scripture reference.