Trump vs. Cheney/Bush: The Worst President Ever Challenge

I thought Bush was a terrible president. I thought Nixon was a dishonest president. But I never thought Bush nor Nixon were threats to American democracy. Trump I believe is a true threat to democracy and has moved to undermine checks and balances, American institutions and tries to discredit the free press, whose purpose is to check executive power.

MTAtech said:

I thought Bush was a terrible president. I thought Nixon was a dishonest president. But I never thought Bush nor Nixon were threats to American democracy. Trump I believe is a true threat to democracy and has moved to undermine checks and balances, American institutions and tries to discredit the free press, whose purpose is to check executive power.

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I was a Nixon supporter until he resigned and left office as the scoundrel he turned out to be. That devilment broke my heart.
Nixon's actions might very well be called into question with regard to the threat to Democracy. I struggle to understand why some consider President Trump a threat to Democracy, when he was elected democratically(no, not by numbers, but by breadth of vote). Other than specious accusation and churned up by the left, in my opinion he is doing a remarkable job. In fact, much better than I expected, given the misbegotten hatred he has been straddled with.
Regards,
CP

When Jimmy Carter was president, I put in for a VA mortgage loan which at that time was usually a 1% less than the best rate you could get elsewhere. I had good credit and the interest rate was 12% on a mortgage.

If I could find gasoline to get to work I could only buy on even numbered days, because there was gas rationing. At times you waited in line for in the hours to get gas and by the time you got to the pump they ran out. Then you couldnt buy gas the next day because it was an odd numbered day and you could only buy on even days based on your license plate.

We had the iranian hostage crisis, where our Idiot in Chief waited and entire year before he did ANYTHING and when he did slap something together to extract them it failed and the blamed a chopper malfunction.

How can you have a Poll on whos the worst president and not include carter

Neither, and seeing as this list is so small. It appears that the OP is just fishing for "specific" answers.

Obama's era is the one that finally turn not only myself, but so many others from the democratic party. So he easily gets my vote, and I say this after serving under Bush.

concernedpuma said:

Thank you, sir? Would you please enumerate the occasions where 100's of thousands were killed...for nothing? If you can, then I will be able respect your contention.
Regards,
CP

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I guess you never heard of the Iraq war.


They died for nothing

lpast said:

When Jimmy Carter was president, I put in for a VA mortgage loan which at that time was usually a 1% less than the best rate you could get elsewhere. I had good credit and the interest rate was 12% on a mortgage.

If I could find gasoline to get to work I could only buy on even numbered days, because there was gas rationing. At times you waited in line for in the hours to get gas and by the time you got to the pump they ran out. Then you couldnt buy gas the next day because it was an odd numbered day and you could only buy on even days based on your license plate.

We had the iranian hostage crisis, where our Idiot in Chief waited and entire year before he did ANYTHING and when he did slap something together to extract them it failed and the blamed a chopper malfunction.

How can you have a Poll on whos the worst president and not include carter

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Carter was inept. He disappointed us more than any potus had done or could have done.

Bush was easily led by Darth Cheney and the Reagan-GHW Crew until Bush finally turned on Cheney. Bush was a destroyer of nations and peoples abroad who grossly exceeded any 9/11 mandate he may have had.

Unlike Carter or GW, however, Trump is actively malicious and malevolent toward his own people. This sets Trump apart negatively from all previous potus combined.

I've done a lot of travel and work abroad since circa 2000 -- mostly throughout East and SE Asia -- and the most prominent comment by foreigners in these lands abroad is that the American government treats its own people well. While many foreigners muse that they see a USA that is always at war destroying countries and killing people, they say the American government treats its own people well.

This is in contrast to almost all countries of Asia, Africa, South America, the ME and so on that have the vast majority of countries of the world. Now the foreigners in their lands don't say this any more, not since Trump became Potus. Foreigners say now that Trump divides Americans against one another and against their government. That Trump incites Americans against one another and he uses the government to abuse, injure and harm Americans, the way so many foreign governments do and have done as the historical norm.

One of my own principal rejections of Trump though is that Trump is consciously and systematically destroying all USA alliances of every kind -- such as the TPP -- and national defense and security, from Nato to SK and Japan and more. Trump is willfully reducing American soft power globally. I reject Trump as an ogre trying to reduce the United States into the image of himself. Moreover the Putin-Trump Rowers are working even harder at it than Trump is. No president approaches the level of Trump's depravity and no president ignites such depravity in certain other Americans as does Trump. Trump is a hater and a divider and each day he remain president brings us closer to irreparable harm. Fact is there are several Constitutional processes by which Trump can be removed but that's another topic.

Tangmo said:

Carter was inept. He disappointed us more than any potus had done or could have done.

Bush was easily led by Darth Cheney and the Reagan-GHW Crew until Bush finally turned on Cheney. Bush was a destroyer of nations and peoples abroad who grossly exceeded any 9/11 mandate he may have had.

Unlike Carter or GW, however, Trump is actively malicious and malevolent toward his own people. This sets Trump apart negatively from all previous potus combined.

I've done a lot of travel and work abroad since circa 2000 -- mostly throughout East and SE Asia -- and the most prominent comment by foreigners in these lands abroad is that the American government treats its own people well. While many foreigners muse that they see a USA that is always at war destroying countries and killing people, they say the American government treats its own people well.

This is in contrast to almost all countries of Asia, Africa, South America, the ME and so on that have the vast majority of countries of the world. Now the foreigners in their lands don't say this any more, not since Trump became Potus. Foreigners say now that Trump divides Americans against one another and against their government. That Trump incites Americans against one another and he uses the government to abuse, injure and harm Americans, the way so many foreign governments do and have done as the historical norm.

One of my own principal rejections of Trump though is that Trump is consciously and systematically destroying all USA alliances of every kind -- such as the TPP -- and national defense and security, from Nato to SK and Japan and more. Trump is willfully reducing American soft power globally. I reject Trump as an ogre trying to reduce the United States into the image of himself. Moreover the Putin-Trump Rowers are working even harder at it than Trump is. No president approaches the level of Trump's depravity and no president ignites such depravity in certain other Americans as does Trump. Trump is a hater and a divider and each day he remain president brings us closer to irreparable harm. Fact is there are several Constitutional processes by which Trump can be removed but that's another topic.

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I agree with some of your post but I completely disagree with your trump statements, trump has been the most attacked, the most maligned, the most "lied" about president in many decades. They plotted a coup against him to deny him the presidency before the campaign started and he announced.

Trump has every right to go back at his critics when they lie and hes the only president of my lifetime that tells you just like it is.

Obama was the biggest snake to ever sit in the white house, he was a grinning smiling viper that accomplished absolutely nothing

Dans La Lune said:

Which president deserves the title for the Worst President Ever? I put Cheney/Bush as one entity, because the vast majority of the decisions made during the Bush Admin were actually made by Cheney.

The case for Bush/Cheney: Turned the tragedy of 9/11 against the American people and used it as leverage to launch an invasion against an uninvolved nation, killing at least a million innocent Iraqis, thousands of American soldiers, squandered trillions in American resources and destabilized a large region of the world -- vastly increasing terrorism, exacerbating the migration crisis, and strengthening Iran and Russia in the collateral effects.

The case for Trump: Epic and almost comical mismanagement of the American government, unprecedented and unchecked corruption, transforming the Supreme Court and lower courts via the Federalist Society, exacerbating the partisan divide, fomenting overt White Nationalism, normalizing dictators and autocratic governments, alienating allies, and arguably cementing the decline of American influence and power throughout the world.

Feel free to challenge or add to the 'cases' for the respective presidents. I'm adding an 'Other' category because many conservatives will write in 'Obama!' for what I can only assume is a non-racist reason.

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Lincoln. He started a war over power that led to the deaths of nearly a million americans. Even Obamas ordered killing of an american citizen without due process, can not come close to that. Clinton was likely a rapist, and at best sexually harassed interns going so far as to have sex with them in our office.

But I suspect you dont actually want a serious debate.

MTAtech said:

I thought Bush was a terrible president. I thought Nixon was a dishonest president. But I never thought Bush nor Nixon were threats to American democracy. Trump I believe is a true threat to democracy and has moved to undermine checks and balances, American institutions and tries to discredit the free press, whose purpose is to check executive power.

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Congress and courts purpose is to check executive power (and each others). The presses purpose is to inform the public (and sell entertainment), so they can check the entire govt.

But every President does these things. Trump will be out of office in 1-5 years and the institutions and press will still be here, as always.

lpast said:

I agree with some of your post but I completely disagree with your trump statements, trump has been the most attacked, the most maligned, the most "lied" about president in many decades. They plotted a coup against him to deny him the presidency before the campaign started and he announced.

Trump has every right to go back at his critics when they lie and hes the only president of my lifetime that tells you just like it is.

Obama was the biggest snake to ever sit in the white house, he was a grinning smiling viper that accomplished absolutely nothing

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Trump is the president who is malicious and malevolent toward his own people at home in the USA. There is no precedent for President Trump's abuse of Americans in their own land. And for Trump's unprecedented attacks against the institutions of the government and of the society.

It used to be foreigners said the US Government treats its people well in contrast to most governments of the world. Foreigners don't say that any more now that Trump is potus. Foreigners now say Trump divides and sets Americans against one another. And that Trump uses the powers and authority of his office to cause harm to Americans in their own land. And that Trump and Putin are tight. And that while Trump hates the China model he loves the Russian one.

Foreigners no longer see Americans as reasonably free of abuse by their own leaders and government. Far more free than in almost all other countries globally. No more since Trump was installed as potus.

Tangmo said:

Trump is the president who is malicious and malevolent toward his own people at home in the USA. There is no precedent for President Trump's abuse of Americans in their own land. And for Trump's unprecedented attacks against the institutions of the government and of the society.

It used to be foreigners said the US Government treats its people well in contrast to most governments of the world. Foreigners don't say that any more now that Trump is potus. Foreigners now say Trump divides and sets Americans against one another. And that Trump uses the powers and authority of his office to cause harm to Americans in their own land. And that Trump and Putin are tight. And that while Trump hates the China model he loves the Russian one.

Foreigners no longer see Americans as reasonably free of abuse by their own leaders and government. Far more free than in almost all other countries globally. No more since Trump was installed as potus.

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I dont see it as you do

lpast said:

I dont see it as you do

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You need to listen to foreigners abroad in their own lands, not to me. Yet you instead wave a magic wand at the messenger -- moi -- at great peril to America, its global standing and national security.

Fellow Americans in our homeland need to know: it used to be foreigners said the US Government treated its people well in contrast to most governments of the world. Foreigners don't say that any more now that Trump is potus. Foreigners say now Trump divides and sets Americans against one another.

Foreigners abroad say that Trump uses the powers and authority of his office to abuse and cause harm to Americans in their own land in the ways many foreign despot governments have done as the historical norm. This is what foreigners say. You need to listen to 'em, but first you have to be there with 'em as I have been, off and on for the past 20 years.

Many foreigners have long mused they see a USA that is always at war destroying countries and killing people but that the American government treats its own people well. Not any more. Not since Trump became potus. Foreigners say they see Trump at war against Americans themselves in our own land.

This is what foreigners have said and say now, which is the opposite, since Trump was elected. This is not what I think foreigners should think, believe, say. It is what foreigners say in their own lands and have said in their own lands. These are foreigners in their own lands speaking to Americans abroad to include since Trump was installed as president.

It is what foreigners abroad in their own lands say and have said; continue to speak about. It's how foreigners say they view it and think of it. What foreigners say.

Say.

lpast said:

I dont see it as you do

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Nor do I, T. It is a bit curious you interject foreign view into a conversation of American Presidents. I frankly want only a business, mutual respect, and load sharing arrangement with other countries. I don't care if they like who American's vote for or not. If they like our choice, okay. If not, oh well. I'm certain that no one else in the world goes into a voting booth with "what will America think" on their mind's. And, quite honestly, I never vote with "will the rest of the world approve" in mind.
To each their own.
Regards,
CP

Worst President ever: That would be a tie between Wilson and Nixon. Wilson gave us the Federal Income Tax and Nixon presented wage and price controls, brought about OSHA and normalized relations with Red China.

SDET said:

Worst President ever: That would be a tie between Wilson and Nixon. Wilson gave us the Federal Income Tax and Nixon presented wage and price controls, brought about OSHA and normalized relations with Red China.

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President "he kept us out of war" Wilson also gave us WWI(the premise for thetemporary income tax.)
Nixon also put a stain on a political party that still haunts good candidates.
In addition to the two above, and if we are speaking only of the very worst of Presidents - Grant, Hoover, Johnson, Kennedy, and Carter certainly ought be in the running.

Regards,
CP

concernedpuma said:

Nor do I, T. It is a bit curious you interject foreign view into a conversation of American Presidents. I frankly want only a business, mutual respect, and load sharing arrangement with other countries. I don't care if they like who American's vote for or not. If they like our choice, okay. If not, oh well. I'm certain that no one else in the world goes into a voting booth with "what will America think" on their mind's. And, quite honestly, I never vote with "will the rest of the world approve" in mind.
To each their own.
Regards,
CP

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I agree with you, what Iran and Germany think of our Potus means nothing to me. We elect our president to do whats best for our country, not whats best for Other countries.

Other countries are like liberals, they only like you when you agree with them

By all means Trump is the best President we have had.Obama looks like a girls high school volleyball coach compared to Trump.

Worst ever, IMO, would be Woodrow Wilson.
Since my birth, it would be hard to decide between FDR, LBJ, Carter, and Obama.

This poll is based on the nostalgic past, during the heyday of left wing propaganda; Democrats strategists working with the main stream media. Bush never fought back when continuously attacked and misrepresented by the DNC and media. The propagandas was effective and repetitive, and ended up with many people assuming it was true, due to no pushback.

Obama, on the other hand, was overly lathered with virtue by excessively positive media propaganda. This overdrive was to create a rosy disguise for Obama's incompetence and Constitutional corruption, as the economy just laid there on life support. Who gets a Nobel Peace Prize and then create a huge humanitarian crisis that helped to break up the European Union; backlash revolts? Who farms out America jobs, to the world, and then calls the shrinking middle class the new norm? Who puts millions of people on food stamps and is labeled an economic genius by the fake news? This was the heyday of media manipulation.

The left wing propaganda wing of the Democrats party, was ruling the day, but met its match when Trump was elected. The media assumed if they say Hillary will win, enough times, the masses would blindly follow their lead, as they did with Obama. They did not expect Trump to steal the show. Trump fought the DNC and fake news collusion delusion and won.

Had Trump not used Twitter and had he silently took the abuse as did Bush, the lies would have stuck. Instead Trump was like David who ends up killing Goliath, because Trump was on the side of truth and right. Trump was one man against hundred of hateful and mean left wing nerds and kicked all their butts. It was like Bruce Lee fighting a mob of criminals. The effectiveness of the left wing propaganda wing has drastically diminished, as these businesses now founder. Even their own base has turned away with viewers number way down. What other President could injure the beast, to where their own kind abandons them?

One reason Trump fought back was he was not a professional politician. Therefore, he did not take the normal inside the beltway strategy of a Washington insider. The normal path is to be two faced; smile for the camera and then get even behind the scenes. Trump's previous job and career was based on his public brand, which would be tarnished if he did not fight back; publicly. If he did not fight back, his hospitality businesses empire would be ruined by all the bad press. He protected this name and in doing so cut off one of the nuts of the main street media. This feat alone makes Trump a great president. He has even started a new trend, which is to push back at the lame street media, which is now a nuisance without teeth, who walks funny and talks with a higher pitch.

How many presidents took on the swamp of their day, and were able to successfully mess them up? Trump messed them up internationally. This war is about to get real interesting, when the indictments start to appear and deals are made to stay out of jail, exposing the biggest fish the media can no longer protect. All the whining and anxiety about the state of affairs and nostalgia of glory days past; beat up Bush, is proportional to how much the swamp has been injured. The funny thing is Trump has even commandeered the once success moderate Democrat platforms, under Bill Clinton and Obama, therefore forcing the radial left to take over and sink the party.

gulfman said:

By all means Trump is the best President we have had.Obama looks like a girls high school volleyball coach compared to Trump.

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Trump is our first black president. Obama was black in name only. Surrounded by Wall Street types. He did nothing for middle class America, much less for black middle class America. Bailed out banks and corporations but let millions of Americans lose their homes. Good job, Barry.

Waddy said:

Trump is our first black president. Obama was black in name only. Surrounded by Wall Street types. He did nothing for middle class America, much less for black middle class America. Bailed out banks and corporations but let millions of Americans lose their homes. Good job, Barry.

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It was George W. Bush that got the banks bailed out. Don't you remember "too big to fail" ? President George W. Bush signed the bill into law within hours of its congressional enactment, creating the $700 billion Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) to purchase failing bank assets. The housing crash happened under Bush also. It was Barack Obama that turned that mess around.

HumblePi said:

It was George W. Bush that got the banks bailed out. Don't you remember "too big to fail" ? President George W. Bush signed the bill into law within hours of its congressional enactment, creating the $700 billion Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) to purchase failing bank assets. The housing crash happened under Bush also. It was Barack Obama that turned that mess around.

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Obama turned it around for the fat cats, not middle America.

Waddy said:

Obama turned it around for the fat cats, not middle America.

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'Fat cats' like Ryan Zinke, Tom Price, Scott Pruitt, Jared Kushner, Ivanka Trump, John Kelly, William Barr, and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin who quietly copied & pasted bank lobbyists' talking points into an IRS rule, thereby handing bankers a $2.5 billion tax cut? Do you mean Obama had 'fat cats' like them?

Let's see, who in the Obama administration do you consider to be one of the fat cats your accuse Obama of 'turning it around' for?

lpast said:

Gotta love the choices to this poll, good thing "other" was given.

Do you guys think a liberal created this poll ?

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Well let's see, we have bush/cheney who were horrible and almost caused another great depression and we have trump who is doing everything in his power to undermine the whole of america and its institutions. Then we have obama, no scandals, and of course one government shut-down led by the republican house. Saved america and the auto industry from the bush/cheney financial disaster and got american moving forward again.

And republicans have the nerve to say how horrible the liberal socialists are for america. Trump did try to warn us by telling us he would run the government like he ran his businesses, into bankruptcy.

Trump gets my vote.

Ikari said:

Bush is the reason I no longer vote Republican. But even then, he's still better than Trump.

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You were always a leftwinger, it just took time for the truth to emerge. If you can't take two Republicans, but are okay with Democrats, then you never were one. Libertarian Left just means liberal anyway. So no surprise.