Single-Use Plastic Bans

Scrabaholic said:

I think it's unrealistic to ban plastic bags. Sometimes they are necessary. I get my groceries delivered and they are brought in plastic bags. Due to mobility issues, I cannot grocery shop myself. The bags go into the recycling bin. When I go out, I take cloth bags with me for any purchases I make. I've been doing that for over 25 years.

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Paper bags.

Carjosse said:

What do you think of single-use plastic bans that have become more and more common recently. My city Montreal is planning to institute a ban on single-use mainly taking aim at take-out restaurants using plastic utensils and Styrofoam containers but also meat packaged in those Styrofoam trays and plastic warp. The UK has passed a ban on plastic straws, cotton swabs, and other single-use plastics. The EU parliament has also passed a similar ban on single-use plastics. So do you support the efforts of many governments to ban single-use plastics and reduce waste?

Personally I support these and cannot wait until my favorite take-out restaurant is forced to use something other than Styrofoam.

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What do I think? I think its more interesting to plumb the thought processes of those who hold opinions based on mostly on their gut feeling. What is it that would compel them to support any ban of a convenience without knowing if the ban also be a waste of time, money, and consumer preference, which may be greater than that of the alleged problem?

My guess it starts with a person's makeup. Many have acquired (or naturally have) certain frugality values - antipathy to "wasting" material being one of them. Part of it is based on experience; those of us who have had parents or grandparents who grew up in the depression will hear stories of hunger of making do with little. And even later generations know of "hand-me-down" clothing or of being berated by parents for not finishing our meals. But much of it is also in our survival genes; so much so who does not know of a hoarder, skin-flint, or junk-collector in one's own family?

Its not a matter of a formal cost-benefit to recycling and hoarding, for the individual all such decisions are an instinctual balancing of the convenience, time saved, and tidiness of disposable goods against one's own pocket book. It is one of individual valuation, and varies from person to person. For every person who dines out for every meal, pays for laundry service, stacks traffic fines like confetti, and purchases a new car every year there is another person (such as friend of mine) who recycles his paper coffee filters until they are pulp, only launders his cloths during hours of low electric rates and usage, hasn't bought a car less than 25 years old, will only use "free" over the air TV, and thinks of cell phones and social media just more consumer waste.

So herein I think lies the difference; there are those that project their subjective valuations as "normative", as a "good thing" for all people. My friend, for example, thinks ill of people (including me) because we don't wish to avoid consumerism and think of his lifestyle as detrimental to our well being. While we don't seek to impose our view of the good life on anyone, on the other hand he thinks its offensive to allow people conduct themselves according to his values.

So when I see another "why don't we ban this" thread, I always marvel at the arrogance of presumptiveness. I also wonder why other people are not so presumptive, and have not desire to make others conform their own idea of "normal".

Curious.

Chomsky said:

That's your perspective, I suppose.

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Its probably because Im into geology. There are are rocks as old as the Earth in some parts of the world. Non-toxic material can be disposed of much more easily than toxic materials. Styrofoam for example is non toxic.

I suspect that that part of the answer (obviously we need to control what we produce) is micromanaging landfills. This (for the most part) just burying everything, creating large dirt covered hills of refuse is by far not sustainable. Every time that I must go to the dump, I see whats being covered up and it just makes me think that its idiotic. Some people think that the solution is to make dumps into power stations. But that will not really fix anything, but it sure will make some people money.

FreedomFromAll said:

Its probably because Im into geology. There are are rocks as old as the Earth in some parts of the world. Non-toxic material can be disposed of much more easily than toxic materials. Styrofoam for example is non toxic.

I suspect that that part of the answer (obviously we need to control what we produce) is micromanaging landfills. This (for the most part) just burying everything, creating large dirt covered hills of refuse is by far not sustainable. Every time that I must go to the dump, I see whats being covered up and it just makes me think that its idiotic. Some people think that the solution is to make dumps into power stations. But that will not really fix anything, but it sure will make some people money.

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Well, then you may have a leg-up on me here.

I'm just wary of things that don't or can't easily "disappear". I do realize I'm thinking in infinite absolutes, though. I don't know the quantitative analysis here.

The whole point of having disposable plastic straws and the such is so germs and bacteria doesn't spread (along with getting out of dishes). Honestly, I'd much rather have those items available than sipping on something that others already had their mouths on. Glass mugs and cups at bars is one thing because it's easier to get that stuff out since it's so smooth and solid, but other mushier materials where bacteria can hide out, no thanks. Besides, for decisions like this, it shouldn't be up to the government to make those calls. Let the places of business decide what's best for their establishment. All the government would do is nail people financially for stupid things like that. BTW, this is the Left pushing for this. They recently put in, what were once great cities before they took over, literal human sh!t, used syringes, typhus, trash, and other human waste on the streets of their towns. They are not cleanest people. Watch the movie Idiocracy. They'll try to say it's meant to mock the people on the Right, but if you pay attention to today and watch this movie, this is actually them (either intentionally or unintentionally). We're not just talking how stupid they are, but how careless they are when it comes to cleanliness and hygiene. Just trying to talk to them about important topics makes you drop several IQ points, and this movie will remind you of that. YouTube

Carjosse said:

Paper bags.

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Which is a hassle for someone w/ mobility issues.

Scrabaholic said:

Which is a hassle for someone w/ mobility issues.

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How exactly are they any different than plastic?