Is Anyone Still On the Fence (Undecided) About Support for the Current Administration?

Blue Dog said:

Where did you get that from? I have no hatred for President Trump. I attack the words, not the man himself. I actually do want him to succeed. Why would I want ANY President to fail?

Click to expand...

Blue Dog said:

That’s a good question. I have to ponder that.

Click to expand...

Your posts are interesting to me. Personally, I voted No, not because I want to pull a Rush Limbaugh who said about President-Elect Obama: "I hope he fails." No, I sincerely feel that regardless of what I want, Trump has already caused significant damage to America's reputation abroad, to the ability of the little guy to get ahead, and to our political process as a whole. I fear that unless these midterms restore the checks and balances that our Founders gave us, this damage may become permanent, if we haven't crossed that threshold already.

bubbabgone said:

...and you can add "reform Social Security" to the list if you want to get more granular ... but we'd blow right through the DP word limit if we got granular.

Click to expand...

SS is vey easy to 'fix' if you define 'fixing' as keeping a pay-as-you-go system intact where current workers fund (via FICA taxation) retirement supplements for current retirees. Medicare is not quite the same situation but is similar enough to 'fix' in the same way. The problem, of course, is that everyone can then readily see how much their meager paychecks are being further reduced to support 'socialist' programs.

If you use a more 'progressive' taxation system then folks will believe the BS that "the rich" are then paying the (bulk of) taxes for them - rather than realize that "the rich" are simply increasing the price of goods/services which they control to cover the added taxation overhead (also reducing the buying power of their meager paychecks).

Trump lost me when he attacked a Gold Star family.

ttwtt78640 said:

SS is vey easy to 'fix' if you define 'fixing' as keeping a pay-as-you-go system intact where current workers fund (via FICA taxation) retirement supplements for current retirees. Medicare is not quite the same situation but is similar enough to 'fix' in the same way. The problem, of course, is that everyone can then readily see how much their meager paychecks are being further reduced to support 'socialist' programs.

If you use a more 'progressive' taxation system then folks will believe the BS that "the rich" are then paying the (bulk of) taxes for them - rather than realize that "the rich" are simply increasing the price of goods/services which they control to cover the added taxation overhead (also reducing the buying power of their meager paychecks).

Click to expand...

What would happen if some poor schmo proposes something simple like we "Leave SS as is for current recipients and ..." fill in the rest with something or other.
Within the hour they'd be attacked because they want to" eliminate SS for the elderly who depend on it to survive". And if there's a way to drag "children" into the attack they'd do that too.

bubbabgone said:

What would happen if some poor schmo proposes something simple like we "Leave SS as is for current recipients and ..." fill in the rest with something or other.
Within the hour they'd be attacked because they want to" eliminate SS for the elderly who depend on it to survive". And if there's a way to drag "children" into the attack they'd do that too.

Click to expand...

That (bolded above) would be accurate since you cannot have your cake and eat it too. 100% (or more) of current FICA taxes are needed to support current (and near current) retirees so any 'alternative' retirement/medical care system (public or private) would have to be funded with additional (and mandatory?) 'contributions'.

Rogue Valley said:

Trump lost me when he attacked a Gold Star family.

Click to expand...

I had to look up Trump's quote and I saw he said ...
Was there something else?

My mind is made up - but not for Trump or Republicans - but against the Democratic Party, whose politicians all act as a block for core goals and platforms I intensely oppose. Therefore, the individual politicians no longer real matter regardless of what they say.

I oppose allowing mass immigration and the only immigrants we allow should be based upon what is good for our country - not want the potential immigrants need or want - which included no immigrants that will take vanishing blue collar jobs from Americans.

bubbabgone said:

I had to look up Trump's quote and I saw he said ...

"I saw him. He was very emotional, and probably looked like a nice guy to me. His wife, if you look at his wife she was standing there, she had nothing to say. Probably, maybe she wasn't allowed to have anything to say, you tell me, but plenty of people have written that. She was extremely quiet and it looked like she had nothing to say, a lot of people have said that, and personally I watched him, I wish him the best of luck."​

Was there something else?

Click to expand...

That will not stop them from telling the false claim that President Trump "attacked" a Gold Star family. It could be said that he softly attacked a sexist Muslim man for his treating his wife as if she is his slave to keep her mouth shut.

Rogue Valley said:

Trump lost me when he attacked a Gold Star family.

Click to expand...

Naw. By your messages you're a yellow dog Democrat.

ttwtt78640 said:

That (bolded above) would be accurate since you cannot have your cake and eat it too. 100% (or more) of current FICA taxes are needed to support current (and near current) retirees so any 'alternative' retirement/medical care system (public or private) would have to be funded with additional (and mandatory?) 'contributions'.

Click to expand...

Any change would have to be phased in and reductions in SS supplemented or replaced with dedicated employer based savings plans or equivalent wherever possible until the new process becomes stabilized.
It requires a change in perspective, approach, attitude, and mindset not easy to bring about once certain types of policy have been in place for long enough.

joko104 said:

That will not stop them from telling the false claim that President Trump "attacked" a Gold Star family. It could be said that he softly attacked a sexist Muslim man for his treating his wife as if she is his slave to keep her mouth shut.

Click to expand...

Yes, that could be said but you'd never know it once the meme takes on a life of its own.

bubbabgone said:

Any change would have to be phased in and reductions in SS supplemented or replaced with dedicated employer based savings plans or equivalent wherever possible until the new process becomes stabilized.
It requires a change in perspective, approach, attitude, and mindset not easy to bring about once certain types of policy have been in place for long enough.

Click to expand...

It is that 'phase in' period (30 years minimum?) which places that huge bump (described in my prior post) in the road. SS is already (mainly) a defined contribution plan which was way ahead of its time. Medicare is (mainly) a defined benefit plan and, as such, is quite a bit harder to 'fix'. Both are already 'employer based' in that the employer pays 1/2 of the FICA burden (less their income taxation rate since it is currently a tax deductible expense on their end).

Dang.... blows my mind....... 3 honest direct responses to why they dont support Trump is all emotional, no factual claims and no substance of failure to do his job.

1) Really??? colluding with another country with no factual predicate NOR any benefit for that foreign country for the last 2 year and if Trump gets only 2 more years.... What did Russia get/benefit for Plotting and working together with Trump? Usually there is a benefit to doing so?


2) Attacking a Gold star Family.... emotional.... Trump is a scumbag.... But the Kahns also ratched up the partisan attacks anyone watch the DNC speech? Being a Gold Star Family DOES NOT make you better than any other citizen, While it shows your ultimate commitment to the country you chose to defend it does NOT give more rights to Attack the POTUS and NOT receive anything back, IF it was completely un provoked then TRUMP is the ultimate scumbag...... but at this point its par for the course that I have accepted when ANYONE denouces him much like CNN, much like Avennatti. Being a Gold Star family is saying that a family member gave that ULTIMATE sacrifice for the greater cause, we dont KNOW how the SON actually felt..... the Parents took it upon them selves to use the Gold Start and go to a DNC convention and denouce trump..... again... what you put out you should prepare to receive.


WHAT exactly is trump doing that is actually BAD?

What individual right has Trump taken away?
What individual Freedoms have Trump taken away?
What security and lack of protection to act has he denied for the American people
What Interest Globally has Trump gave away to another country
What Trade and Financial responsibility has Trump thrown away.


YOU CAN hate the guy the GUY is a freaking scumbag..... I get it, I AGREE. But his actions his policies are for the People. The AMERICAN people they may not be moral, emotional, But many of the policies have the INTEREST of the AMERICAN PEOPLE FIRST. Trade, Security, Finances etc....... Hate the guy but as a POTUS his responsibilities are LAID out in the constitution and he seems to be checking boxes..... WHILE NOT respectfully nor eloquently (these are virtues NOT job requirements) HE is doing this for the USA........PERIOD?

Captain Adverse said:

The question is, are you unsure about your position when it comes to the Trump Administration or have you settled firmly for or against it?

It seems to me that most of the Forum Membership has taken a stand for one side or the other, either firm opposition or firm support.

Yet we have thread after thread of Anti-Administration and Pro-Administration opinions from several of the most avid opponents/supporters acting as if these posts are changing anyone's minds.

So here we are in the second year of the Administration with the Mid-Terms coming up, and I'd like to see if anyone has no opinion one way or the other.

Why? Hopefully to see how polarized our Forum's microcosm of America is and if there is actually any real wiggle room at this point to justify all the love/hate posts.

Maybe we could turn from that to some more balanced "Focused Issue" posts to debate the merits of specific political actions, rather than the constant 'I hate/I Love" posts flooding the Forum on a daily basis.

So we have four simple options:

NO, I Support the current Administration, and have seen nothing to change my mind.

NO, I Oppose the current Administration, and have seen nothing to change my mind.

I am Indifferent to the current Administration, but am open to persuasion.

Other (Explain).

To open with, I will vote I Support the current Administration for all the reasons I've already posted in this Forum over the past 2 years.

While I recognize President Trump has some faults, including shooting from the hip sometimes without considering what he has said, I also see him as trying his best to actually keep as many of his campaign promises and doing this successfully. That is something rare in past Presidents. So knowing that he is not a smooth-talking "politician," I can forgive that relatively minor problem in exchange for his actions speaking louder than his words.

So what do YOU think?

Click to expand...

That was actually a very tough poll question for me to answer. I finally decided on, yes I am on the fence. But there are many, many variables to that poll question. I'm not sure I even understand your question entirely. Are you referring more to Trump's policies, Republican policies, or, are you referring more to the numerous investigations where Trump may have actually done something wrong, legal wise? I think the huge majority of his policies are fine. I don't ever agree with anyone 100%. I think the huge majority of Republican policies are fine. Yes, Trump is an obnoxious bullying son of a bitch with a big mouth and a lot of tall tales and he loves to make himself look good. I really don't care about that. I care about the bottom line and the bottom line only and the bottom line is actually pretty damn good. And, the left is severely infected with TDS. I'm willing to have a reasonable conversation with the left about this subject (highly unlikely the left can actually be reasonable since they ARE infected with TDS) but I'm not for destroying Trump and his administration and replacing it with those infected with TDS and letting the deep state win. That's not going to happen. The biggest problem I have with the left on this forum is that they take reasonable conversation as your surrender and start hitting you with their conversion therapy as in if you see even one of their points then surely you will see all of their points.

Moderate Right said:

That was actually a very tough poll question for me to answer. I finally decided on, yes I am on the fence... The biggest problem I have with the left on this forum is that they take reasonable conversation as your surrender and start hitting you with their conversion therapy as in if you see even one of their points then surely you will see all of their points.

Click to expand...

"You broke my heart.." (J/K)

as a citizen i support the presidency
and recognize this presidency to be the most incompetent of my 66 years
even worse that dubya's, which i had previously believed could not be 'surpassed' for idiocy

I will not vote for a party that stands by a man with so little
integrity

yankintx said:

I will not vote for a party that stands by a man with so little
integrity

Click to expand...

so, you refuse to vote democrat because LBJ was such a lying, manipulative asshole

joko104 said:

My mind is made up - but not for Trump or Republicans - but against the Democratic Party, whose politicians all act as a block for core goals and platforms I intensely oppose. Therefore, the individual politicians no longer real matter regardless of what they say.

I oppose allowing mass immigration and the only immigrants we allow should be based upon what is good for our country - not want the potential immigrants need or want - which included no immigrants that will take vanishing blue collar jobs from Americans.

Click to expand...

Then the Natives should have kept European immigrants out. Or are you going to be inconsistent on that one?

Blue Dog said:

I’m Indifferent to the current administration. I did not vote for him, I still would not vote for him. I cannot stand the Presidents bombastic diatribes, but he is my President and I want him to succeed for the sake of the country.

Click to expand...

I would say I support the Administration where I think they are right, and oppose where I think they are wrong, and hope we have more of the former than the latter.

While I didn’t want Trump (or Hillary) as President, I was cautiously optimistic when he started. That optimism is completely gone. I disapprove of the current administration, but I voted “other” because I could still have my mind changed. And just because I dislike this administration doesn’t mean I dislike everything they do. We haven’t gotten into any new wars yet. That is a very good thing.

Trump is better than all the alternatives.

I was on the fence. My balls hurt like hell, so I voted today. :mrgreen:

President Trump is doing a great job.

He really is trying to do his best for this country.

Because of what happened in New York City yesterday, he will no doubt moderate his "colorful" language in the future.

The behavior of anti-Trump "leaders" and mobs has been outrageous. They are responsible for the uncivility that has gripped our nation. Ms. Hillary should be ashamed of herself for being such a sore loser. No defeated presidential candidate has ever been so nasty and petty and bitter. I guess that she felt entitled to the presidency. What a horrible example she has set for our youth.

Trump and his base are going to kill american citizens. Who needs Isis when we have them.