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Have you ALWAYS obtained verbal consent first?

If not, by new standards it appears you are in fact a sexual predator and assailant.

Nonsense. There are plenty of verbal cues that a person can use to determine when this is welcome. The question is when in doubt what do you do? And can you assume that the cues are identical from one woman from the next? The answer is to always err on the side of confirming first, and no.

The problem is that too many men hear about or see an example of a woman who let them get away with pushing it, or worse yet even liked their show of dominance and because they are sexist **** heads they assumed that because one woman liked it that all women are the same.
 
I believe the concept of "verbal consent" arose from the increase in sexual assaults reported on college campuses. Many of which occurred along side excessive alcohol use. Women were being assaulted while passed out, and often the defense was that she didn't "resist" Colleges tried to encourage behavior that would not result in date rape, such as do not have sex with people who are not actively agreeing to have sex with you.

I bet only about 5% of those who engage in any of the aformentioned activities have ever asked for 'verbal consent' & IMO
Kavanaugh would probably fit into that group even before many of the posters on this site.
 
No, of course not. I'm married. Consent is assumed between my wife and I.
 
A woman might say no half a dozen times until she says, Oh, God........... then you know you got her....... if you ain't never got your face slapped you didn't try hard enough... :)

lol...you're 70, I believe I read, so you kind of get a pass...but you gotta know that anyone born after '75 is gonna read that and think "said the rapist"...right? hehe
 
lol...you're 70, I believe I read, so you kind of get a pass...but you gotta know that anyone born after '75 is gonna read that and think "said the rapist"...right? hehe

It ain't rape if she consents....even after putting up a good front. I don't care how this sounds, but quite a few times "Oh, no, I shouldn't" turned into "Oh, God, don't stop!!". You can tell when a woman really means no, and when no is just a formality. I've even been slapped just before being sexually assaulted. Women are complicated. But when NO really is NO don't push it.
 
Assuming everything she says she believes (we know memories change over time) what should we do?

What should have been done the next day if she had spoken up?

1. Nothing. This has NO relevancy to being appointed to the SCOTUS

2. The day after? I think both should be required to attend classes for alcohol abuse, their parents certainly should be told, and as a safeguard he required to attend counseling on how to act towards women. Threat of prosecution for minor in possession should be used to require both to comply.
 
No, of course not. I'm married. Consent is assumed between my wife and I.

That can get a man convicted of rape. The days of assumed consent are gone.
 
What part of this do you not understand?:

https://maryland-criminallawyer.com/maryland-sex-crimes-lawyer/rape/laws/

quote:

Attempted Rape

Attempted First Degree Rape Section 3-309
If any person attempts to commit rape in the first degree, that person is guilty of a felony punishable by up to life in prison. Section 3-309.

Attempted Second Degree Rape Section 3-310

If any person attempts to commit rape in the second degree, that person is guilty of a felony punishable by up to 20 years in prison. Section 3-310.

There is no allegation in her details of attempted rape.
 
There seems a NEW standard. This is for both sexes to answer.

Have you, 100% of the time, verbally asked for consent before:
1. Kissing someone romantically - or trying to
2. Before touching someone's private parts (breasts/groin areas)
3. Before having sex (penetration)

This includes spouses, steady gf/bf and everyone else.

If not, by new standards it appears you are in fact a sexual predator and assailant.

This is an utterly ridiculous thread. People that have a personal sexual relationship together that respects one another don't have the need to say "may I please?". Aren't we taking this just a bit too far? If someone doesn't comprehend what a respectful relationship is, obviously they've never had one.
 
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It ain't rape if she consents....even after putting up a good front. I don't care how this sounds, but quite a few times "Oh, no, I shouldn't" turned into "Oh, God, don't stop!!". You can tell when a woman really means no, and when no is just a formality. I've even been slapped just before being sexually assaulted. Women are complicated. But when NO really is NO don't push it.

Those are some old rules you're playing by, bud...hehe... To a point, that's where I find the current practice judging behavior from 40+ years ago by today's standard challenging. The thing is, though, that women suffered under those rules - not all, but some. There were victims. Rapes happened. Damage was done. I feel like your last sentence denotes that you understand the difference, so I'm not gonna lecture...hopefully you understand if I don't use your analysis as a broad brush to apply against all allegations of sexual assault or harassment from that time, though. :)
 
OMG, I kissed my wife last night. I didn't ask if it was ok to do so.:lamo
 
Honey.........now that I got you all worked up, can my submarine make a crash dive?.........please?.............
 
Those are some old rules you're playing by, bud...hehe... To a point, that's where I find the current practice judging behavior from 40+ years ago by today's standard challenging. The thing is, though, that women suffered under those rules - not all, but some. There were victims. Rapes happened. Damage was done. I feel like your last sentence denotes that you understand the difference, so I'm not gonna lecture...hopefully you understand if I don't use your analysis as a broad brush to apply against all allegations of sexual assault or harassment from that time, though. :)

I suspect rape is as prevalent today as it was 40 years ago. The percentage of men who are willing to rape probably hasn't changed much over the years. The difference is today women are more willing to report it. I do, however, sympathize with men who have something come up out of the blue 40 years later with no way to really defend against it. And men have been placed in a very vulnerable position where accusations can be totally fabricated against them. They get tried in the court of public opinion with no real chance to get a fair hearing.

Not exactly sexual harassment, but a related story. Back around 2002 in the public high school I taught at we had a night janitor who came in well after the kids were gone, a black man about 40 years old, and not the brightest bulb around. But he was a natural stand up comic; he loved to tell racy jokes, and he was funny. Usually there was a group around him listening and laughing at these great stories. One of them was a black teacher who laughed along with everyone else.... until she got pissed at him for some reason. Then she turned him in to HR, threatened to sue, and in a CYA move the district fired him. He had no idea he had done anything wrong, he had a wife and kids. He was about a year from being vested in a good public pension. He**, back then none of us knew he was doing anything wrong. The district didn't warn him, they just fired him outright. After that I watched everything I said to female teachers and staff. Cut back a lot on interactions. But we also had a female counselor who kept a bottle of booze in her desk drawer and sipped all day long. That only got her an order to get rid of the bottle..... which she ignored.
 
OMG, I kissed my wife last night. I didn't ask if it was ok to do so.:lamo

People forget that Ivanka Trump had accused Trump of raping her. People scoffed, 'ha! marital rape?'. In a separate interview with Time Magazine, Ivanka was asked about allegations she reportedly made in a 1991 sworn deposition that she was raped by Trump three years previously. She later backed off of that sworn testimony saying “That was all just the lawyers' talk”. What was more likely is that he threatened to shut off her money unless she retracted her allegation. Knowing his background bloated with infidelity and debauchery, I have no doubt at all that her sworn statement was the truth.
 
There seems a NEW standard. This is for both sexes to answer.

Have you, 100% of the time, verbally asked for consent before:
1. Kissing someone romantically - or trying to
2. Before touching someone's private parts (breasts/groin areas)
3. Before having sex (penetration)

This includes spouses, steady gf/bf and everyone else.

If not, by new standards it appears you are in fact a sexual predator and assailant.

i never left home without my lawyer. if a girl tried to kiss me, better be expecting some paperwork first
 
I suspect rape is as prevalent today as it was 40 years ago. The percentage of men who are willing to rape probably hasn't changed much over the years. The difference is today women are more willing to report it. I do, however, sympathize with men who have something come up out of the blue 40 years later with no way to really defend against it. And men have been placed in a very vulnerable position where accusations can be totally fabricated against them. They get tried in the court of public opinion with no real chance to get a fair hearing.

Not exactly sexual harassment, but a related story. Back around 2002 in the public high school I taught at we had a night janitor who came in well after the kids were gone, a black man about 40 years old, and not the brightest bulb around. But he was a natural stand up comic; he loved to tell racy jokes, and he was funny. Usually there was a group around him listening and laughing at these great stories. One of them was a black teacher who laughed along with everyone else.... until she got pissed at him for some reason. Then she turned him in to HR, threatened to sue, and in a CYA move the district fired him. He had no idea he had done anything wrong, he had a wife and kids. He was about a year from being vested in a good public pension. He**, back then none of us knew he was doing anything wrong. The district didn't warn him, they just fired him outright. After that I watched everything I said to female teachers and staff. Cut back a lot on interactions. But we also had a female counselor who kept a bottle of booze in her desk drawer and sipped all day long. That only got her an order to get rid of the bottle..... which she ignored.


I agree, these are tricky times...and things aren't always handled well. But given the statistics of women who falsely allege (tried to find it the source for you, but couldn't quickly - I can keep looking if you ask me for it, though), if we believe 100% of the women, at least enough to have an investigation, we are right way more often than we are wrong. In a world where nothing is perfect, that is the most correct course of action. We need a better way of vetting accusations, and we need a more disciplined method of how these stories get out to the public. But we should not go back to the days when women were afraid to report their abusers, or just simply don't because they don't feel it will go anywhere. That's not right either.
 
I agree, these are tricky times...and things aren't always handled well. But given the statistics of women who falsely allege (tried to find it the source for you, but couldn't quickly - I can keep looking if you ask me for it, though), if we believe 100% of the women, at least enough to have an investigation, we are right way more often than we are wrong. In a world where nothing is perfect, that is the most correct course of action. We need a better way of vetting accusations, and we need a more disciplined method of how these stories get out to the public. But we should not go back to the days when women were afraid to report their abusers, or just simply don't because they don't feel it will go anywhere. That's not right either.

I don't know anyone who wants to go back to keeping it all in the closet, but I agree with you that we need a better way of shedding light on these issues than what's happening now, which is a very public three ring circus.
 
People forget that Ivanka Trump had accused Trump of raping her. People scoffed, 'ha! marital rape?'. In a separate interview with Time Magazine, Ivanka was asked about allegations she reportedly made in a 1991 sworn deposition that she was raped by Trump three years previously. She later backed off of that sworn testimony saying “That was all just the lawyers' talk”. What was more likely is that he threatened to shut off her money unless she retracted her allegation. Knowing his background bloated with infidelity and debauchery, I have no doubt at all that her sworn statement was the truth.

That still does not answer the OP question of "have you always obtained verbal consent first"?,
Interesting. You seem to take Ivanka at her word on the charge of rape against her husband Trump. Then you reject what she said That was all just the lawyers' talk”.
You can up with some conspiracy explanation of Trump threatened to shut off the money. Maybe it was just "lawyer talk".:mrgreen:
 
That still does not answer the OP question of "have you always obtained verbal consent first"?,
Interesting. You seem to take Ivanka at her word on the charge of rape against her husband Trump. Then you reject what she said That was all just the lawyers' talk”.
You can up with some conspiracy explanation of Trump threatened to shut off the money. Maybe it was just "lawyer talk".:mrgreen:

Obviously you haven't read my first response to the thread.
 
That can get a man convicted of rape. The days of assumed consent are gone.

Consent is assumed unless specifically withdrawn. There was a recent case where an older man had sex with his wife - who has dementia - and her kids by another marriage tried to get him convicted for rape because she could not consent. After giving ample evidence that they had a loving relationship the court held that her consent had never been withdrawn and thus the sex was consensual even though she could not meaningfully consent to the incident he was on trial for.
 
Many states have affirmative consent laws which means that both parties have to affirmatively agree to be intimate. Affirmative consent doesn't have to be verbal.

I've never asked permission to kiss someone or do whatever else. But if the girl even hinted that she didn't want to do whatever I was thinking we were going to do it stopped right there. This really isn't all that hard.
 
1. Nothing. This has NO relevancy to being appointed to the SCOTUS

2. The day after? I think both should be required to attend classes for alcohol abuse, their parents certainly should be told, and as a safeguard he required to attend counseling on how to act towards women. Threat of prosecution for minor in possession should be used to require both to comply.

So forget about the assault and get them counsel for alcohol.... interesting.

As to this having no bearing on a possible lifetime appointment on the highest court in the land, how can character not count?
 
There seems a NEW standard. This is for both sexes to answer.

Have you, 100% of the time, verbally asked for consent before:
1. Kissing someone romantically - or trying to
2. Before touching someone's private parts (breasts/groin areas)
3. Before having sex (penetration)

This includes spouses, steady gf/bf and everyone else.

If not, by new standards it appears you are in fact a sexual predator and assailant.

My God, don't you understand nuance? Not having the right to force yourself on someone does not translate into needing written permission. Do you not understand seduction? If not, this thread is not going to help you. Perhaps some other websites or down the hall to "Sex and Sexuality" you can get help for the boy/girl nuances.

If things are not black, that does mean they are white. Few things in the world are black or white. We live in areas of gray. To successfully navigate gray, WE have to understand when things are more black than white and more white than black. I understand that it requires some "gray matter" to navigate this world, but that is why God made most men intelligent.
 
My God, don't you understand nuance? Not having the right to force yourself on someone does not translate into needing written permission. Do you not understand seduction? If not, this thread is not going to help you. Perhaps some other websites or down the hall to "Sex and Sexuality" you can get help for the boy/girl nuances.

If things are not black, that does mean they are white. Few things in the world are black or white. We live in areas of gray. To successfully navigate gray, WE have to understand when things are more black than white and more white than black. I understand that it requires some "gray matter" to navigate this world, but that is why God made most men intelligent.

Thinking is hard.
 
That still does not answer the OP question of "have you always obtained verbal consent first"?,
Interesting. You seem to take Ivanka at her word on the charge of rape against her husband Trump. Then you reject what she said That was all just the lawyers' talk”.
You can up with some conspiracy explanation of Trump threatened to shut off the money. Maybe it was just "lawyer talk".:mrgreen:

Really clever of you to leave out that Ivanka herself said it didn't happen and it was only a divorce tactic. :roll:
 
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