Military budget

In 2017, $632 billion was spent on the US armed forces which took up 15% of the total federal budget. 4,497 American troops died in Iraq and 2,216 died in Afghanistan. In addition to this, the US has carried out drone strikes in Yemen and helped overthrow the government of Libya back in 2011. Some say that this is worth it to maintain democracy and stability around the world while others question the need for such foreign intervention.

Masterhawk said:

In 2017, $632 billion was spent on the US armed forces which took up 15% of the total federal budget. 4,497 American troops died in Iraq and 2,216 died in Afghanistan. In addition to this, the US has carried out drone strikes in Yemen and helped overthrow the government of Libya back in 2011. Some say that this is worth it to maintain democracy and stability around the world while others question the need for such foreign intervention.

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And what do you say?

Masterhawk said:

In 2017, $632 billion was spent on the US armed forces which took up 15% of the total federal budget. 4,497 American troops died in Iraq and 2,216 died in Afghanistan. In addition to this, the US has carried out drone strikes in Yemen and helped overthrow the government of Libya back in 2011. Some say that this is worth it to maintain democracy and stability around the world while others question the need for such foreign intervention.

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When young people are sent into harms way to fight a war/conflict by a American government largely made up of cowardly politicians who never served a single day themselves, and could give a rats ass whether these kids die or not?

Yeah, I think they should get the best equipment available.

RetiredUSN said:

When young people are sent into harms way to fight a war/conflict by a American government largely made up of cowardly politicians who never served a single day themselves, and could give a rats ass whether these kids die or not?

Yeah, I think they should get the best equipment available.

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That's hilarious wishful thinking.

Ever heard the saying "remember, your equipment was made by the lowest bidder?" You try to give everyone the "best equipment available" and you're not going to be able to equip very many troops. All we can hope for is equipment that is "good enough" and then complement that with personal off the shelf purchases.

StillBallin75 said:

That's hilarious wishful thinking.

Ever heard the saying "remember, your equipment was made by the lowest bidder?" You try to give everyone the "best equipment available" and you're not going to be able to equip very many troops. All we can hope for is equipment that is "good enough" and then complement that with personal off the shelf purchases.

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In fairness, the military does buy a ton of the "good stuff" for the SOTF and SMU guys. But with the majority of the DoD budget going to contracting Lockheed and Boeing there's no reasonable way the military should be expected to give the Joes things like "body armor" or "decent standards of living" we got F-35s we gotta pay for, damn it!

StillBallin75 said:

That's hilarious wishful thinking.

Ever heard the saying "remember, your equipment was made by the lowest bidder?" You try to give everyone the "best equipment available" and you're not going to be able to equip very many troops. All we can hope for is equipment that is "good enough" and then complement that with personal off the shelf purchases.

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Tell that to the Navy who uses Fairbanks Morse, Babcock & Wilcox, Alco, General Motors, General Electric and other top of the line propulsion systems.

You don't know what you are talking about if you make that claim.

well the military/industrial complex in America has a huge lobby in congress. Not much chance of our bought and paid for representatives making any appreciable cuts to that spending.

that is unless we do something to eliminate all that corporate money in our political system.

rickc said:

well the military/industrial complex in America has a huge lobby in congress. Not much chance of our bought and paid for representatives making any appreciable cuts to that spending.

that is unless we do something to eliminate all that corporate money in our political system.

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Are you suggesting we return the excess taxes back to the taxpayers?

American said:

Are you suggesting we return the excess taxes back to the taxpayers?

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i believe we should apply it to our deficit spending first. once we are paying the bills without putting it on the credit card we can talk about tax cuts. the discussion on taxes should be how much we need to raise them and how where we can pay our bills.

CMPancake said:

In fairness, the military does buy a ton of the "good stuff" for the SOTF and SMU guys. But with the majority of the DoD budget going to contracting Lockheed and Boeing there's no reasonable way the military should be expected to give the Joes things like "body armor" or "decent standards of living" we got F-35s we gotta pay for, damn it!

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Yep, I was also going to make this exact point. Congress and the military industrial complex are so enamored with their sexy toys for the "blue" services that the average Army or Marine infantryman often gets overlooked. As of right now, just from the perspective of a dumb grunt, I'm not dissatisfied with my gear, but I bet if they put as much R&D into infantry equipment as they did into the ****ing JSF we'd be kitted out like Tom Clancy's Ghosts by now.

We are the world's policeman. We do get involved in wars we shouldn't have been involved in. It does make us look like aggressors. I would prefer we down size the mission so we could down size the force. Then make sure that force is well equipped. Other developed democratic countries need to step up in their respective regions. Australia and New Zealand should be the ones holding joint military exercises with the South Koreans, not the USA. The Europeans should be defending themselves against perceived Russian aggression. We have over 800 foreign military bases. We should close most of them.

Waddy said:

We are the world's policeman. We do get involved in wars we shouldn't have been involved in. It does make us look like aggressors. I would prefer we down size the mission so we could down size the force. Then make sure that force is well equipped. Other developed democratic countries need to step up in their respective regions. Australia and New Zealand should be the ones holding joint military exercises with the South Koreans, not the USA. The Europeans should be defending themselves against perceived Russian aggression. We have over 800 foreign military bases. We should close most of them.

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i can agree with that.

we should not send our young men and women into harms way to protect or expand corporate profits.

we should not send our young men and women into harms way without a defined goal. they should never be used as a police force occupying a hostile country. if we send them then we let loose the dogs of.war and let them finish the job.

Congress needs to declare war instead of the president using our troops to improve his polls with his base.

a smaller and well equipped military could be both more effective and less expensive.

we shouldn't be the policeman of the world. we shouldn't stick our nose where it doesn't belong. it always ends badly.

just let the world know leaving us alone is most definitely in your best interest. walk softly and carry a big stick. all this saber rattling is just about to start another cold war.

There has always been a political component of military spending. Always will be. Politicians are going to fight for their slice of the pie. And frankly...thats one of the things that gets the peacetime military the support from civilians that it enjoys. It also allows us to maintain a relatively stable force that isnt in constant shut down/build up mode.

Anyone that has ever been involved with spending military dollars knows how wasteful the system can be. Hell...we dont even have a budget passed so we are constantly operating under CR. So rather than adequately forecasting an annual budget, we put off spending in the first 4 months because we dont know if we are going to get ANY money at all and then we have a crush to spend all or most of it by 31July before they start threatening to pull it back. And if you are fortunate to get that windfall at the end of the yea with fallout money, we go right back into spend mode. We are penalized if we are thrifty, rewarded if we 'spend with style'. Theres billions wasted in 'training' that is ineffective or just fills squares. The military contracting process is ridiculous...all a contractor has to do is sell a concept and the fed funds the development of the concept with no guarantee they are actually going to buy anything at all.

All that being said...we still do alright. No one is getting drafted and we all know what we signed up for THE second time, if we didnt know the first time.

LOL. Even the uber liberal Black Caucus voted 85% for the new bloated budget. Why? That huge bloated wasteland is where Deepies and Swampies go to make a fortune after "serving" in congress....WASH DC is 63 sqmi of SWAMP.

Government contractors have it down to a science; spread the component parts production of that new piece of military hardware over as many Congressional districts as possible. Place the assembly plant in one of the most important districts if possible. That guarantees enough votes to get it funded. Hire the military officers who have roles in the approval process for the project on as consultants or employees upon their retirement from the military. And try to make sure every important Congressional district has a major military base which will get some of the new big ticket equipment items.

This system works, even though it means the military sometimes gets military hardware that they really don't need, don't want, and often isn't the best piece of equipment out there.

And having a mission to fight wars on multiple fronts, over 800 bases to defend globally, and being the world's police force means that you will be needing lots and lots of hardware.

And it does make the USA the world's biggest arms dealer. We ain't going to be beating swords into plowshares any time soon......

Waddy said:

Government contractors have it down to a science; spread the component parts production of that new piece of military hardware over as many Congressional districts as possible. Place the assembly plant in one of the most important districts if possible. That guarantees enough votes to get it funded. Hire the military officers who have roles in the approval process for the project on as consultants or employees upon their retirement from the military. And try to make sure every important Congressional district has a major military base which will get some of the new big ticket equipment items.

This system works, even though it means the military sometimes gets military hardware that they really don't need, don't want, and often isn't the best piece of equipment out there.

And having a mission to fight wars on multiple fronts, over 800 bases to defend globally, and being the world's police force means that you will be needing lots and lots of hardware.

And it does make the USA the world's biggest arms dealer. We ain't going to be beating swords into plowshares any time soon......

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"This system works"...lol. 17 years fighting goat herders in Afghanistan and Iraq. Yeah, it works. MURICA!!!

Vladimir Putin said:

"This system works"...lol. 17 years fighting goat herders in Afghanistan and Iraq. Yeah, it works. MURICA!!!

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Who better to try out all that new weaponry on...... it isn't like we can try it out on the Russians or Chinese. Get with the program, bubba. You just ain't tryin' hard enough...