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If we legalized pot...

If we legalized pot, how would that affect usage?

  • Way more people would use it.

    Votes: 11 21.2%

  • More people would use it, but it would not be a significant increase

    Votes: 32 61.5%

  • About the same number of people, but they'd all smoke a lot more

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • No change at all

    Votes: 5 9.6%

  • Usage would actually decrease.

    Votes: 4 7.7%
  • Total voters
    52
MrWonka said:
If we legalized weed, pot, marijuana... whatever you want to call it... How do you think it would affect the usage of it? Would a lot more people use it? A lot fewer? About the same? Would they use more?
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People would use less because the pot would be much stronger.

You'd have to be high to purchase much of the weed available on the street today.
 
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Waddy said:
Where we would see a great increase is in underage usage. The biggest problem with legalizing pot is determining driver impairment. With alcohol there is a field administered breathalyzer test and a standard of .08, so it is fairly easy to determine a legal limit and if someone is over that limit. How do you set a "legal limit" on pot impairment? How do you measure it in the field? How do you set insurance rates? Accident criminal liability?

If you legalize pot and it's use becomes widespread, who pays for rehab when someone becomes addicted, even psychologically, and wants or needs to quit? I would ask these same questions about legalizing all drugs.

If legalizing pot or even all drugs wouldn't effect me as a taxpayer or as a driver who must share the road, then I wouldn't care what was legal. I think it's bad enough that I have to pay in so many ways for people who abuse alcohol. But at least with alcohol we have some way to set legal limits and liability.

I might add that legalization will not eliminate the illegal sellers. They can easily undersell the legal market, as is the case in most things.
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Canada's got an app for that in anticipation of legalization:

https://globalnews.ca/news/2654416/police-across-canada-to-test-new-pot-detecting-devices/

And yes, illegal sellers won't be eliminated, but it will divert much of the black market income; marijuana has proven an absolute boom for the economy and tax coffers of Colorado as an example, while granting ample additional resources to deal with any criminal fallout ( https://www.forbes.com/sites/monazh...boon-to-the-economy-finds-study/#4e77e44ee9d9 | https://www.denverpost.com/2018/01/11/colorado-police-marijuana-tax-revenue/ ). There are certainly some hiccups, but keep in mind that this study was conducted soon after legalization, and there's still a great deal that can be done to further improve even these good outcomes.
 
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I doubt many more adults would take it up, but I would worry about kids.
 
Surrealistik said:
Canada's got an app for that in anticipation of legalization:

https://globalnews.ca/news/2654416/police-across-canada-to-test-new-pot-detecting-devices/

And yes, illegal sellers won't be eliminated, but it will divert much of the black market income; marijuana has proven an absolute boom for the economy and tax coffers of Colorado as an example, while granting ample additional resources to deal with any criminal fallout ( https://www.forbes.com/sites/monazh...boon-to-the-economy-finds-study/#4e77e44ee9d9 | https://www.denverpost.com/2018/01/11/colorado-police-marijuana-tax-revenue/ ). There are certainly some hiccups, but keep in mind that this study was conducted soon after legalization, and there's still a great deal that can be done to further improve even these good outcomes.
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Is this just another way to exploit minorities? And kids?

"Colorado has seen an increase in marijuana related traffic deaths, poison control calls, and emergency room visits. The marijuana black market has increased in Colorado, not decreased. And, numerous Colorado marijuana regulators have been indicted for corruption.

In 2012, we were promised funds from marijuana taxes would benefit our communities, particularly schools. Dr. Harry Bull, the Superintendent of Cherry Creek Schools, one of the largest school districts in the state, said, "So far, the only thing that the legalization of marijuana has brought to our schools has been marijuana."

In fiscal year 2016, marijuana tax revenue resulted in $156,701,018. The total tax revenue for Colorado was $13,327,123,798, making marijuana only 1.18% of the state's total tax revenue. The cost of marijuana legalization in public awareness campaigns, law enforcement, healthcare treatment, addiction recovery, and preventative work is an unknown cost to date.........

According to the Colorado Department of Public Safety, arrests in Colorado of black and Latino youth for marijuana possession have increased 58% and 29% respectively after legalization. This means that Black and Latino youth are being arrested more for marijuana possession after it became legal.

Furthermore, a vast majority of Colorado's marijuana businesses are concentrated in neighborhoods of color. Leaders from these communities, many of whom initially voted to legalize recreational marijuana, often speak out about the negative impacts of these businesses."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...galize-nationally-jeff-hunt-column/536010001/
 
Waddy said:
Is this just another way to exploit minorities? And kids?

"Colorado has seen an increase in marijuana related traffic deaths, poison control calls, and emergency room visits. The marijuana black market has increased in Colorado, not decreased. And, numerous Colorado marijuana regulators have been indicted for corruption.

In 2012, we were promised funds from marijuana taxes would benefit our communities, particularly schools. Dr. Harry Bull, the Superintendent of Cherry Creek Schools, one of the largest school districts in the state, said, "So far, the only thing that the legalization of marijuana has brought to our schools has been marijuana."

In fiscal year 2016, marijuana tax revenue resulted in $156,701,018. The total tax revenue for Colorado was $13,327,123,798, making marijuana only 1.18% of the state's total tax revenue. The cost of marijuana legalization in public awareness campaigns, law enforcement, healthcare treatment, addiction recovery, and preventative work is an unknown cost to date.........

According to the Colorado Department of Public Safety, arrests in Colorado of black and Latino youth for marijuana possession have increased 58% and 29% respectively after legalization. This means that Black and Latino youth are being arrested more for marijuana possession after it became legal.

Furthermore, a vast majority of Colorado's marijuana businesses are concentrated in neighborhoods of color. Leaders from these communities, many of whom initially voted to legalize recreational marijuana, often speak out about the negative impacts of these businesses."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...galize-nationally-jeff-hunt-column/536010001/
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For one, let me state my astonishment at the right's (and your) sudden alarm at the impact on minorities. That having been said, the majority of the article fails to actually quantify harm with verifiable stats barring these arrest rates (and usage rates if you consider those a negative), with most of its broad assertions being contradicted in the source study linked below. That having been said, looking at arrest rates for minority youth does not adequately capture or portray the net benefit or lackthereof of the marijuana industry to these demographics; there are other important elements to be considered when assessing overall harm/benefit, such as health or therapeutic benefits, employment from the industry and social services funded by its tax receipts.

Also, marijuana tax revenue was underestimated/understated by the article, as the total for 2016 was $193,604,810.


Second, additional costs cited by the study in the Forbes article linked, totaled approximately $23 million (between law enforcement and social services; source study: https://www.csupueblo.edu/institute-of-cannabis-research/index.html ), so there is in actuality a fairly sound assessment of the approximate costs; roughly a 39.65% expense ratio.

Moreover, the study's findings as to legalization's economic benefits are conservative due to their exclusive of wholesale marijuana sales, and are limited to Pueblo county, with a net return estimated at $100 million for the county by 2021: https://www.denverpost.com/2018/03/12/colorado-state-university-pueblo-marijuana-economy-study/ | Study: https://www.csupueblo.edu/institute...oc/2017-ICR-impact-study.pdf?pdf=impact-study

Also notable is the completion of this study in December 2017, well after the authoring of your source article.

If these findings can be extrapolated even roughly to the rest of the state, the overall benefit of marijuana legalization is absolutely unmistakable.

As of 2017, $247,368,473 in marijuana tax revenue was collected from total sales of $1,507,702,219, putting it at 1.78% of all taxes between state and local; a whopping 22.91% increase of that ratio over last year (using the govt numbers), and a 27.76% increase in marijuana tax receipts vs 2016: https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/revenue/colorado-marijuana-tax-data | https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/sites/default/files/2017_Annual_Report.pdf . Continued rapid growth in marijuana receipts and their proportion of state tax revenue appears to be likely.
 
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I just spent the weekend in California, didn't notice anyone smoking pot, or that they were high, or anything.

Same as when I go to Colorado, or Nevada.

Legalize it everywhere
 
Surrealistik said:
For one, let me state my astonishment at the right's (and your) sudden alarm at the impact on minorities. That having been said, the majority of the article fails to actually quantify harm with verifiable stats barring these arrest rates (and usage rates if you consider those a negative), with most of its broad assertions being contradicted in the source study linked below. That having been said, looking at arrest rates for minority youth does not adequately capture or portray the net benefit or lackthereof of the marijuana industry to these demographics; there are other important elements to be considered when assessing overall harm/benefit, such as health or therapeutic benefits, employment from the industry and social services funded by its tax receipts.

Also, marijuana tax revenue was underestimated/understated by the article, as the total for 2016 was $193,604,810.


Second, additional costs cited by the study in the Forbes article linked, totaled approximately $23 million (between law enforcement and social services; source study: https://www.csupueblo.edu/institute-of-cannabis-research/index.html ), so there is in actuality a fairly sound assessment of the approximate costs; roughly a 39.65% expense ratio.

Moreover, the study's findings as to legalization's economic benefits are conservative due to their exclusive of wholesale marijuana sales, and are limited to Pueblo county, with a net return estimated at $100 million for the county by 2021: https://www.denverpost.com/2018/03/12/colorado-state-university-pueblo-marijuana-economy-study/ | Study: https://www.csupueblo.edu/institute...oc/2017-ICR-impact-study.pdf?pdf=impact-study

Also notable is the completion of this study in December 2017, well after the authoring of your source article.

If these findings can be extrapolated even roughly to the rest of the state, the overall benefit of marijuana legalization is absolutely unmistakable.

As of 2017, $247,368,473 in marijuana tax revenue was collected from total sales of $1,507,702,219, putting it at 1.78% of all taxes between state and local; a whopping 22.91% increase of that ratio over last year (using the govt numbers), and a 27.76% increase in marijuana tax receipts vs 2016: https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/revenue/colorado-marijuana-tax-data | https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/sites/default/files/2017_Annual_Report.pdf . Continued rapid growth in marijuana receipts and their proportion of state tax revenue appears to be likely.
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let me state my astonishment at the left's (and your) sudden concern with tax and it's impact. But then again you all always are for more taxation. And more spending, in this case on the increased social services brought about by increased use of the drug. I'm also astonished with your unconcern that most of the marijuana outlets are in minority communities and your disregard for increased juvenile arrest rates. But I guess if it increases tax revenues it's OK to sacrifice our young people. Gotta pay the price of progress.
 
MrWonka said:
If we legalized weed, pot, marijuana... whatever you want to call it... How do you think it would affect the usage of it? Would a lot more people use it? A lot fewer? About the same? Would they use more?
Click to expand...

We have legalized it, so we can go find out factually what happens, there is no need to guess.

One hopes the geniuses have been tracking this, but with as bad as a lot of their work often is now...
 
Waddy said:
let me state my astonishment at the left's (and your) sudden concern with tax and it's impact. But then again you all always are for more taxation. And more spending, in this case on the increased social services brought about by increased use of the drug. I'm also astonished with your unconcern that most of the marijuana outlets are in minority communities and your disregard for increased juvenile arrest rates. But I guess if it increases tax revenues it's OK to sacrifice our young people. Gotta pay the price of progress.
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As stated, juvenile arrest rates by themselves are not nearly an adequate measure of overall benefit and harm; recognizing this as fact isn't to disregard or dismiss that this is an unfortunate reality, whether or not actually caused by legalization (correlation not being causation) which should be addressed and tackled. That said, while it's _possible_ certain demographics are being harmed in net by the change, that has not been convincingly demonstrated, and certainly not by a one off statistic. Further, I'm not sure why I should think that marijuana outlets being in minority communities is necessary a bad thing, particularly as these provide good jobs: http://www.mjpolicygroup.com/pubs/MPG Impact of Marijuana on Colorado-Final.pdf

What _is_ certain and clearly demonstrated however, is the massive and rapidly growing economic and public service benefits of the marijuana industry, in addition to people having greater liberty over what they do with themselves and their body.
 
MrWonka said:
If we legalized weed, pot, marijuana... whatever you want to call it... How do you think it would affect the usage of it? Would a lot more people use it? A lot fewer? About the same? Would they use more?
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I think way more people would use for recreational and medicinal use if the fear of being sent to jail or prison is no longer there. That said whether or not more or less people would use it is no reason to keep it illegal. Because I am sure alcohol is responsible for more deaths and assaults if we were to compare the same number of potheads to alcoholics.
 
I said there would be no change. Most people who want to smoke do so anyway, like me, for instance. I wouldn't smoke any more if it was fully legal. Wouldn't smoke any less either.
 
MrWonka said:
If we legalized weed, pot, marijuana... whatever you want to call it... How do you think it would affect the usage of it? Would a lot more people use it? A lot fewer? About the same? Would they use more?
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In the short term, I think you'd see a surge in usage.

In the long term, I think you'd see it slightly increased compared to now, but not much more. I think most of those who smoke currently would continue to do so. I think there's a portion of people who would smoke if it didn't have the illegal stigma, but I don't think their usage would be significant (if it would be, they'd probably already be using despite the stigma). I also think there's a large amount of people that would rarely, if ever, smoke because they just don't have any desire to. I also think there's a small segment of users that do it in large part because it's anti-authority and would be more apt to find something else, as the feeling they chase is not simply from the chemicals of the drug itself.

So tl;dr

Short term, definite spike. Long term, moderate increase.
 
It would depend on whether there was something put in place to stop employers from drug testing for it.

If there was I think usage would go up a lot.

If not I think it would only go up slightly.
 
Those who already smoke will transition to vaping material like wax, shatter and oil and edibles. Taking smoking out of the equation will reduce cancer, emphysema and such. That's an overlooked benefit of legalization. Perhaps those avoided medical costs should be accounted for in a financial impact study. It's not just taxes, freeing up police/justice system resources and taking profit from gangs.

And what about the suffering avoided by the transition.
 
Surrealistik said:
As stated, juvenile arrest rates by themselves are not nearly an adequate measure of overall benefit and harm; recognizing this as fact isn't to disregard or dismiss that this is an unfortunate reality, whether or not actually caused by legalization (correlation not being causation) which should be addressed and tackled. That said, while it's _possible_ certain demographics are being harmed in net by the change, that has not been convincingly demonstrated, and certainly not by a one off statistic. Further, I'm not sure why I should think that marijuana outlets being in minority communities is necessary a bad thing, particularly as these provide good jobs: http://www.mjpolicygroup.com/pubs/MPG Impact of Marijuana on Colorado-Final.pdf

What _is_ certain and clearly demonstrated however, is the massive and rapidly growing economic and public service benefits of the marijuana industry, in addition to people having greater liberty over what they do with themselves and their body.
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Juveniles are not buying pot illegally any more or less than before. Legally they are NOT. These places are buttoned down tight and ask to see ID when you walk in and then when you pay. They are way toooooo careful because it's a tenuous, new deal with the state and they dont want to lose their licenses.

So in WA St...there should be no change in juvenile use unless parents decide to buy it for them for medicinal purposes.
 
MrWonka said:
If we legalized weed, pot, marijuana... whatever you want to call it... How do you think it would affect the usage of it? Would a lot more people use it? A lot fewer? About the same? Would they use more?
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Legalized here in Colorado already...it doesnt bother me...the state now is swimming in tax revenue.
 
Zyphlin said:
In the short term, I think you'd see a surge in usage.

In the long term, I think you'd see it slightly increased compared to now, but not much more. I think most of those who smoke currently would continue to do so. I think there's a portion of people who would smoke if it didn't have the illegal stigma, but I don't think their usage would be significant (if it would be, they'd probably already be using despite the stigma). I also think there's a large amount of people that would rarely, if ever, smoke because they just don't have any desire to. I also think there's a small segment of users that do it in large part because it's anti-authority and would be more apt to find something else, as the feeling they chase is not simply from the chemicals of the drug itself.

So tl;dr

Short term, definite spike. Long term, moderate increase.
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If it continues to work for chronic pain...because it definitely does work short term...then I dont see why those people who find it works wont keep using it. And why more wont use it for that purpose, except that right now it is fairy expensive.

The thing I'm not sure about tho, is if you build a tolerance to the pot's pain relieving properties like you do with opiods. If so, the it gets way more expensive and may not be worth it.
 
Felis Leo said:
Yes, I think so. It certainly happened in Colorado following the legalization of cannabis consumption. When any drug or substance is not merely decriminalized, but legalized (i.e., allowing for people to openly advertise the sale and use of these drugs) I think more people will be subject to the pressure of their peers to engage in its use as a rite of passage, to fit in, and of course for simple curiosity as well as for the sheer pleasure of consuming the drug. And now young people who would otherwise be ambivalent about using the drug but do not want to be on the outs with their peers will not even have the excuse "I don't think so; I don't want to get in trouble" to lean on. It is the same with alcohol, in that young men and women are pressured by their peers (and sometimes their families) to engage in its consumption as their rite of passage into adulthood.

That is just speculation on my part, but I think there is some evidence to support it. When any drug is legalized and companies can advertise heavily to the public, whether it is alcohol, cigarettes or other drugs, its use will almost certainly increase.
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Usage didnt increase, just everyone and their brother that does use, moved here.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
My guess is there would be a bit of an increase but not huge. Most people who want to use weed now are using weed now. I think you would also see a corresponding decrease in alcohol consumption.
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This is what I put. Not a huge increase. Maybe people do it to try it, and then they realize it's not really that big of a deal, and all it does is make you hungry and make you drive really slow.
 
Superfly said:
This is what I put. Not a huge increase. Maybe people do it to try it, and then they realize it's not really that big of a deal, and all it does is make you hungry and make you drive really slow.
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It has a lot of value for pain relief and as a sleep aid. That's more the cbd use.
 
Superfly said:
Kids are already smoking it. If you find a kid who says they haven't smoked pot, I'll show you a kid who is lying their ass off.
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Yup. And it's still not legal for minors where it has been legalized.

And these places are locked down tight and checking IDs constantly. They have a million rules and regulations to follow and are playing it really safe so they dont lose their licenses. They know they are under a microscope.
 
Lursa said:
It has a lot of value for pain relief and as a sleep aid. That's more the cbd use.
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My husband looked into it when he had cancer. Unfortunately, it's legal to use it here medicinally, but you can't buy it here, and you can't buy it in another state without a prescription, and if you can buy it, you can't bring it across state lines back here. :lol: ****ed up.
 
Superfly said:
My husband looked into it when he had cancer. Unfortunately, it's legal to use it here medicinally, but you can't buy it here, and you can't buy it in another state without a prescription, and if you can buy it, you can't bring it across state lines back here. :lol: ****ed up.
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So sorry, such useless, pointless laws.
 
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