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If we legalized pot...

If we legalized pot, how would that affect usage?

  • Way more people would use it.

    Votes: 11 21.2%

  • More people would use it, but it would not be a significant increase

    Votes: 32 61.5%

  • About the same number of people, but they'd all smoke a lot more

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • No change at all

    Votes: 5 9.6%

  • Usage would actually decrease.

    Votes: 4 7.7%
  • Total voters
    52
Superfly said:
Kids are already smoking it. If you find a kid who says they haven't smoked pot, I'll show you a kid who is lying their ass off.
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I was a kid that never smoked it, I know a bunch of kids that don't, your vision is cloudy. Not everyone tries everything, there are those that are independent thinkers, you sell the short.
 
lefty louie said:
I was a kid that never smoked it, I know a bunch of kids that don't, your vision is cloudy. Not everyone tries everything, there are those that are independent thinkers, you sell the short.
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Uh huh.
 
Lursa said:
Uh huh.
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Don't know if you're agreeing or being sarcastic. But if someone thinks that "EVERY" kid does it they are sad. There are hundreds of thousands of kids with strong religious backgrounds alone that don't. I'd say it's a fair bet to say any number of NERDS also don't and have never tried it.
 
lefty louie said:
Don't know if you're agreeing or being sarcastic. But if someone thinks that "EVERY" kid does it they are sad. There are hundreds of thousands of kids with strong religious backgrounds alone that don't. I'd say it's a fair bet to say any number of NERDS also don't and have never tried it.
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Given how easy pot is to get now, I think you're contradicting yourself...if they are not smoking it now, they won't when it's legal - which, by the way, would still include a prohibition for kids.

Also, not sure where you went to school, but at my high school it was the "NERDS" who always had the best dope... :lol:
 
Lursa said:
Why not just check with the stats in the states where it is legal?
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A reasonable approach. However, while an unlawful substance, marijuana use can only be estimated. The accuracy of those estimations, questionable.

When purchasing a home that needs massive work before being livable, because the price was right, the contractor's estimate really means bankruptcy.
 
Many very interesting comments.

I have a medical prescription. I prefer marijauna to opioids, sedatives, and other analgesics (for which I also have prescriptions). The nearest dispensary is in Manhattan. I still buy from a local unlawful dealer, who has better quality at lower prices, and he delivers with no paperwork. My medicare Part D does not cover my marijuana prescription. :)

I have no idea what to expect from legalization, which is now finally in the legislative works here. Living in one of the nation's highest taxed states, I doubt if the tax revenues will be more than a minor blip on the local radar, and the politicians will use it as an excuse to spend more than the revenues gained.

I have no method to verify what my dealer tells me. He does say that he is seeing surplus from Colorado growers (and other lawful growing states) appearing in the black market here, a growing presence, as Colorado usage levels off, and that has reduced his costs, and what he charges. I have witnessed a $50 per ounce drop for high test strains over the past year from him. An ounce lasts me 6-7 weeks, and my wife indulges occasionally.

I have 16 grandchildren with who I do my best to maintain honest and open relationships, aged 3 1/2 to 17. I do my best to refrain from negative judgment, endorsing and encouraging positive decisions by them, and not passing on to their parents conversations between us when they wanted discretion. (obviously, if there is something a parent needs to know, it happens) So far, two of the older girls told me they've tried pot, but didn't like the choking, the smell, the taste, the interference with their athletic abilities, and so on. I believe them, but that is open to change. I expected to first hear about usage from one of the boys. So far no, and they all know I indulge. A few of my older nephews and nieces have told me they've tried some, but most being very goal oriented, didn't make much of the experience. One complained it made him feel lazy, he didn't have time for that.

Wild marijuana grows throughout upstate NY, the middle states and New England. The deer love it. The THC content is relatively low.
 
OlNate said:
I said way more people will use it. With the stigma removed, you'd see a lot more people trying it, recreationally, but especially medicinally. I think you'd have a lot more people be honest about whether or not they use it, if it was legal, so I expect that would cause numbers to jump as well - I realize that's not exactly what you're asking, but that would be responsible for part of a statistical uptick as well.
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I think that jump would happen, but it would be temporary. Like cigarettes, people eventually wean themselves from expensive harmful substances.
 
jimbo said:
I think that jump would happen, but it would be temporary. Like cigarettes, people eventually wean themselves from expensive harmful substances.
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Mmm...not sure you're comparing apples and oranges. There are a lot more reasons for people to enjoy pot than cigarettes, and given that pot isn't limited to recreational uses, but has a wide variety of medicinal uses as well, as well as having available consumption methods that are far healthier than cigarettes, I would say it has staying power.

On the recreational side I would expect to see it resemble the wine market most closely - with as many varieties of pot as there are, with noticeably different characteristics in both effect and flavor. With legalization all but complete up here, I've started hearing about, and being invited to, adult social gatherings that feature pot, the best of these being held by seniors - retired professionals, mind you, not the washed out hippies one might assume - in very nice settings. I think people will dig having a chill option with which to relax with friends, get that buzz on, without worrying about embarrassing themselves like with alcohol.

I think it's tough to predict what the long term usage will look like, but as the stigma is removed and healthier methods of consumption are developed, I would expect this to give the alcohol industry a real run for their money.
 
I suspect it would be difficult to measure.

People who buy medicinal reefer have their names recorded in a state government data base. Who the hell trusts government? Insurance companies would slobber over that information for nefarious reasons related to denial of claims and services and the like. Law enforcement would be giddy with glee to have access to those records. So would employers and on and on.

If cannabis were to become legal at the federal level, giving states the option, I believe many medicinal users would jump ship and buy recreational so as have their names removed from the medicinal list. Also, people needing medicinal cannabis who have heretofore refused to apply for a state card due to government lists and the inherent problems listed above would likely purchase recreational.

In states where it is or will be legal to grow your own weed, counting heads (that's a pun for those old enough to remember the term "heads") is/will be a most difficult task.
 
lefty louie said:
Don't know if you're agreeing or being sarcastic. But if someone thinks that "EVERY" kid does it they are sad. There are hundreds of thousands of kids with strong religious backgrounds alone that don't. I'd say it's a fair bet to say any number of NERDS also don't and have never tried it.
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Sarcastic or at least, in disbelief.

Just because kids tell you they arent smoking pot, doing drugs, drinking, having sex....you would believe them?
 
Risky Thicket said:
I suspect it would be difficult to measure.

People who buy medicinal reefer have their names recorded in a state government data base. Who the hell trusts government? Insurance companies would slobber over that information for nefarious reasons related to denial of claims and services and the like. Law enforcement would be giddy with glee to have access to those records. So would employers and on and on.

If cannabis were to become legal at the federal level, giving states the option, I believe many medicinal users would jump ship and buy recreational so as have their names removed from the medicinal list. Also, people needing medicinal cannabis who have heretofore refused to apply for a state card due to government lists and the inherent problems listed above would likely purchase recreational.

In states where it is or will be legal to grow your own weed, counting heads (that's a pun for those old enough to remember the term "heads") is/will be a most difficult task.
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I have no idea if 'medically' prescribed pot costs less and I've read that insurance wont cover it, but if there's no price difference, why wouldnt people just go buy what they need recreationally? The choices are huge in terms of strength, CBD, THC, form to take it, etc.

It is expensive in general tho. IMO it would make for rather expensive 'recreation' and altho I do drink, it's only really expensive when we do something special like wine tasting or margarita night out.
 
The only real increase is likely to be in older people who stayed away because of employment considerations but are now retired and not subject to drug testing.

People could always get pot if they wanted it, and younger people tend to know where to get such things. Hell, in high school it was easier to get pot than it was alcohol, even though the penalties for pot were worse. In the decades since, we've seen many states decriminalize. So anyone who wanted to pretty much could find a way.


The other question is: if pot use increase, might alcohol use go down? The alcohol industry sure seems to think so. It's always opposed loosening pot laws.
 
jimbo said:
I think that jump would happen, but it would be temporary. Like cigarettes, people eventually wean themselves from expensive harmful substances.
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Cigarettes are insanely expensive! I am so glad that I hated it when I tried it in junior high. And a few times over the years.

I'd never be able to quit and I'd hate myself for spending the $.
 
OldFatGuy said:
A reasonable approach. However, while an unlawful substance, marijuana use can only be estimated. The accuracy of those estimations, questionable.

When purchasing a home that needs massive work before being livable, because the price was right, the contractor's estimate really means bankruptcy.
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I wrote to check the data in the states where it IS legal. And there are a few states now.
 
Lursa said:
Sarcastic or at least, in disbelief.

Just because kids tell you they arent smoking pot, doing drugs, drinking, having sex....you would believe them?
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Hardly, but to blanket every kid is nothing short of stupid. There were girls in HS that had sex there were some that didn't, there were guys/girls that got high, I never did and the few close friends I had didn't either. All because you did doesn't mean everyone else is like you. That would be like me saying no kids smoked pot. Stupid right?
 
lefty louie said:
Hardly, but to blanket every kid is nothing short of stupid. There were girls in HS that had sex there were some that didn't, there were guys/girls that got high, I never did and the few close friends I had didn't either. All because you did doesn't mean everyone else is like you. That would be like me saying no kids smoked pot. Stupid right?
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I responded to your specific comment that you knew lots of kids and they all told you they hadnt. That's not a blanket statement for all kids...it's about you believing the ones you spoke to.
 
Felis Leo said:
Yes, I think so. It certainly happened in Colorado following the legalization of cannabis consumption. When any drug or substance is not merely decriminalized, but legalized (i.e., allowing for people to openly advertise the sale and use of these drugs) I think more people will be subject to the pressure of their peers to engage in its use as a rite of passage, to fit in, and of course for simple curiosity as well as for the sheer pleasure of consuming the drug. And now young people who would otherwise be ambivalent about using the drug but do not want to be on the outs with their peers will not even have the excuse "I don't think so; I don't want to get in trouble" to lean on. It is the same with alcohol, in that young men and women are pressured by their peers (and sometimes their families) to engage in its consumption as their rite of passage into adulthood.

That is just speculation on my part, but I think there is some evidence to support it. When any drug is legalized and companies can advertise heavily to the public, whether it is alcohol, cigarettes or other drugs, its use will almost certainly increase.
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Yeah, I see, and it's hogwash too.
 
Felis Leo said:
Without getting into the morality or dangers of allowing the use of more mind-altering substances into the public sphere, I am not so sure legalization is better than decriminalization, in that legalization allows for the marketing of a substance, while decriminalization does not. Further, it allows the product to be everywhere more easily. But I do not think it is too far a stretch for me to say that when a product (any product) is allowed to be marketed and advertised for, its use increases dramatically. It is kind of why marketing exists. :shrug:
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You're really speaking on a subject you clearly have not studies on and are pulling out of your upbringing and partisanship, and coming off sounding very ignorant.
 
markjs said:
You're really speaking on a subject you clearly have not studies on and are pulling out of your upbringing and partisanship, and coming off sounding very ignorant.
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Perhaps I am ignorant, and perhaps I am wrong in my assumptions. However, if you aim to convince me (or anyone else) I would appreciate you citing your own non-biased studies to show that when a product (again, any product, not necessarily just drugs) is legalized and is allowed to be advertised, demand for and consumption of that product decreases or stays the same.
 
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Should have been an "other" choice.

I suspect we would see a "bloom" in use due to experimentation. Then it would settle at a level not too much higher. Then ultimately replace alcohol for many people over time as it becomes more accepted, resulting in way more people using it.

The alcohol lobby is hard at work against legalization. Along with the pharma lobby and the private prison and various law enforcement lobbies.

There are lots of oxen to be gored by full legalization. Many billions no longer being made in enforcement. Many ailments dealt with effectively without paying ransom to the shkrelli's (sic) of the world.
 
Felis Leo said:
Yes, I think so. It certainly happened in Colorado following the legalization of cannabis consumption. When any drug or substance is not merely decriminalized, but legalized (i.e., allowing for people to openly advertise the sale and use of these drugs) I think more people will be subject to the pressure of their peers to engage in its use as a rite of passage, to fit in, and of course for simple curiosity as well as for the sheer pleasure of consuming the drug. And now young people who would otherwise be ambivalent about using the drug but do not want to be on the outs with their peers will not even have the excuse "I don't think so; I don't want to get in trouble" to lean on. It is the same with alcohol, in that young men and women are pressured by their peers (and sometimes their families) to engage in its consumption as their rite of passage into adulthood.

That is just speculation on my part, but I think there is some evidence to support it. When any drug is legalized and companies can advertise heavily to the public, whether it is alcohol, cigarettes or other drugs, its use will almost certainly increase.
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I'm not sure there's as much peer pressure involved as you think. Pots around, never has been scarce, really. The drug war was always an abject failure. So kids are exposed, there is some peer pressure, but as it was never scarce in the first place, legalization won't increase peer pressure much. And people either like it or they don't. Nobody starts a pot habit to fit in. Lots of people can't smoke because of drug testing at work now. Nobody messes with them about it. Some people.don't like the high. It causes anxiety or paranoia in some. Nobody ****s with them about that either.

Pot culture is about sharing and community. It doesn't ostracize those who can't or choose not to use it.

Hell, it is common practice to ask someone who refuses the joint whether they just don't want it now or they can't or don't, so you won't pass it to them next time or remember to include them next time, if they're just not in the mood today.

And most caution adolescents to not smoke until at least 16-17 when the amotivational syndrome aspect fades or at least practice temperance in its use. I've seen this for at least twenty years now.
 
Lursa said:
I wrote to check the data in the states where it IS legal. And there are a few states now.
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Only for a short while. For such a study, years of data would be more accurate. You've got the right idea, but not enough data.
 
OldFatGuy said:
Only for a short while. For such a study, years of data would be more accurate. You've got the right idea, but not enough data.
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There is no valid data from states where it hasnt been legalized.

And thus what we have over a period of years now, from states where it has been legalized, is worthwhile.
 
Lursa said:
I responded to your specific comment that you knew lots of kids and they all told you they hadnt. That's not a blanket statement for all kids...it's about you believing the ones you spoke to.
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It would help you to know the group in the way that I do. Can't help you with that, you'll have to have some faith, if you can't then I know even more about you.
 
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