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Momentum Shift?

Have you Noticed a Shift In Momentum?

  • Total voters
    17
  • Poll closed .
camlok said:
You got that right. No courtroom quality evidence for any Arab terrorists but the sheeple believe because their lying governments tell them to believe.
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aw that was cute. but not exactly what I was talking about.
 
NeverTrumpGOP said:
aw that was cute. but not exactly what I was talking about.
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You were talking about conspiracy theories and who advances more nutty conspiracy theories than the USA.
 
By ignoring Trump's continued bad behavior, have republicans created a monster who is out of control? Or, like a 3 year old seeking negative attention, will he continue until he does something not fixable, or truly atrocious? I hope not.
 
Mach said:
WOW, that's now ENTIRELY FALSE. You're basically rejecting the entirety of the western justice system. WTF is your worldview now... moderate Jihadist?

Mueller's team is investigating what Roesenstein's order sets out for them to investigate,and it's a lot more than "Trump". It will not stop until that investigation is concluded, which likely involves all significant leads being taken to their logical conclusions, turning all witnesses and follow up all of those leads, etc., and building their database of facts and relations until it is as complete as they believe is reasonable.

It does not say to investigate Trump to some conclusion.
It does not say "get as much evidence on trump as you feel you need", then conclude.

That would likely be improper DOJ procedure. Don't quit your day job.

As they go, they can decided they have enough evidence to prosecute individuals in an order that makes sense to further the investigation. Indict one-offs and witnesses and attempt to get them to give up more information, to speed the investigation along. Since many of these criminals were lying, hiding the facts, deceiving, etc., it takes time to extract that information legally. If they were all cooperating, this would be over.

They save the potential big targets for last.

In Trump's case, since DOJ rules prevent them from bringing an indictment against a sitting president, he's likely not even technically able to be considered da "target" since they will not pursue indictment. You understand that? Even if they have him dead to rights on crimes, he could not (likely) be a target because they cannot indict.

It's further complicated by the fact that he has executive powers, may try to further derail the investigation through executive actions, and may actually use rather than simply "dangle" pardons. All of which complicates the criminal investigation into Russia's meddling and it's ties to the Trump campaign.
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A witch hunt is a witch hunt is a witch hunt. Sure, if you investigate someone (anyone) enough and continue expanding that investigation, you will eventually find something to charge every person in the US with something.
 
bearpoker said:
The left has never impugned the character or patriotism of conservatives. We think you're nuts, not evil.
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Oh please. So, you can accuse the right of being deplorables, racists, bigots, misogynists, and fighting a war against everyone but the right can't accuse the left of being unpatriotic. Glad to hear though that you believe Trump really does want to make America Great Again (IE, being a patriot). Or are you saying that Trump is not patriotic?
 
Moderate Right said:
Oh please. So, you can accuse the right of being deplorables, racists, bigots, misogynists, and fighting a war against everyone but the right can't accuse the left of being unpatriotic. Glad to hear though that you believe Trump really does want to make America Great Again (IE, being a patriot). Or are you saying that Trump is not patriotic?
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[emphasis added by bubba]
absolutely
look no further than his failure to implement lawfully effected sanctions against russia
why does he refuse to implement those bi-partisan directed sanctions?
 
Moderate Right said:
A witch hunt is a witch hunt is a witch hunt. Sure, if you investigate someone (anyone) enough and continue expanding that investigation, you will eventually find something to charge every person in the US with something.
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I accept your forfeiture.
 
justabubba said:
[emphasis added by bubba]
absolutely
look no further than his failure to implement lawfully effected sanctions against russia
why does he refuse to implement those bi-partisan directed sanctions?
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So, the right can't accuse the left of being unpatiotic but the left can accuse the right of being unpatriotic. I thought so.
 
Mach said:
I accept your forfeiture.
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They have a definition of witch hunt for a reason. If you want to get someone then you keep on investigating them and expanding the investigation until you finally find something to charge the person with. In other words, every person in the US could be arrested and jailed. That is not Democracy. That is the dictatorship you lefty Commies want, while accusing Trump of being the Commie. They found enough "evidence" in the Salem witch trials for the following:

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/...HZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzYw--?qid=20071211154743AAHVMe9
 
My take on the current situation:

End the Trump bashing and really focus on debating policy because bashing only raises the defense mechanism of Trump supporters. The media is doing itself a disservice by rushing to get negative stories about Trump out and accuracy suffers (i.e. latest MS-13 quote taken out of context, constant "anonymous sources" stories) which only reinforces the "fake news" narratives. I find Trump to be a repulsive individual having been familiar with his public life before he became a national figure, but it's important to be able to set that aside and discuss (and critique) his ideas and policies based on their merit; there's plenty to debate in that regard. Too many people are quick to want him to fail, and others too eager to claim victory.
 
Rexedgar said:
When I first started participating on the board there was an ebb and flow to the arguments between left and right. I am over simplifying the left and right tags to show supporters and detractors of the present political situation.

Those on the left looked for every misstep and highlighted it as being ‘the one.’ The ‘one’ being the straw on the camel.

I have noticed a shift in momentum, for lack of a better word. Those on the right are now highlighting every perceived flaw in the various investigations and holding them up as the ‘one.’ This ‘one’ being the straw that will cause the investigation/s to fail and exonerate the POTUS.

Anyone else notice any shift? I was going to use an offense/defense example, but couldn’t word it properly.
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Offense/defense, nothing wrong with using the term. After all, it is a game in which the players change sides depending on the outcome of our elections.
 
Rexedgar said:
When I first started participating on the board there was an ebb and flow to the arguments between left and right. I am over simplifying the left and right tags to show supporters and detractors of the present political situation.

Those on the left looked for every misstep and highlighted it as being ‘the one.’ The ‘one’ being the straw on the camel.

I have noticed a shift in momentum, for lack of a better word. Those on the right are now highlighting every perceived flaw in the various investigations and holding them up as the ‘one.’ This ‘one’ being the straw that will cause the investigation/s to fail and exonerate the POTUS.

Anyone else notice any shift? I was going to use an offense/defense example, but couldn’t word it properly.
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This began in full in December once it became glaringly obvious that the mueller investigation was going somewhere and could conceivably end with trump himself.
 
Cardinal said:
This began in full in December once it became glaringly obvious that the mueller investigation was going somewhere and could conceivably end with trump himself.
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It goes beyond that, all the way back to Nov 2016. Some were pleasantly surprised, others were shocked. The discussions about the investigations reflect as much.
 
Lovebug said:
It goes beyond that, all the way back to Nov 2016. Some were pleasantly surprised, others were shocked. The discussions about the investigations reflect as much.
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The mueller investigation began in may of 2017.
 
Cardinal said:
The mueller investigation began in may of 2017.
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My experience starts in Mar17 and for a good six months the supporters were on offense, slowly they have been forced into defending, deflecting. The climate here has shifted drastically, imo. Even non-political subjects turn political in short order,....
 
camlok said:
And it has never occurred to y'all that you are all being really played.
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I know we are being played. I compare it to WWE/WCW wrestling. Especially the part where a "wrestler" can be scum of the earth but the moment he turns good then all is forgiven. A politician can be considered scum of the earth by the media. But the moment he or she changes parties,bashes their own party(John McCain) or be hated by their own part until they run for president on their party's ticket then media acts as though that politician is no longer scum of the earth. Unlike WWE/WCW the political races are not already decided.
 
post said:
It is different this time.
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No it is not different. Using whatever excuse doesn't make it any more justified into hanging onto conspiracies about the president.The simple fact is you are upset your guy didn't win.So you hang onto what ever negative conspiracies there are about the president.Both sides do it. A handful of republicans hanged onto the conspiracy that Obama was born outside the US, white a **** load of democrats claimed Bush stole the elections or that Trump colluded with Russians.

Deplorables put a moron in the White House.
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Bashing those who voted for the opposition isn't even a new thing.Republicans bashed Obama voters, democrats bashed Bush Voters,republicans bashed Clinton voters and so on. Calling the president a moron isn't even something new.Republicans called Obama a moron, Democrats called Bush a moron and so on.
 
Likely has to do with time.

Early on in the investigation, there was a lot more confidence that something truly damning would come out that would END the presidency; this led the detractors to declare that basically everything was "the smoking gun!" and the defenders to constantly be downplaying the significance.

As the investigation goes longer, there's more confidence that nothing will end up coming out that actually gets rid of Trump. As such, the defenders of Trump are eagerly latching onto any new info to declare it as vindication to finally just move pass this, while the detractors are eagerly trying to keep the churning thing going.

I think time, breeding confidence, is the big reason for the momentum shift. I also think we're kind of at an actual mid point, where both sides are at a pretty solid, but not definite, confidence about their desired outcome. Give it another 6 months and I think the momentum will have actually gone 180, where as right now it's turned about 90 degrees from last year.
 
jamesrage said:
I know we are being played.
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And you all accept it, you, the government of the people, by the people, for the people people.

And what's worse, you all [mostly] accept the slaughter of so many innocents across the globe.
 
Rexedgar said:
Anyone else notice any shift? I was going to use an offense/defense example, but couldn’t word it properly.
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The only shift I've noticed is that this board has become majority leftist, with only fragments of substantial conservative rebuttal.
 
Zyphlin said:
Likely has to do with time.

Early on in the investigation, there was a lot more confidence that something truly damning would come out that would END the presidency; this led the detractors to declare that basically everything was "the smoking gun!" and the defenders to constantly be downplaying the significance.

As the investigation goes longer, there's more confidence that nothing will end up coming out that actually gets rid of Trump. As such, the defenders of Trump are eagerly latching onto any new info to declare it as vindication to finally just move pass this, while the detractors are eagerly trying to keep the churning thing going.

I think time, breeding confidence, is the big reason for the momentum shift. I also think we're kind of at an actual mid point, where both sides are at a pretty solid, but not definite, confidence about their desired outcome. Give it another 6 months and I think the momentum will have actually gone 180, where as right now it's turned about 90 degrees from last year.
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Breeding a false sense of confidence is the constant din of the big lie!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jill_Wine-Banks
Wine-Banks is a United States lawyer who was one of the prosecutors during the Watergate scandal.
She later served under President Jimmy Carter as the first woman to hold the position of US General Counsel of the Army
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https://twitter.com/JillWineBanks/status/999712666049490944
TrumpNunesMeetingSpyingEmmettFlood.jpg


https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-marine-one-departure-7/
Remarks by President Trump Before Marine One Departure
Issued on: May 23, 2018
...Q Mr. President — sir, what proof do you have that your campaign was spied on?

THE PRESIDENT: All you have to do is look at the basics and you’ll see. It looks like a very serious event. But we’ll find out. When they look at the documents, I think people are going to see a lot of bad things happened. I hope it’s not so, because if it is, there’s never been anything like it in the history of our country. I hope — I mean, if you look at Clapper, he sort of admitted that they had spies in the campaign, yesterday, inadvertently. But I hope it’s not true. But it looks like it is.

Q Former FBI Director, James Comey, said to use the word “spy” is the wrong word.

THE PRESIDENT: I think James Comey has got a lot of problems. If you look at what at he did, if you look at all of the lies — the tremendous lies — if you look at all that’s going on, I think James Comey has got a lot of problems. Now, at some point they have an IG report, and then let’s see what James Comey has to say. But I assume he’s covered in the IG report. But if you look at what he said — all of the lies, all of the fiction — I think he’s got a lot of problems.

Q (Inaudible) spying? Who do you think was responsible for it?

THE PRESIDENT: Well, I don’t want to get into yet, but I will tell you —

Q President Obama?

THE PRESIDENT: — after we look at the proof — would he know? I would certainly hope not. But I think it’s going to be pretty obvious after a while. ...
Q Aren’t you worried you’re undercutting the Justice Department? Why won’t you say you have confidence in Rod Rosenstein?

THE PRESIDENT: No, no. No, no. We’re not undercutting. We’re cleaning everything up. This was a terrible situation. What we’re doing is we’re cleaning everything up. It’s so important. What I’m doing is a service to this country. And I did a great service to this country by firing James Comey and —

Q Mr. President —

THE PRESIDENT: Excuse me. A lot of people have said it. And you go into the FBI, and a lot of those great people working in the FBI, they will tell you, I did a great service to our country by firing James Comey.

Q (Inaudible) meeting tomorrow with the DOJ, Congressman Nunes, Gowdy, Ed O’Callaghan, Christopher Wray, and Dan Coats, the DNI. Are you specifically telling the DOJ to give them the documents —

THE PRESIDENT: I want them all to get together and I want them — because everybody wants this solved. But a lot of bad things have happened. We now call it “Spygate.” You’re calling it “Spygate.” A lot of bad things have happened. I want them all to get together. They’ll sit in a room. Hopefully they’ll be able to work it out among themselves....

'Hitler's Hollywood' explores the lost propaganda films of German cinema
'Hitler's Hollywood' explores the lost propaganda films of German cinema
By KENNETH TURAN
| FILM CRITIC |
MAY 09, 2018 | 6:05 PM
...."Hitler's Hollywood" is especially strong in pointing out tendencies in Nazi cinema — the way it offered audiences escape from ordinary reality as well as indoctrination....
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