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Do you support the new steel and aluminum tariffs?

Do you support the proposed tariffs

  • Total voters
    78
Grand Mal said:
You have a trade surplus with Canada, both on steel and generally. Depending on how it's measured- some say you have a slight deficit.
This is going to toss a big wrench into the works. Trump's going to f**k up the NAFTA negotiations and you're going to end up standing alone, with free trade agreements all around you like networks. For one thing, under NAFTA you have favoured status access to Canadian oil. You're guaranteed a percentage of Canadian production. Without NAFTA we're back to a free market and Canada has just last year signed free trade with Europe.
We're in the TPP also, and are negotiating with Mercusor, a trade bloc involving Argentina, Brasil, Paraguay and Uruguay.
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Today Trump stated Mexico & Canada may not be as harshly treated as the rest of the worlds leaches if NAFTA negotiations
bare fruit. Canada shouldn't be worrying too much I think Trump realizes Canada's relationship with the USA for the most part
is very beneficial.
 
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slick said:
Absolutely not. But the survival of the US steel & aluminum industries are. I remember the saying that 'rooting for the NY Yankees was like rooting
for US Steel' meaning US Steel was such a powerful entity that they couldn't ever imagine a loss. Now US Steel which once was a part of an industry
which produced 60% of the worlds steel. Now we produce less than we need & 1/10th the amount of steel that China, a steel dumper on the world &
potential enemy, produces. We produce 5% of the worlds steel, in the arrogant days of our high success Pennsylvania alone produces 20% of the worlds
steel. These tariffs will insure the survival of our steel industry and hopefully make the US independent of any other state.

Trump wanted the steel needed for the Keystone Pipeline to be made here but that was not possible, maybe now future projects like that will be.
Sure there is a downside but let's face it, we're facing a 500 billion dollar trade deficit every year & every country we trade with is a partner
in this crime against the USA. We either pay now or much, much, more later.
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Do you seriously think the Canadian steel industry is a threat to the US steel industry?
 
slick said:
Today Trump stated Mexico & Canada may not be as harshly treated as the rest of the worlds leaches if NAFTA negotiations
bare fruit. Canada shouldn't be worrying too much I think Trump realizes Canada's relationship with the USA for the most part
is very beneficial.
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So it's a 'carrot and stick' ploy? 'May not' be harshly treated if negotiations 'bear fruit'.
I think it's not likely to unfold the way you're hoping. I think Canada will be satisfied to be lumped in with the 'rest of the world's leaches'. I think the Canadian and Mexican governments are more secure, more stable, and Trump and/or Congress will blink first in a protracted trade war.
 
Grand Mal said:
So it's a 'carrot and stick' ploy? 'May not' be harshly treated if negotiations 'bear fruit'.
I think it's not likely to unfold the way you're hoping. I think Canada will be satisfied to be lumped in with the 'rest of the world's leaches'. I think the Canadian and Mexican governments are more secure, more stable, and Trump and/or Congress will blink first in a protracted trade war.
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Funny stuff. Thanks for incorrectly correct my usage of 'bare' by substituting in with 'bear
'The apartment was completely bare when we moved in.'

Don't be so provincial!
 
slick said:
Funny stuff. Thanks for incorrectly correct my usage of 'bare' by substituting in with 'bear
'The apartment was completely bare when we moved in.'

Don't be so provincial!
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And your 2nd amendment is about going sleeveless, 'the right to bare arms'.
Berry bushes bear fruit. Bears strip them bare.
 
Ryan holds press conference, pushing to stop tariff proposal.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 
slick said:
Today Trump stated Mexico & Canada may not be as harshly treated as the rest of the worlds leaches if NAFTA negotiations
bare fruit. Canada shouldn't be worrying too much I think Trump realizes Canada's relationship with the USA for the most part
is very beneficial.
Click to expand...

hehe...so we don't get screwed with tariffs by allowing ourselves to be screwed in NAFTA? Trump's going to find out pretty soon that he waaaay over played his hand - we are already branching out and finding countries with money that want to do business with us all over the planet, and each time we shake hands our dependency on the American economy lessens and lessens.

This is a prime example of why, if it ain't broke, ya don't fix it. ;)
 
OldFatGuy said:
Treaties are contracts. Every contract is written to be broken. Ask any lawyer.
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I know but there is a process to break the contract, and I don't think a simple executive order is
the complete process.
 
longview said:
I know but there is a process to break the contract, and I don't think a simple executive order is
the complete process.
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It's been done before, by Roosevelt, Truman, Kennedy, and others.

Congress may ratify treaties, but they are written and signed off by the Administration. Treaties have been created and signed off by presidents without Congressional approval since Madison. They've been broken by presidents ever since Madison.

I don't recall the details, but DeGaulle demanded American military support in Algeria, pursuant to some 70 year old mutual defense pact treaty, Ike said no, and that was it. Not even an executive order.
 
I suspect this initial announcement is a bargaining position. Trump will wheel and deal on this, and it will be fine tuned. But the fact is, some countries do dump product here, which is an unfair trade practice. So the tariff is a good move overall.
 
No one will win from this, except maybe the unions. Foreign relations are damaged further, American businesses lose, American consumers lose, and maybe biggest of all American workers lose.
 
Anagram said:
Do you support Trump's new plan for a 25% tariff on imported steel and 10% on imported aluminum worldwide?

Now we know that there will probably be no exceptions for any countries, including Canada who is our largest importer of steel, so I think we have enough information to fairly judge the policy at this point. In 2017 about 70% of our steel consumed was domestically produced, with 30% imported. Many countries have already threatened at least some retaliation.

Sources: https://www.trade.gov/steel/countries/pdfs/imports-us.pdf
Trump trade adviser says no exceptions for allies on new aluminum and steel tariffs - Chicago Tribune

To give an idea of the positions of various elected officials, I quickly looked at each senator who had commented on it.

R Negative- 20


D/I Negative-7


D Positive- 5


Many unions like the AFL-CIO have also been positive on the imposition of the tariff.
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Slightly for, though we could stand to have them not be so steep and maybe not so far reaching.

Baby steps, that's all I'm saying.
 
Anagram said:
Do you support Trump's new plan for a 25% tariff on imported steel and 10% on imported aluminum worldwide?

Now we know that there will probably be no exceptions for any countries, including Canada who is our largest importer of steel, so I think we have enough information to fairly judge the policy at this point. In 2017 about 70% of our steel consumed was domestically produced, with 30% imported. Many countries have already threatened at least some retaliation.

Sources: https://www.trade.gov/steel/countries/pdfs/imports-us.pdf
Trump trade adviser says no exceptions for allies on new aluminum and steel tariffs - Chicago Tribune

To give an idea of the positions of various elected officials, I quickly looked at each senator who had commented on it.

R Negative- 20


D/I Negative-7


D Positive- 5


Many unions like the AFL-CIO have also been positive on the imposition of the tariff.
Click to expand...

First, Im no supporter of tarrifs, which are really just as tax on the consumer, but that said, our trading partners, including our NAFTA have been taking advantage of us for a long time
 
Fenton said:
First, Im no supporter of tarrifs, which are really just as tax on the consumer, but that said, our trading partners, including our NAFTA have been taking advantage of us for a long time
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Yes, in Canada there is a secret palace filled with money Canada stole from America through bad trade deals and there is a evil factory in Burlington Ontario that is designed to steal American jobs and is powered by burning American flags! Canada's evil oozes over the US like maple syrup!
 
Fenton said:
First, Im no supporter of tarrifs, which are really just as tax on the consumer, but that said, our trading partners, including our NAFTA have been taking advantage of us for a long time
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Says a fella from the country that stole a large portion of Mexico's land.

You just can't find this kind of stunning hypocrisy anywhere else in the world.
 
cuban smokes said:
Wilber Ross was on one of the Sunday news shows yesterday morning; he made it sound like the economic impact of the tariffs here in the US would very small so, then why even bother with the tariffs?

To me it sounds like a just another case of the school yard bully saying, "look what I did; I poked my finger in a hornet's nest. Oh ****, that stings."
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He discussed this all through his campaign, why is everyone surprised that he's implementing this? He told everyone what he'd do.
 
camlok said:
Says a fella from the country that stole a large portion of Mexico's land.

You just can't find this kind of stunning hypocrisy anywhere else in the world.
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You haven't got the slightest clue what you're talking about.
 
You raise some interesting points that I find I simultaneously agree and disagree with.

Mr. Trumps "protectionist/defensive" trade measures will:

  1. help the US because American industry compete domestically;
  2. hurt the US because American industry will not have access to the resources which the US does not possess in sufficient quantities to enable it to operate at a level which will allow it to supply all of America's needs;
  3. help the rest of the world because the rest of the world will have to increase the quantity and quality of its own industrial infrastructure; and
  4. hurt the rest of the world because the rest of the world will be deprived of the American market.

However, the rest of the world (around 95% of the world's population) does not require the United States of America for its economic well being because the rest of the world does have access to the resources which it needs (and in sufficient quantities) to enable it to operate at a level which will allow it to supply all of the rest of the world's needs.

On balance, it would appear that (in the long-run) Mr. Trumps "protectionist/defensive" trade measures are more likely than not to benefit the rest of the world more than they are going to benefit the United States of America even though (in the short-run) the dislocation of the rest of the world's economies MIGHT benefit the US more than they are going to benefit the rest of the world.

The two countries which Mr. Trumps "protectionist/defensive" trade measures would appear to most adversely affect (in the short-run) are Canada and Mexico - both of which have already signed on to the (new and improved) TPP - which China may well sign on to. Additionally, Canada already has "free trade" agreements with the EU and the UK.

Who knows, there is always the possibility that the Russians might see some advantage (for Russia) in making commercial overtures to Canada in a bid to absorb a goodly portion of the Canada/US trade (even if Russia does so at a [short-term] loss).

The postulate that "American will be 'Energy Independent' because the US will always have unrestricted access to Canadian petroleum products." might not be as true as some Americans think - especially if the Canadians get upset over the fact that a major portion of the funding for the "anti-pipeline" groups in Canada is coming from people with a LARGE vested interest in the American petroleum industry and who want to see the US being able to purchase Canadian petroleum products at well below world prices.

PS - The odds on seeing any campaign to stop Canadian Oil Dumping" gaining any traction in the US are slightly lower than the odds on me being elected "God/King of the Universe".
 
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