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Why are African-Americans so much poorer than whites

Crap, I took too long to add the poll options. These were the ones I used:

Mostly or entirely racism and discrimination
Mostly or entirely lack of class mobility for all poor people
Mostly or entirely cultural differences
Mostly or entirely genetics

Multiple causes, racism and discrimination is top one
Multiple causes, lack of class mobility for all races is the top one
Multiple causes, cultural differences are the top one
Multiple causes, genetics is the top one

I don't know
Other (Explain)
 
I think cultural Differences is the most responsible of the gap TODAY.

Does not mean that other factors are not in play.I certainly do believe that a solid 5% of dis-proportionality in success is due to racism... and you can make an argument that the negative impacting cultural differences that have arisen is a result of past racism and history... and I would probably agree 100%... still doesn't take away from the fact it is the culture that is the problem.

I would give it a 10% of difficulty of class mobility... but i think that is largely a product of culture, there are ethnic groups in the united states with cultures that have had a high rate of social mobility.

I think there is an argument for genetics being a factor. (And I am including a disclosure: Just because there seems to be differences is averages in ANY traits height, weight, speed, IQ, disease vulnerability, food allergies, etc. between groups of humans, like classifications such as race...does not mean that this fact should be an excuse to discriminate, because these traits are largely bell curves with a lot of overlap, and are no means to judge an individual based on race; that would be extremely discriminatory and unethical). Though how much of a factor is largely unknown and highly controversial. Inheritance of IQ, according to scientists, is around 60% nature 40% nurture... though even this is argued to being more like 40/60 instead of 60/40.... regardless, IQ, which a attribute which has the highest correlation with success in America. And African Americans tend to have around a full standard deviation below the mean in average IQ. WHY? we don't entirely know, a significant amount of people believe it's because of bias in IQ tests, or that it's largely because of the Nurture and conditions the average black family is in... though studies have shown IQ is significantly inheritable.
And to those that think IQ is bogus...well, like I said before, there is no other trait that is more highly correlated with success, and these tests have been refined in the top universities for a hundred years to reduce as much bias as possible even testing children and extremely young ages.... so it's certainly measuring something. The second highest trait that is correlated with success is Conscientiousness... which thankfully can be a learned behavior that anyone can have.... and that means anyone can be successful!!!

So if I were to put it all together on what my opinion is, I would say... the reason why the african american population has a statistically lower rates of success.
80-85% Culture(Like I said before, a culture that has been bred out of racism... and in a way was caused by it)
5% racism
10% Difficulty of social mobility
0-5% Genetics
 
More black families that have no father figure. Black women who have numerous children by numerous fathers.
 
AtlantaAdonis said:
A damning chart about the black-white wealth gap.

Pretty shameful wealth gap, here.

Just wanted to get a DP barometer on what people feel about this. The poll is anonymous, since I know some racists might be too afraid to give their opinion.
Click to expand...

It became a crisis when Prez Johnson started his "war on poverty". The goals were noble, but it resulted in kicking the men out of the family leading to the destruction of much of the black race in America. Basically you could not get welfare if there was a man in the house. I get it. But it's not the right approach.

Kids who grow up without good adult father figures have a difficult time. But even so, the middle class black account for ~ 47% of blacks in the USA. And I expect it to climb as illegal immigration is slowed, and the economy picks up.

And for the rest, I don't know how to put Humpty Dumpty back together again. But the best idea I can come up with is to get them in the workforce and stop hiring non-citizens unless there is no one else.

BTW, that poll is really anonymous!
 
AtlantaAdonis said:
A damning chart about the black-white wealth gap.

Pretty shameful wealth gap, here.

Just wanted to get a DP barometer on what people feel about this. The poll is anonymous, since I know some racists might be too afraid to give their opinion.
Click to expand...

Since no one started out on a level playing field it is a pretty impossible question to answer. You could analyze all sorts of things if you really wanted to. Society will never be the same for everyone. It never has been and never will. That doesn't mean we shouldn't try but a Utopian society has never existed and never will. We will never get to the point where absolutely everyone is equal in everything.
 
AtlantaAdonis said:
Crap, I took too long to add the poll options. These were the ones I used:

Mostly or entirely racism and discrimination
Mostly or entirely lack of class mobility for all poor people
Mostly or entirely cultural differences
Mostly or entirely genetics

Multiple causes, racism and discrimination is top one
Multiple causes, lack of class mobility for all races is the top one
Multiple causes, cultural differences are the top one
Multiple causes, genetics is the top one

I don't know
Other (Explain)
Click to expand...

And to add:

Wealth is accumulated over time. Lower income people rent so they don't see the increased equity of home owners. To buy you need certain levels of income.

In a nutshell, you can't accumulate wealth with just a middle class income. You get married have two incomes, buy a house, have a job that lets you add to a 410 retirement, etc. Then when you croak, you have an estate to pass down to your kids that they can use for a down payment on a home. (hopefully not a Corvette and a couple of hookers!)

RE: poll.

After the school of thread crap fish arrive and hyjack the thread, abandon it and start over. ;)
 
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AtlantaAdonis said:
Crap, I took too long to add the poll options. These were the ones I used:

Mostly or entirely racism and discrimination
Mostly or entirely lack of class mobility for all poor people
Mostly or entirely cultural differences
Mostly or entirely genetics

Multiple causes, racism and discrimination is top one
Multiple causes, lack of class mobility for all races is the top one
Multiple causes, cultural differences are the top one
Multiple causes, genetics is the top one

I don't know
Other (Explain)
Click to expand...


Get mod help. You've been here long enough to know!
 
celticwar17 said:
I think cultural Differences is the most responsible of the gap TODAY.

Does not mean that other factors are not in play.I certainly do believe that a solid 5% of dis-proportionality in success is due to racism... and you can make an argument that the negative impacting cultural differences that have arisen is a result of past racism and history... and I would probably agree 100%... still doesn't take away from the fact it is the culture that is the problem.

I would give it a 10% of difficulty of class mobility... but i think that is largely a product of culture, there are ethnic groups in the united states with cultures that have had a high rate of social mobility.

I think there is an argument for genetics being a factor. (And I am including a disclosure: Just because there seems to be differences is averages in ANY traits height, weight, speed, IQ, disease vulnerability, food allergies, etc. between groups of humans, like classifications such as race...does not mean that this fact should be an excuse to discriminate, because these traits are largely bell curves with a lot of overlap, and are no means to judge an individual based on race; that would be extremely discriminatory and unethical). Though how much of a factor is largely unknown and highly controversial. Inheritance of IQ, according to scientists, is around 60% nature 40% nurture... though even this is argued to being more like 40/60 instead of 60/40.... regardless, IQ, which a attribute which has the highest correlation with success in America. And African Americans tend to have around a full standard deviation below the mean in average IQ. WHY? we don't entirely know, a significant amount of people believe it's because of bias in IQ tests, or that it's largely because of the Nurture and conditions the average black family is in... though studies have shown IQ is significantly inheritable.
And to those that think IQ is bogus...well, like I said before, there is no other trait that is more highly correlated with success, and these tests have been refined in the top universities for a hundred years to reduce as much bias as possible even testing children and extremely young ages.... so it's certainly measuring something. The second highest trait that is correlated with success is Conscientiousness... which thankfully can be a learned behavior that anyone can have.... and that means anyone can be successful!!!

So if I were to put it all together on what my opinion is, I would say... the reason why the african american population has a statistically lower rates of success.
80-85% Culture(Like I said before, a culture that has been bred out of racism... and in a way was caused by it)
5% racism
10% Difficulty of social mobility
0-5% Genetics
Click to expand...

Bottom line is 85-90% is due to racism (from your own words).
 
American said:
Bottom line is 85-90% is due to racism (from your own words).
Click to expand...

In a way... right. Though I separated the cause on purpose... What is Currently holding African American people back is not racism... but it's thier own culture that has arisen largely because of past racism.

The distinction matters because if you are trying to ponder solutions to the issue.... it's good to know the actually current problem that can be changed... because one cannot change the past, you can only improve upon what is causing the present.
 
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AtlantaAdonis said:
Crap, I took too long to add the poll options. These were the ones I used:

Mostly or entirely racism and discrimination
Mostly or entirely lack of class mobility for all poor people
Mostly or entirely cultural differences
Mostly or entirely genetics

Multiple causes, racism and discrimination is top one
Multiple causes, lack of class mobility for all races is the top one
Multiple causes, cultural differences are the top one
Multiple causes, genetics is the top one

I don't know
Other (Explain)
Click to expand...

"other". Poverty knows no color.
 
A history of racism, discrimination, enslavement (yes, even after slavery was abolished with the 13th amendment) by the prison industrial complex, a way for the racists to keep black people down after slavery ended, trump up bogus charges, throw the book at them, and give then no rehabilitation. And there really is no "American Dream" anymore, if you are born poor its far more likely you will grow up to be poor. Even worse today as there are less and less good paying jobs and so much of the population thinks people working full time should be making under the poverty amount. Basically, systemic racism. Poor areas have little to no education funding and their schools are bad and kids never stand a chance

Amongst other factors
 
celticwar17 said:
In a way... right. Though I separated the cause on purpose... What is Currently holding African American people back is not racism... but it's thier own culture that has arisen largely because of past racism.

The distinction matters because if you are trying to ponder solutions to the issue.... it's good to know the actually current problem that can be changed... because one cannot change the past, you can only improve upon what is causing the present.
Click to expand...

The problem with that is that they are not looking for solutions, or they'd have done so already. It's the blame-game victim complex that matters. There 85-90% racism feeds this narrative perfectly.
 
There are several reasons and many apply to all races.

Single motherhood
Inequity of education
Victimhood mentality
Racism
War on drugs applied disproportionately
Culture

I believe a few steps that would help would be:

Untie education to residence so that a poor family isn't tied to the worst school districts.

End the war on drugs.

Teach people that as long as they wait till marriage before having kids, graduate high school, and get a job they will escape poverty. Simply following those steps give you a 98% chance of reaching the middle class.

Also due to racism, you are setting your children back simply by naming them in certain ways. It is sad that society is that petty but there isn't much that can be done about it. --Not entirely sure if this is even racism at work, it would likely apply to a white couple if they named their kids moonbat or something outside of norm.

There are more ways but those are some simple steps that that can be taken and have a dramatic impact while working on the rest.
 
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It's the blacks that ancestries go back over hundreds of years that I feel for. Every 7-11 & most Dunkin Donuts franchises &
nearly every gas station owner around hear are not owned by whites but by recent immigrants. Why wasn't something done by
the government to help blacks into these type franchises which provide substantial incomes.
 
As soon as someone tells me why an immigrant from wherever can own a store, work 80+ hours each week, never take a break, not complain and have a house with his kids going to private school and Americans from anywhere are content to not work or work 40 hr work weeks and bitch they have nothing.

You have to sacrifice to make it if you have nothing, once you establish yourself, you can then relax a bit and work smart instead of hard.

I started out with nothing, dad was a janitor, mom stocked shelves at the equivalent of todays WalMart. I've been working since I was 11, started my first real business at 20 and for 16 years busted my butt, now I can relax and work smart.

That's one way of getting it done, willing to work immigrants seem to get the picture.
 
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