View Poll Results: Are you tired of the constant state of war?

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  • Yes, I am

    23 76.67%
  • No, I'm not

    4 13.33%
  • Other (please explain)

    3 10.00%
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Thread: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

  1. #21
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogue Valley View Post
    The Russian vote in Crimea was held under Russian military occupation.



    Armed and masked Russian soldiers surrounding the parliament building in Crimea
    And the Crimeans' democratic vote should still be upheld. I don't think there's any proof of foul play in the vote.

    Edit: Could you please explain how this relates to the topic at hand?

  2. #22
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lurker View Post
    There's nothing showing that Putin has personally had somebody killed or poisoned. As for Russia, the Ukrainian government fell to a coup and thus, the current government isn't legitimate. But that said, Russia doesn't have the right to invade anybody. Even so, Crimea's vote should still be respected.

    Please, could you address the topic of the thread?
    Sure, 95% of Crimea wanted to reunite with Russia...after Russia used military means to annex it over two weeks earlier. Odd, that. You'd think that a country with a 95% pro-Russian majority would want to "reunite" before Russia resorted to military means. Why didn't they just send an evite instead?

    10 critics of Vladimir Putin who wound up dead

    10 critics of Vladimir Putin who wound up dead - Chicago Tribune
    https://www.cnn.com/2015/03/03/europ...ics/index.html
    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/21/w...cs-poison.html

    Be sure to take a tour of the Hermitage for me.

  3. #23
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Sure, 95% of Crimea wanted to reunite with Russia...after Russia used military means to annex it over two weeks earlier. Odd, that. You'd think that a country with a 95% majority would want to "reunite" before Russia resorted to military means. Why didn't they just send an evite instead?

    10 critics of Vladimir Putin who wound up dead

    10 critics of Vladimir Putin who wound up dead - Chicago Tribune
    https://www.cnn.com/2015/03/03/europ...ics/index.html

    Be sure to take a tour of the Hermitage for me.
    There is no proof that Vladimir Putin had a hand in those murders. I'm sure there are many people dying in Russia as we speak, just like there are many people dying in the United States. And as for Crimea, given the overwhelming vote to remain in Russia, I think that should be respected. Regardless, the presence of Russian Federation troops does not invalidate the vote.

  4. #24
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lurker View Post
    And the Crimeans' democratic vote should still be upheld. I don't think there's any proof of foul play in the vote.

    Edit: Could you please explain how this relates to the topic at hand?
    Nobody but the Kremlin recognizes the legitimacy of that vote. See, here's the problem with autocrats: they tend to be highly narcissistic, and can't bear the perception of opposition even where it provides the imprimatur of legitimacy. That's why every dictator in every "election" wins with about 100% of the vote. Their ego just won't allow them to go with ~65% of the vote.
    Last edited by Cardinal; 12-31-17 at 05:19 PM.

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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Sure, 95% of Crimea wanted to reunite with Russia...after Russia used military means to annex it over two weeks earlier. Odd, that. You'd think that a country with a 95% pro-Russian majority would want to "reunite" before Russia resorted to military means. Why didn't they just send an evite instead?

    10 critics of Vladimir Putin who wound up dead

    10 critics of Vladimir Putin who wound up dead - Chicago Tribune
    https://www.cnn.com/2015/03/03/europ...ics/index.html
    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/21/w...cs-poison.html

    Be sure to take a tour of the Hermitage for me.
    Cardinal, I think we're getting side-tracked. Please address the topic at hand. I'm eager to hear your thoughts on this.

  6. #26
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Nobody but the Kremlin recognizes the legitimacy of that vote. See, here's the problem with autocrats: they tend to be highly narcissistic, and can't bear the perception of opposition even where it provide the imprimatur of legitimacy. That's why every dictator in every "election" wins with about 100% of the vote. Their ego just won't allow them to go with ~65% of the vote.
    It doesn't matter who or who doesn't recognize the vote. There's nothing showing that the vote was illegitimate. And there's no proof that Putin is an autocrat.

    Edit: Could you please address the topic now?

  7. #27
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Yes, a bit I'll admit.

  8. #28
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lurker View Post
    There is no proof that Vladimir Putin had a hand in those murders. I'm sure there are many people dying in Russia as we speak, just like there are many people dying in the United States. And as for Crimea, given the overwhelming vote to remain in Russia, I think that should be respected. Regardless, the presence of Russian Federation troops does not invalidate the vote.
    You're speaking from your experience of living with 24/7 propaganda in Russia. In America, critics of the President don't spontaneously end up dead or in prison. Oh, I'm sure you'll find some examples because, as you say, people die. But the frequency with which this happens in dictatorships is on quite another level.

  9. #29
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lurker View Post
    And the Crimeans' democratic vote should still be upheld. I don't think there's any proof of foul play in the vote.
    Did you forget? I've lived in Ukraine. The 'referendum' was printed in three languages. Russian, Ukrainian, and Tatar.

    The 'referendum' contained two choices. They both led to the same outcome (annexation). All that changed was the process/timescale.


    Every age has its own Fascism -- PRIMO LEVI

  10. #30
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    Re: Are you tired of the perpetual state of war the US is in?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    You're speaking from your experience of living with 24/7 propaganda in Russia. In America, critics of the President don't spontaneously end up dead or in prison. Oh, I'm sure you'll find some examples because, as you say, people die. But the frequency with which this happens in dictatorships is on quite another level.
    I don't live in Russia.

    And there is nothing showing that Putin ordered people to be killed. And neither is Russia a dictatorship.

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