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Does being well educated make you more or less likely to recognize bull****?

Does being educated make you more or less likely to recognize BS?

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    Votes: 45 80.4%

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MrWonka

MrWonka

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Education, Not Income, Predicted Who Would Vote For Trump | FiveThirtyEight

Does being well educated make you more or less likely to fall for bull****? Turns out Clinton actually improved the margin of victory over Obama in the most highly educated counties in the country whereas she lost votes in the less educated counties.

Donald Trump has a 32% approval rating much of which comes from racists, religious zealots, and the type of people that will vote almost exclusively to prevent any form of gun control to the point where they would vote for a pedephile in order to insure they don't have to wait 5 days to buy a gun.

I was told by a Trump supporter that with all the negative information being spread about Trump it shouldn't be a surprise that only 32% of Americans support him. As if it is just lie after lie after bull**** lie that's being told about him which makes foolish people assume he must be bad. How is this possible when the people most likely to support him are the least educated?

How is it possible that people who've actually taken classes in statistics are susceptible to people lying with statistics? How is it possible that people who've actually taken a critical thinking course could be worse at critical thinking?

Religion is drilled into your head by your parents from the time you are a child. Liberal College professors don't get access to you until you're at least 18 years old and have already formed a great many of your beliefs and opinions about the world. How is that they're so successful at brainwashing that they can overcome your parents and the church you've been attending since you were in diapers?

What makes journalists so different from the rest of Americans that they'd be willing to outright lie in order to hurt a leader who is Making America Great? Why don't they want America to be Great? Aren't most journalists White people? Aren't most of them men? Aren't most of them Christians just like the rest of us? The have families don't they? They pay taxes just like the rest of us right? Don't they have to pay for health insurance as well as the rest of us?

Can a country actually be Great if only 32% of the people living in it like the "improvements?"
 
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Often being educated in the arts makes you far more likely to accept gloss for substance since that it all you have learnt.

If you have a practicle science or engineering education then the trait is reversed.

The exceptions to this seem to be doctors(medics) and computer scientists. They seem to have learnt by rote and follow which ever side sounds best.

In my experience.
 
I think it depends...

If you are in college for something that requires critical thinking, like Math, Chemistry, Biology, Physics, Computer Science, etc....yes.


Humanities?.... hell no... you come out of college more ignorant than you went in.
 
celticwar17 said:
I think it depends...

If you are in college for something that requires critical thinking, like Math, Chemistry, Biology, Physics, Computer Science, etc....yes.


Humanities?.... hell no... you come out of college more ignorant than you went in.
Click to expand...

You still have to take classes like Math, Bio, etc, if you major in Humanities. No colleges want to turn out graduates who don't understand basic math or science.
 
The better educated you are, the likelier you are to be exposed to (and practice) critical thinking.

And to be exposed to a wider variety of views and information in general, to produce a broader perspective instead of a narrow one. This provides a better foundation for rationally and more objectively evaluating things.
 
Superfly said:
You still have to take classes like Math, Bio, etc, if you major in Humanities. No colleges want to turn out graduates who don't understand basic math or science.
Click to expand...

I would disagree with you... basic algebra and bio classes requires three brain cells... precisely lol. And most people, all they do is memorize things to pass, they have no actual understanding of the material. I actually hesitate to put bio on the list... there is a lot of raw mindless memorization going on in that profession.
 
Tim the plumber said:
Often being educated in the arts makes you far more likely to accept gloss for substance since that it all you have learnt.
Click to expand...

*learned.

Do liberal arts colleges not have Math and Statistics classes? Is philosophy an art? A four-year degree generally requires you to take gen eds which would require you to learn something other than painting don't you think?

Tim the plumber said:
If you have a practicle science or engineering education then the trait is reversed.

The exceptions to this seem to be doctors(medics) and computer scientists.
Click to expand...

You do understand that Computer Scientists do basically nothing but logic all day long right?
 
celticwar17 said:
I would disagree with you... basic algebra and bio classes requires three brain cells... precisely lol. And most people, all they do is memorize things to pass,
Click to expand...

How do you memorize the answer to a math or algebra question you've never even seen?
 
MrWonka said:
Education, Not Income, Predicted Who Would Vote For Trump | FiveThirtyEight

Does being well educated make you more or less likely to fall for bull****? Turns out Clinton actually improved the margin of victory over Obama in the most highly educated counties in the country whereas she lost votes in the less educated counties.

Donald Trump has a 32% approval rating much of which comes from racists, religious zealots, and the type of people that will vote almost exclusively to prevent any form of gun control to the point where they would vote for a pedephile in order to insure they don't have to wait 5 days to buy a gun.

I was told by a Trump supporter that with all the negative information being spread about Trump it shouldn't be a surprise that only 32% of Americans support him. As if it is just lie after lie after bull**** lie that's being told about him which makes foolish people assume he must be bad. How is this possible when the people most likely to support him are the least educated?

How is it possible that people who've actually taken classes in statistics are susceptible to people lying with statistics? How is it possible that people who've actually taken a critical thinking course could be worse at critical thinking?

Religion is drilled into your head by your parents from the time you are a child. Liberal College professors don't get access to you until you're at least 18 years old and have already formed a great many of your beliefs and opinions about the world. How is that they're so successful at brainwashing that they can overcome your parents and the church you've been attending since you were in diapers?

What makes journalists so different from the rest of Americans that they'd be willing to outright lie in order to hurt a leader who is Making America Great? Why don't they want America to be Great? Aren't most journalists White people? Aren't most of them men? Aren't most of them Christians just like the rest of us? The have families don't they? They pay taxes just like the rest of us right? Don't they have to pay for health insurance as well as the rest of us?

Can a country actually be Great if only 32% of the people living in it like the "improvements?"
Click to expand...

Well, for the question in the title, getting an education certainly makes us better at critical thinking, meaning that we can apply skepticism/uncertainty in a more structured/consistent fashion.

But it also makes us more confident, which is not always justified. For example, college educated right wingers are even more likely to deny global warming. This is because a college degree doesn't actually guarantee coverage of that issue, but it does give confidence.

Those 32% of people actually want the improvements of a healthy, prosperous society; they're just brainwashed to be scared of the people fighting for those things.
 
MrWonka said:
*learned.

Do liberal arts colleges not have Math and Statistics classes? Is philosophy an art? A four-year degree generally requires you to take gen eds which would require you to learn something other than painting don't you think?
Click to expand...

Yes, they do. I am finishing up my undergrad and I have taken many, many classes that have absolutely nothing to do with my major, and everything to do with basic critical thinking skills.
 
celticwar17 said:
I would disagree with you... basic algebra and bio classes requires three brain cells... precisely lol. And most people, all they do is memorize things to pass, they have no actual understanding of the material. I actually hesitate to put bio on the list... there is a lot of raw mindless memorization going on in that profession.
Click to expand...

Your opinion, and one that I disagree with. You have to have a basic understanding of anything to be able to pass the class. Granted, if you don't use math, for the most part, you lose it, but other classes like science, history, etc - you need those if you want a degree. If you don't want to bother with them, don't take them and don't expect a degree. If you want just the skills that you need, find a technical college and get your education there.
 
LOL, asking the uneducated to give their educated-guess about sociological phenomenon.

Computer scientists don't problem solve!
Humanities require no critical thinking!

Funny if it wasn't so depressing.
 
IDK, some extremely educated people have no good sense, and that effects beliefs. I've been told my husband is brilliant. He is, with numbers, but his people skills are not the best. It's all related.
 
Absentglare said:
But it also makes us more confident, which is not always justified. For example, college-educated right wingers are even more likely to deny global warming. This is because a college degree doesn't actually guarantee coverage of that issue, but it does give confidence.
Click to expand...

I'll grant you that. There are studies which demonstrate that when a well-educated person is wrong about something their ability to come up with all sorts of creative defenses of their foolish belief. It is certainly possible, but I don't think you could make the argument that this type of problem would cause the majority of well educated people to be on the completely wrong side of the debate in the first place.
 
Superfly said:
Your opinion, and one that I disagree with. You have to have a basic understanding of anything to be able to pass the class. Granted, if you don't use math, for the most part, you lose it, but other classes like science, history, etc - you need those if you want a degree. If you don't want to bother with them, don't take them and don't expect a degree. If you want just the skills that you need, find a technical college and get your education there.
Click to expand...

This is not my experience of the generation of today... they have absolute lack of critical thinking skills... just passing a class in basic algebra does very little for your critical thinking skills... all most people do is memorize formulas and try to pass. All most people do today is just memorize and vomit out whatever their professors says...

No idea what age you are, but sometimes you get lucky and find a REAL professor who understands how important critical thinking is and how much students of today lack it.... that kind of professor changes lives. But unfortunately, they are the exception rather than the rule.
 
I do not mean to cherry pick here, but "well educated" can mean a lot of things.
I ASSume you mean formal college, but I see it differently.
A "well educated" (through experience) homicide detective is much better at recognizing cow flop talk than a professor of Medieval literature at some insulated university.
A "well educated" (through experience) drug lord can easily tell if someone is shorting his delivery, or someone is skimming off the top.
A "well educated" bookie can easily tell if someone is attempting to skip out on a debt they owe.

So, if you are limiting the discussion to "well educated" to mean someone with a college degree, then I would say NO.
Experience is the best way to filter out cow flop talk.
Academic credentials has little to do with it.
 
MrWonka said:
Education, Not Income, Predicted Who Would Vote For Trump | FiveThirtyEight

Does being well educated make you more or less likely to fall for bull****? Turns out Clinton actually improved the margin of victory over Obama in the most highly educated counties in the country whereas she lost votes in the less educated counties.

Donald Trump has a 32% approval rating much of which comes from racists, religious zealots, and the type of people that will vote almost exclusively to prevent any form of gun control to the point where they would vote for a pedephile in order to insure they don't have to wait 5 days to buy a gun.

I was told by a Trump supporter that with all the negative information being spread about Trump it shouldn't be a surprise that only 32% of Americans support him. As if it is just lie after lie after bull**** lie that's being told about him which makes foolish people assume he must be bad. How is this possible when the people most likely to support him are the least educated?

How is it possible that people who've actually taken classes in statistics are susceptible to people lying with statistics? How is it possible that people who've actually taken a critical thinking course could be worse at critical thinking?

Religion is drilled into your head by your parents from the time you are a child. Liberal College professors don't get access to you until you're at least 18 years old and have already formed a great many of your beliefs and opinions about the world. How is that they're so successful at brainwashing that they can overcome your parents and the church you've been attending since you were in diapers?

What makes journalists so different from the rest of Americans that they'd be willing to outright lie in order to hurt a leader who is Making America Great? Why don't they want America to be Great? Aren't most journalists White people? Aren't most of them men? Aren't most of them Christians just like the rest of us? The have families don't they? They pay taxes just like the rest of us right? Don't they have to pay for health insurance as well as the rest of us?

Can a country actually be Great if only 32% of the people living in it like the "improvements?"
Click to expand...

I thought that this was going to be serious thread and instead it's just another hyperbole laden TDS thread...
 
MrWonka said:
How do you memorize the answer to a math or algebra question you've never even seen?
Click to expand...

Easy... You just memorize a formula and plug in numbers lol... I've taught math classes in college, I know what people do and how much they lack critical thinking skills...

Btw you are talking with a Physics grad student... It's a pretty common conversation amongst professors how face palming entry level students can be.
 
faithful_servant said:
I thought that this was going to be serious thread and instead it's just another hyperbole laden TDS thread...
Click to expand...

Now i am sorry i gave it a serious reply.
Nothing objective or serious about it.
Just another arrogant, " those dumbassed white trash voters" put Trump in the WH thread.
 
It depends on what you're educated in and what your life experience is like. If you're educated in critical thinking, logic and reason, if you've been around for a while and have seen the real world, then yes, you are less likely to fall for scams and the like because you examine everything from a rational point of view. You look for fallacies. It's why there is an inverse correlation between education and religiosity. But if you're some 22 year old liberal dumbass that just got out of college with a gender studies degree and have been swilling the liberal koolaid in college, you're likely to fall for anything that appeals to your liberal indoctrination. And the same is true for people on the far right who have never experienced reality or examine things from a rational perspective.
 
Lursa said:
The better educated you are, the likelier you are to be exposed to (and practice) critical thinking.

And to be exposed to a wider variety of views and information in general, to produce a broader perspective instead of a narrow one. This provides a better foundation for rationally and more objectively evaluating things.
Click to expand...

I absolutely agree with you.
The flaw a lot of people get is they think college is the ONLY source to get an education.
True smart people know your real education begins AFTER college.
...and other educations have nothing to do with college at all.
The environment is a huge factor...ie..a Harvard Law professor would be a complete dumbass on the plains of Mongolia and totally uneducated in how to make a living.
 
celticwar17 said:
This is not my experience of the generation of today... they have absolute lack of critical thinking skills... just passing a class in basic algebra does very little for your critical thinking skills... all most people do is memorize formulas and try to pass. All most people do today is just memorize and vomit out whatever their professors says...

No idea what age you are, but sometimes you get lucky and find a REAL professor who understands how important critical thinking is and how much students of today lack it.... that kind of professor changes lives. But unfortunately, they are the exception rather than the rule.
Click to expand...

Again - I said math is, for the most part, use it or lose it. Algebra does not help unless you use it in every day life, which most people do not. The rest, though - it stays with you. You learn about history, and learn about the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire, and how it changed working conditions for garment workers. You learn bio, and how body functions work. You take labs and remember your experiments. You remember the stories you read in American Lit, and chose favorite writers, which broadened your horizons and took you from reading Stephen King or Danielle Steel to reading Faulkner, or Hemingway, or Toni Morrison. Math? Maybe not. But the rest of my classes increased my learning base a great deal, and helped me to be able to understand things, and, well.... recognize bull****, which is the reason for the OP.
 
PleasantValley said:
I do not mean to cherry pick here, but "well educated" can mean a lot of things.
I ASSume you mean formal college, but I see it differently.
A "well educated" (through experience) homicide detective is much better at recognizing cow flop talk than a professor of Medieval literature at some insulated university.
A "well educated" (through experience) drug lord can easily tell if someone is shorting his delivery, or someone is skimming off the top.
A "well educated" bookie can easily tell if someone is attempting to skip out on a debt they owe.

So, if you are limiting the discussion to "well educated" to mean someone with a college degree, then I would say NO.
Experience is the best way to filter out cow flop talk.
Academic credentials has little to do with it.
Click to expand...

I was going to make that point myself the point about experience myself. As an aside I worked for several years with an HR rep in my company who was a retired NYPD homicide detective. He was far and away the keenest student of human nature I have ever met. Watching him just chat with people and pull all kinds of information out of them was an education every time. I came to trust his opinion of candidates implicitly.

That said a college education should give you the tools necessary to begin to separate the substance from bull****. You can pick up those tools, like critical thinking skills, on your own but my experience has been that many - though certainly not all - people who don't pursue higher education don't bother to for one reason or another.
 
celticwar17 said:
Btw you are talking with a Physics grad student... It's a pretty common conversation amongst professors how face palming entry level students can be.
Click to expand...

Entry level students are usually fresh out of high school, and college is a whole different animal. My daughter is just now finishing up her first term in college, and it kicked her ass. She is smart, too. Took honors classes in high school, always made good grades. College is different though, and new students should be given the benefit of the doubt, instead of instructors and TAs face palming over new students because they are not as smart as you think they should be.
 
Cephus said:
It depends on what you're educated in and what your life experience is like. If you're educated in critical thinking, logic and reason, if you've been around for a while and have seen the real world, then yes, you are less likely to fall for scams and the like because you examine everything from a rational point of view. You look for fallacies. It's why there is an inverse correlation between education and religiosity. But if you're some 22 year old liberal dumbass that just got out of college with a gender studies degree and have been swilling the liberal koolaid in college, you're likely to fall for anything that appeals to your liberal indoctrination. And the same is true for people on the far right who have never experienced reality or examine things from a rational perspective.
Click to expand...

The right leaning people tend to fall for anything with..."Hello, Patriots"!, or....Are YOU a PATRIOT? Then send me money.
I can't give an example for a lefty. I am not that immersed in their though processes.
 
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